{"@context":"http://iiif.io/api/presentation/3/context.json","id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/iiif/416sx6556b/manifest","type":"Manifest","label":{"en":["1974-07-11: Open Secret: Psychology East and West"]},"logo":"https://d9jk7wjtjpu5g.cloudfront.net/organizations/logo_images/000/000/209/original/cti-library-logo-blue-text.png?1672724952","metadata":[{"label":{"en":["Date"]},"value":{"en":["1974-07-11"]}},{"label":{"en":["Format"]},"value":{"en":["Video"]}},{"label":{"en":["Location"]},"value":{"en":["Boulder, Colorado, USA"]}},{"label":{"en":["Event Type"]},"value":{"en":["Panel Discussion"]}},{"label":{"en":["Seminar or Series Title"]},"value":{"en":["\u003ca href=\"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/playlists/246/show\"\u003eNaropa Institute: Open Secret Interviews\u003c/a\u003e"]}},{"label":{"en":["Talk Title"]},"value":{"en":["Psychology East and West"]}},{"label":{"en":["Theme"]},"value":{"en":["Psychology and Psychotherapy"]}},{"label":{"en":["Summary"]},"value":{"en":["A live panel on psychotherapy and spirituality from Eastern and Western perspectives. Participants were Trungpa Rinpoche; Ram Dass, then teaching a class on the Bhagavad Gita at Naropa; other faculty members Jim Green and John Baker; moderator Duncan Campbell.  Questions discussed, in somewhat freewheeling style, include limitations of existing approaches to psychotherapy; challenges of inhabiting the role of therapist; whether a model exists that goes beyond ego-oriented approaches to therapy.  Spirituality subjects include the need for tradition and lineage, approaches to the teacher or guru, and differences between the roles of therapist and spiritual teacher. A key point raised by Trungpa Rinpoche was that from its inception Buddhism went beyond categories of East or West, and was psychologically rather than culturally oriented. The Buddha pointed out the universal existence of \"duhkha\" or suffering; the possibility of egolessness; and showed the path from samsara to nirvana. Highlights include the lively, sometimes heated discussions between Ram Dass and Trungpa Rinpoche."]}},{"label":{"en":["Publication"]},"value":{"en":["UNPUBLISHED"]}},{"label":{"en":["Transcription Credits"]},"value":{"en":["Jul 17 2021 to Dec 28 2021 Transcribing: Ella Milligan Checking: Al SanValentin Final Proof: Anne Seidlitz Other Contributors: Lynn Friedman, Warner Dick"]}},{"label":{"en":["Rights Statement"]},"value":{"en":["© Diana J. Mukpo - All rights reserved. Not to be Distributed or Reproduced."]}},{"label":{"en":["Year"]},"value":{"en":["1974"]}}],"summary":{"en":["A live panel on psychotherapy and spirituality from Eastern and Western perspectives. Participants were Trungpa Rinpoche; Ram Dass, then teaching a class on the Bhagavad Gita at Naropa; other faculty members Jim Green and John Baker; moderator Duncan Campbell.  Questions discussed, in somewhat freewheeling style, include limitations of existing approaches to psychotherapy; challenges of inhabiting the role of therapist; whether a model exists that goes beyond ego-oriented approaches to therapy.  Spirituality subjects include the need for tradition and lineage, approaches to the teacher or guru, and differences between the roles of therapist and spiritual teacher. A key point raised by Trungpa Rinpoche was that from its inception Buddhism went beyond categories of East or West, and was psychologically rather than culturally oriented. The Buddha pointed out the universal existence of \"duhkha\" or suffering; the possibility of egolessness; and showed the path from samsara to nirvana. Highlights include the lively, sometimes heated discussions between Ram Dass and Trungpa Rinpoche."]},"requiredStatement":{"label":{"en":["Attribution"]},"value":{"en":["© Diana J. Mukpo - All rights reserved. Not to be Distributed or Reproduced."]}},"provider":[{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/aboutus","type":"Agent","label":{"en":["Chogyam Trungpa Digital Library"]},"homepage":[{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/","type":"Text","label":{"en":["Chogyam Trungpa Digital Library"]},"format":"text/html"}],"logo":[{"id":"https://d9jk7wjtjpu5g.cloudfront.net/organizations/logo_images/000/000/209/original/cti-library-logo-blue-text.png?1672724952","type":"Image"}]}],"thumbnail":[{"id":"https://d9jk7wjtjpu5g.cloudfront.net/collection_resource_files/thumbnails/000/167/227/small/19740711VCTR1-Video-Prod-CTIRmstrSD-Access.mp4_1663700656.jpg?1663700657","type":"Image","format":"image/jpeg"}],"items":[{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227","type":"Canvas","label":{"en":["Media File 1 of 1 - 19740711VCTR1-Video-Prod-CTIRmstrSD-Access.mp4"]},"duration":6889.92,"width":640,"height":360,"thumbnail":[{"id":"https://d9jk7wjtjpu5g.cloudfront.net/collection_resource_files/thumbnails/000/167/227/small/19740711VCTR1-Video-Prod-CTIRmstrSD-Access.mp4_1663700656.jpg?1663700657","type":"Image","format":"image/jpeg"}],"items":[{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/content/1","type":"AnnotationPage","items":[{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/content/1/annotation/1","type":"Annotation","motivation":"painting","body":{"id":"https://aviary-p-cti.s3.wasabisys.com/collection_resource_files/resource_files/000/167/227/original/19740711VCTR1-Video-Prod-CTIRmstrSD-Access.mp4?1663700615","type":"Video","format":"video/mp4","duration":6889.92,"width":640,"height":360},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227","metadata":[]}]}],"annotations":[{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381","type":"AnnotationPage","label":{"en":["19740711VCTR1-Transcript [Transcript]"]},"items":[{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/1","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"[19740711VCTR1 - Open Secret - Psychology East and West]\r\n\r\n\r\n[Chogyam Trungpa Institute - Unedited Verbatim Transcript]\r\n\r\n\r\n[Copyright Diana J. Mukpo All Rights Reserved - Not to be Distributed or Reproduced]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=0.0,23.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/2","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"[BOOKMARK: INTRODUCTION]\r\n\r\n\r\n[Audience laughter; Trungpa Rinpoche and Ram Dass converse off-mic]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=23.0,72.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/3","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"DUNCAN CAMPBELL: Welcome to Open Secret, [laughter] a series of radio and television discussions that are being filmed and recorded this summer in Boulder,Colorado at Naropa Institute.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=72.0,85.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/4","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Naropa Institute was founded by Chogyam Trungpa Rinpoche, to create a ground in which the Western academic and artistic and religious traditions could interact with those of the East. This evening we are discussing the general topic of psychology East and West. We have with us an audience of over a thousand people who have been drawn primarily from the courses at Naropa Institute which have been taught by Chogyam Trungpa Rinpoche and Ram Dass. And before proceeding into the discussion itself I would like to introduce the people with us. We have Jim Green, Chogyam Trungpa Rinpoche, Ram Dass --formerly Richard Alpert [laughter] -- and John Baker. [Applause] It is open secret, that's true! [Laughs; laughter]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=85.0,163.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/5","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"All of these people are faculty members at Naropa Institute during this first summer session. Jim Green has taught philosophy at Columbia and Antioch, and for the last five years has been doing psychotherapy in Berkeley. And he's teaching courses at Naropa on philosophy and psychology. Chogyam Trungpa Rinpoche, the president of Naropa Institute, is teaching a course on basic Buddhist meditation, and on the Tibetan Buddhist path. Ram Dass is teaching a course on the yogas of the Bhagavad Gita. John Baker, the vice-president of Naropa Institute, is teaching courses with Reginald Ray on the tantric mahasiddhas and saints, and on Buddhism in India, and is in the process of writing a book on Buddhist psychology.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=163.0,212.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/6","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Now it seems to me that perhaps one way to start this would be in terms of the notion of ego. That if we talk about the Western philosophical or psychological approach--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=212.0,225.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/7","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Who are you?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=225.0,237.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/8","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"DUNCAN CAMPBELL: My name is Duncan Campbell, I forgot that.[Laughter] I'm the moderator. We're talking about ego. [Laughter; applause]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=237.0,259.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/9","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"[BOOKMARK: PART 1]\r\n\r\n\r\nDUNCAN CAMPBELL: Okay, now that I've remembered who I am [laughs; laughter], I'd like to put the question to the general discussion, as to the different ways in which the Western psychiatric tradition and the religious and psychological traditions of the East approach this notion of ego, or personal identification. And what the differences might be, and what each of the two traditions might have to learn from each other. It would seem that on the members of the panel perhaps Ram Dass would be the best qualified to speak to that. [Laughter]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=259.0,297.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/10","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: Especially since I have two names. [Laughs; laughter]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=297.0,310.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/11","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Well it's been interesting to me over the past twelve years to remember that as a psychologist, child development, a developmental psychologist, one of my major concerns was with theories of the developing ego of the individual, and the development of an ego that has integrity and that is effective in coping with the environment. Working with people at Harvard such as Erik Erikson, and with behaviorists concerned with converting Freud's ideas of the development of identification, the development of personality and personality structure, it seemed at that time as if the ego was a very real, solid, and necessary part of the healthy functioning of an organism. And when I started to work with psychedelics it became... I started to experience something that didn't fit into my theoretical structure of ego. And I began to think maybe we were going to go the other way now; that we were now going to unwind the ego, or get out from under it.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=310.0,400.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/12","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"In Hinduism there is a thing called the ahamkara which is a structure like the ego, and the game is, of awakening, is to transcend that structure. Not to get rid of it because the ego is very functional, but to at least not be attached to it. Seems like a statement for openers.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=400.0,425.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/13","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"[BOOKMARK: PART 2]\r\n\r\n\r\nDUNCAN CAMPBELL: Well in the Buddhist tradition I think the interesting thing is that they start from a concept of no self. That somehow the whole project of involving oneself with the Buddhist meditation practice and with the Buddhist system of thought, is to work from a premise that in fact the ego doesn't exist, that it's not even there; there some concept of emptiness, that is the ultimate reality if we can speak in those terms. And I wondered what the implications of that point of view are for dealing with personality, or neurosis in the life of various individuals.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=425.0,458.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/14","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"JIM GREEN: Well, as a practical matter in my experience as a therapist, what seemed to happen is that I was involved in people-- with people whose life dramas seemed to be more or less unsuccessful. And as a therapist my task was to help them rewrite the script, so that there was a better drama. And to some extent we were successful and the drama was better. But it was never quite satisfactory; there always seemed to be something quite wrong ad infinitum about those dramas. And it seems in some way that the problem was, not that the drama was quite wrong but that there was a drama. In some way it was the energy in the drama which produced the difficulty. And when we worked somehow to make the drama less dramatic, it seemed that a great many problems simply dissolved.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=458.0,508.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/15","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: In doing therapy now over the past ten years I-- it's interesting that as the role of the therapist, the concept of what you do in relation to another person has changed a great deal. Because before it seemed very horizontal: you were substituting one ego structure for another, a more effective one. Now it seems to me you're still doing that, but you're doing it from a place in yourself of not being attached to ego structures, so that at the same moment you're putting one in the place of another, you're not investing it with an emotional attachment, that you would be if you thought you were a therapist. In other words, when people way to me, \"Is therapy still okay within...\" You know I say, \"If Buddha were your therapist you'd get enlightened, you know. But if your therapist thinks he's a therapist watch out.\" You know, it's that place.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=508.0,560.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/16","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"JIM GREEN: We do seem to be engaged though in some process of slowing down the substitution of structures, that is a great deal the interest in the drama is in the kaleidoscopic variety of the structures, both for the therapist and for the therapee. And it seems that we want to try to slow down that process of production of structures a little bit.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=560.0,578.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/17","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: But, Rinpoche said or wrote, that you had to become somebody before you could become nobody. And-- or I think you did, and I don't want to put words in your mouth, [laughs] you can handle yourself. [Laughs; laughter] And it seems to me that's what we end up doing in-- that the psychotherapy domain is at this moment.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=578.0,600.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/18","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"JIM GREEN: I'm not sure that I agree entirely. It seems that one needs not to have a sense of being nobody, but I'm not sure that one needs to have the sense of being \"somebody\" necessarily. But it seems there ought to be a way to avoid that particular route, of-- there ought to be a possibility of moving from feeling like a nobody, which is a very negative state--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=600.0,622.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/19","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: I didn't mean that they would experience being a nobody, they'd just be nobody. [Laughs]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=622.0,626.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/20","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"JIM GREEN: Yeah. Oh, I see, okay. [Laughs; laughter]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=626.0,632.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/21","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"[BOOKMARK: PART 3]\r\n\r\n\r\nDUNCAN CAMPBELL: Well one of the things that's always interested me is that it seems that a lot of people in America are familiar in some general sense with the notion of ego, and certain psychological terminology that we get from Freud or Adler or Jung or whatever, as vehicles to try to deal with our own personality. And the interesting thing about the Eastern traditions is the discovery that in the Eastern religious traditions they are talking about very much the same thing; in fact in some of those traditions they even talk in terms of ego. And so the bridge is actually quite an easy one to make. It's not the matter of trying to absorb something so foreign and exotic that you can't relate with it at all. But in fact, in most cases the attraction seems to be that they are speaking directly to your own struggle to kind of understand your own personal drama and how you can work with it. And in that light it would seem that there might be some real differences between a Western psychology -- which seems to be premised on the notion of building up a strong ego capable of playing the game successfully -- and an Eastern psychology premised on the notion that there *is* no ego, which has the concomitant danger that you could just lapse into some sort of passivity or a state where, you know, your energy was completely inactive. And both of those seem to be cliches. And I thought maybe perhaps in the course of this conversation we could try to clarify some of those popular notions as to what the interplay really was between these Western and Eastern approaches.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=632.0,741.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/22","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I mean for instance, Jim, do you actually think that the Eastern psychological approach *has* a danger of lapsing into passivity? I mean that is the popular notion, and in your experience have you found that, in your own experience with Buddhism for instance?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=741.0,755.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/23","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"JIM GREEN: Well no, no. There is the sense that somehow one's ego is going to be ripped off if one becomes involved with meditation practice or anything of that sort, and one is going to lapse into a sort of helplessness, and that doesn't seem to be entirely a theoretical issue, it seems to be a practical issue, that in the situation of meditation practice, or in the situation in a therapeutic context, in which some space is allowed to emerge within the conflict, within the drama, that typically some energy appears which before wasn't available. So that in fact life begins to enter, where before rigid structures, that rigid structures of the drama and the roles prevented it from entering at all. And in some way the problem seems to arise out of creating theoretical polarities, like the ones you describe, which have the function very well of staving off the actual experience. It seems to reduce the anxiety about having one's ego ripped off and being a helpless body or something of that sort.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=755.0,822.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/24","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"DUNCAN CAMPBELL: What do you mean having one's ego ripped off?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=822.0,825.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/25","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"JIM GREEN: Well there's the sense that somehow Eastern religions or meditation practice are after one, they're after what one considers most valuable, and that one has to sacrifice immediately everything one is, as if somehow everything one is were the enemy initially. So some sense of opposition, between what is-- what one is and what one is required to be, according to these religious teachings. And that doesn't seem to be quite a sound understanding of what we're doing, it's....","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=825.0,853.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/26","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: I think one of the problems that we have to-- misunderstandings that come up, is I think that, speaking from a traditional point of view of Buddhism, that there is big misunderstanding, universally. And both Easterners and Westerners believe in ego. And ego is the subject of discussion, and ego is subject of development, and hope -- the only hope -- and those things been presented. But on the other hand Buddhist point of view is not particularly that of the Eastern point of view, *or* the Western point of view, particularly, but somehow peculiarly Buddhistic, which doesn't belong to a particular category. That Buddha for instance refused to identify himself with the national ego of India, at the time. And he broke through systems, caste systems, all kinds of other systems, and he even broke through his own meditation master. That he found that there's something's wrong there, at the time. And the only conclusion that he come up is that maybe there's a wrongness, which is traditionally known as \"duhkha\", suffering. And maybe such suffering does not belong to anybody *at all*. That maybe there is another possibility is that even *this* doesn't exist, that *you* don't exist. And maybe that's the message of sam-- message of transcending from samsara to nirvana, is entirely different category.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=853.0,987.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/27","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So I think if you stick too much terms of debating between the East and West theory, somehow we don't get the message across. I'm not saying particularly Buddha was a smart person, and I'm all for it particularly, but it's a different perspective that Buddha has presented; has a different dimension altogether. Kind of a humanistic person, 2,500 years ago, who disbelieve in humanism, or egohood, whatever. Which is I think subject that we are discussing, in terms of psychology. And therefore, teaching of Buddha had become highly psychologically-oriented from that point onward, rather than behavior-oriented as such, or culturally-oriented as such, that it's non-cultural thing. It's sort of revolutionary idea, which still could be more revolutionary as time goes on, in my way of thinking anyway.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=987.0,1059.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/28","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So I think there's a point there that the-- all kinds of behavior patterns that we could present, to make ego-less or ego-hood, but at the time, we are doing something with it. And the real idea seems to be is that to find out, discover, is anything at all? That's the question that nobody has really looked at. And we presume that there is something happening, and as if that you have bought the cart, and you never discuss about the horses. And that's what Buddha is getting at, is that let us discuss what kind of horse we're going to have. Is there horse at all or not? Is it worth buying the cart? And that's kind of fundamental thing that we might inject in this particular situation. So which makes things more lively. [Laughter]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1059.0,1129.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/29","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: In the developmental part of an individual's growth, from infancy onward, in the West it's assumed that a certain structure will develop just for functioning. That is, the sucking behavior will start, and the sort of basic needs systems will build a structure around them which will become psychological in nature. And that that will be a necessity for survival. And only after that can some other conditions occur. Now, how does that fit in with what you've just said?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1129.0,1173.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/30","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Well I think that's fits perfectly well. That there is a big misunderstanding, out of nothingness. So we're dwelling on the misunderstanding, as if anchor. And we built up the misunderstanding -- whatever it is, you know, built life out of it. And it seems okay, functional; we might building house on ice block, or you know, \"Let's decorate nicely. And let's, you know, disregard the ice block, but we still got to do that.\" But then some point we begin to find in a spring, or in the summer, that the spirituality is begin to question your foundation altogether.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1173.0,1225.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/31","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"But I think that's the point, is that misunderstanding in this case is the pain and uncertainty, possibilities of nonexistent, but still existing. When child cry, cry for nonexistence, there *is* this-- that message happens constantly. And the child suck nipple because child wanted to have some connection, make sure that there's a relative reference that child *could* exist or *does* exist, which are the expressions of all kinds of panic, which builds the society from that point of view. But on the other hand that doesn't necessarily mean that we should abandon everything, and we should abandon as soon as child is born, and throw it out. But we should build those misunderstandings to the level that misunderstandings becomes a source of understanding of *some* kind. [Laughs; laughter]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1225.0,1285.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/32","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"[BOOKMARK: PART 4]\r\n\r\n\r\nDUNCAN CAMPBELL: Well it sounds like in a way that the process that Buddha went through was starting out as a prince, and someone who became disillusioned with -- we want to cast this in psychological terminology -- that desire structure of being a prince, or that kind of material existence. He then rebounded or reacted to the other pole of searching for some sort of meaning, in a kind of an ascetic structure, being for several years with the yogis. And then that itself proved dissatisfactory, and it seemed like what he then discovered was that somehow the whole psychological pattern of what was carrying him from one pole to the other was really what was interesting to look at. And the only way he could look at that was by studying his own mind.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1285.0,1330.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/33","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Well obviously, you know, I mean you can't call somebody a liar unless there is something to prove that there's a truth exist. You know it's as simple as that, that polarity is always there, that there is-- the materialism is taking place, in the domestic level of Buddha's kingdom, palace, his parents and everything, and then when he abandoned that he latch on to something else. Which is still path to glory of or glorifying ego or something, that he still went on. But then when he realize the -- what's the word? -- polarity. That he should look closely: what he is doing is-- actually what he's actually doing it or not. That then he begin to realize he wasn't doing anything at all, but he was just purely playing a game, at-- you know, pretend to be a saint. But actually that he find himself in the trapped up in the sainthood, or whatever, you know. That's the crux of the matter seem to be.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1330.0,1413.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/34","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I mean the-- I think one of the greatest development that the Westerners-- Western world is discovered is the law of relative-- relativity. And I would say as soon as the law of relativity has given birth in this country or in the Western world, that he was-- Buddha mind is begin to work. And before that people have never thought of *comparing*, and people just *presumed*, you know, like we presumed ego. And you know, the question doesn't arise, that \"everything seem to be okay, but let's check the details.\" You know, that's become the problematic question.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1413.0,1467.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/35","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"[Looking at Jim Green] You have anything to say about that? [Laughter]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1467.0,1472.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/36","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"JIM GREEN: [Laughs] I think that I do. I wanted to ask you what, in response, what one says to-- what you say to someone who feels that the game or the series of games are what there is? And that if one gives up the games, or even the sequence of games, one is left with nothing which is worth surviving for.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1472.0,1498.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/37","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Which is what?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1498.0,1499.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/38","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"JIM GREEN: Which is worth surviving for, living for.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1499.0,1501.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/39","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: I see. Well I mean that's the precisely the point you see. We haven't explored another kind of life, at all. We thought this *the* it, this is it, you know. We haven't even step out of our front door. So there *is* something else, there may *be* something else, but let's let us experience it, you know, that's very intellectually very difficult to prove, because that we are in-build all kinds of concepts and ideas; the whole thing become very solid already. But there's another version of survival, other than trying to be-- trying to survive with the basic necessity of ego. I mean that's, to my mind, that is enlightenment, is there's another version of survival, without trying to survive. I mean that's the big question actually. That *is it*. [Laughs]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1501.0,1557.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/40","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"JIM GREEN: And in some ways it seems not at all to be a theoretical question; it seems that as long as we rest in a theory, we rest in a state of hopeless internal conflict and contradiction. And as soon as we take a first step outside that particular circle of conflict and contradiction, well something happens or it doesn't, perhaps. But it seems as if the step needs to be taken in some way. Some exploration needs to take place if the issue is to be resolved for each person .\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Well said.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1557.0,1593.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/41","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"[BOOKMARK: PART 5]\r\n\r\n\r\nJOHN BAKER: But what is the motivation for taking this kind of a step?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1593.0,1596.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/42","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Well, we're having a panel discussion. [Laughter] Well--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1596.0,1603.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/43","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: Well then I'll answer it. [Laughter; laughs]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1603.0,1605.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/44","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Why don't you say it?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1605.0,1608.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/45","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: Despair. Despair. That was what-- that's the model that Buddha demonstrates. Despair of the finiteness of whatever structures he found himself in over and over again. They weren't paying off.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1608.0,1620.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/46","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"DUNCAN CAMPBELL: But then how can you create a system, which goes beyond the very notion of systems, since that seems to be the problem? That the problem of ego is that it continually creates a system.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1620.0,1629.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/47","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: You can't create it, but you can be it. You don't create it.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1629.0,1633.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/48","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"JIM GREEN: Right. But it also because people seem to be somewhat imperfect. It may be that we for some time hold a carrot in front of ourselves. That may be necessary, particularly if we're aware that the carrot doesn't quite exist even though it's there.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1633.0,1647.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/49","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: That's the desire for enlightenment you're talking of.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1647.0,1648.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/50","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"JIM GREEN: Yeah, the desire for enlightenment, right. Or for any one of number of things connected with enlightenment.\r\n\r\n\r\nRAM DASS: Yeah.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1648.0,1654.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/51","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"DUNCAN CAMPBELL: Well the desire for enlightenment itself seems to be somewhat a contradiction in terms. That the more you desire enlightenment, the less you can be enlightened, because you think there's something to get.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1654.0,1662.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/52","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: But you find that out in the course of pursuing the desire for enlightenment.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1662.0,1666.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/53","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"JIM GREEN: Right. It seems to be an imperfect world. [Laughter] And... Well it *is* an imperfect world in some ways, and it seems that at times actions are paradoxical. [Laughter]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1666.0,1681.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/54","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: Well you couldn't have it more perfect than that, you know. The thing destroys itself.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1681.0,1685.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/55","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"JIM GREEN: I'll try to remember that. [Laughs; laughter]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1685.0,1686.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/56","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: The thing that destroys itself. [Laughs] But the relativistic thing, you know, the way psychological theory is built is built out of the range of the person's experiences, the psychologists'-- theoretical psychologists' experiences, in terms of getting deductive theories from which to deduce. And until we put into, infuse into, Western psychology, people who are living by an alternative-- in an alternative domain if you will, or however we want to say, the-- a space which doesn't work from within ego structure. There's no possibility that we can apply that relativity to psychological theory, because we can't speculate about the possibility of the buddha mind, if you will, from outside of it, and have the theory worth a damn as far as I can figure. You know, so it seems to me that many psychologists-- I mean I feel part of a large group of psychologists who are driven inside, because of the dissatisfaction with behaviorism. Because you can't study it as object. Ultimately you've got to *be* it, and until you be-- you can feel that gap, you just can't jump that relative system, you can't jump out of your absolutistic prison, if you will.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1686.0,1773.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/57","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"DUNCAN CAMPBELL: In fact I think that's the way you first got into Eastern religions as I remember: the story you used to tell about being on the other side of the desk, where the student would come in, and you were the therapist, and he was the problem. And his game wasn't as successful, and your game was more successful, and your whole role as psychologist seemed to be simply to tell him how to play the game better. And then you began to think that there was maybe something about this game itself that was to be questioned. And so off you went. Here we are.\r\n\r\n\r\nJIM GREEN: Here we are. [Laughs; laughter]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1773.0,1805.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/58","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: Because then I had to hide my neurosis, now I can just exhibit them. [Laughs; laughter]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1805.0,1820.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/59","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"[BOOKMARK: PART 6]\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: I think we might discuss about the question of the notion of alternatives. That might be important point to discuss at this point. Should person be trained, disciplined, in a certain way, that there is no alternatives left. Or should a person to be inspired, there's lots of alternatives and you are free. I think that is crux of the matter, that psychology East and West, or whatever you like to call it, that the alternative has a positive aspect, and also had its negative aspect as well at the same time. And which is largely the Western therapy work is based on is alternative, the therapy work is regarded as alternative thing. \"Better than something else.\" And also various practice of spiritual discipline that all the-- most of therapists would get into, are the discovery of a better world. Which in itself is a binding factor; it is good at the same time because gives you new insight, but on the other hand that would be misunderstandable. There is that problem.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1820.0,1913.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/60","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Anybody has anything to say about that?  [Looks to Ram Dass; laughter]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1913.0,1928.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/61","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: Well there are a couple of levels at which that... First of all, the individual psychologist's fear of her or his own death puts a boundary on the game anyway, and starts to make a finiteness to the possibilities that they-- they're willing to consider. That's the first part of it. And then the kind of lack of humility that exists in-- often exists in social science, makes one conclude that one already knows all the possibilities, or that one could know them intellectually. That-- it seems to me that a lot of the boundaries are put on by the intellect, without recognizing like intuitive possibilities in the universe. And the intellect feels very finite to me, in terms of what it's possible ability to conceive of, if you will. That's your domain, not mine.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1928.0,2001.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/62","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"JIM GREEN: I couldn't agree more. On the other hand though, on the other hand there is a certain, how to say it, legitimacy and integrity to that life which is a life of drama and [UNCLEAR: gain? game?], which it makes very difficult to step outside of even momentarily. And that seems all right. I mean in some sense it seems a mistake to attack that head on in some way, because that attacking head on seems only to intensify, in any case, the struggle. As you know, if you've talked with therapists who are very intellectual; it's as if some softening of a situation has to take place.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2001.0,2044.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/63","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: I don't think you do anything to anybody else anyway. JIM GREEN: Yeah, right.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2044.0,2046.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/64","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: You don't attack them, you just do it to yourself. Like--\r\n\r\n\r\nJIM GREEN: You do it--\r\n\r\n\r\nRAM DASS: --undercutting your own structures, your intellectual understanding of psychodynamics--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2046.0,2055.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/65","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Well... excuse me. I think there might be some problems with that, is that you are not helping somebody at all, anybody at all. But you are trying to learn very much, by using somebody else's examples, that there is a kind of very exclusive kind of confused arhat kind of a problem that you know you are-- like the example that Duncan was talking about, that you felt in the early days that the students on the other side of desk, you are on this side, and you found that was very ironically strange. But then you didn't dealt with it, but you took off.\r\n\r\n\r\nRAM DASS: To fight another day, if you will. [Laughs; laughter]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2055.0,2127.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/66","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Yeah, well I mean, let us discuss about that as well. And there is a problem of that becoming too self-centered, you know, that--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2127.0,2138.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/67","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: Or too compassionate, to proceed with a game which is perpetuating illusion. [Laughter]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2138.0,2142.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/68","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Yeah, but then in the meantime the other person is suspended. You know, until you did your research work the other person is suspended and going through the same problem, maybe behind *another* desk.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2142.0,2156.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/69","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: Look, you go into a cave for a period of time, and yet you already knew about the need to alleviate suffering, and you're not going to say you can't justify spending times in retreats in caves. You were in the same predicament.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2156.0,2168.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/70","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Well that's what I mean. That's what I mean. Let us discuss about that. [Laughs; laughter]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2168.0,2173.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/71","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: I think it's a very narrow concept to think that you relieve suffering by staying on the firing line all the time. When I was in India and sitting at the temple I used to think, \"Well maybe I'm copping out, because all these guys like Allen Ginsberg, and all these boys are out fighting the fight, the good fight, here I am sitting at a temple, you know, what am I doing? Why aren't I out there in Chicago at the riots, and so on?\" [Laughter] And I began to think that the inner battle was really where the battle line was for all of us. It wasn't necessarily out there, sitting in the desk, in the therapy office.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2173.0,2202.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/72","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Do you mean that will cost a lot of lives?\r\n\r\n\r\nRAM DASS: Hmm?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2202.0,2206.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/73","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Cost a lot of lives--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2206.0,2207.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/74","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: Yeah. At least one hopefully. [Laughs]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2207.0,2208.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/75","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: --in the meantime. In the meantime.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2208.0,2210.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/76","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: In the meantime it would cost a lot of lives, yes.\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Yeah.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2210.0,2212.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/77","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: Sure. Of course.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2212.0,2215.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/78","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"JIM GREEN: Rinpoche, what would your particular advice to Ram Dass have been? [Laughter; applause]\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE:  [whispering to Jim Green] What did he say?\r\n\r\n\r\nJIM GREEN: [whispering] He said, \"what would your particular advice to Ram Dass have been when he was behind the desk?\"","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2215.0,2246.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/79","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"JOHN BAKER: You know a minute ago you said that the reason for giving up this world and entering a world which *possibly* beyond our imagination might not have anything worth living for in it, is despair. And I've heard you Rinpoche speak about reaching the depths of despair. You have to become completely hopeless, which is even beyond despair. But it seems that what you're talking about is the question of how one generates that kind of despair that makes one willing to step out of ego, into a world in which-- I mean no one wants to die. Everyone's afraid of that; there must be a tremendous impetus that propels us out of a world where albeit we're suffering, but at least it's familiar and it has it's petty pleasures and not so petty pleasures, rather intense ecstasies and so forth. So you know, how does one go about generating that kind of impetus, to make a person want to, or *able* to step out of the world of ego?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2246.0,2318.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/80","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Well we haven't come to the conclusion yet at this point actually, that should we examine that possibility or should we just try to develop and grow our ego. Materialistically or spiritually. We haven't discussed the first point so the second point seem to be obsolete, in some sense. That's what I'm trying to get at, is that there are lot of people listening to us here, as well as there will be viewers in the rest of the country, and people are concerned about that, you know. I think we should make very clear to them, that maybe quite possibly--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2318.0,2361.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/81","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: That you don't walk away from your desk.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2361.0,2362.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/82","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: I beg your pardon?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2362.0,2363.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/83","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: Is that what you're saying, that you don't walk away from your desk?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2363.0,2365.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/84","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Well whatever, you know. [Laughs: laughter] That wasn't particular thing. That's one facet of it.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2365.0,2370.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/85","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: Yeah, I don't think it would be bad if a lot of therapists walked away from their desks. [Applause]\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Yeah?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2370.0,2374.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/86","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: I mean statistically the recidivism rate is just about the same, whether people go to therapists or not. So Western therapy isn't really doing that well, you know.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2374.0,2383.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/87","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"JIM GREEN: Yeah, but the issue seems to be a more general one, of walking out of one life into another one. Walking out of one life which one has behind the desk immediately into another which one has when one's leaves the desk, which I'm sure wasn't your sense. And it doesn't seem to be that way.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2383.0,2399.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/88","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: There's no real dropout, if you miss that--\r\n\r\n\r\nJIM GREEN: There's no real dropout.\r\n\r\n\r\nRAM DASS: Yeah, yeah.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2399.0,2403.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/89","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"JIM GREEN: And it seems that that's one of the meanings of a path, that really when one leaves the desk one is in the same place in some sense?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2403.0,2408.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/90","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Yeah. Well in a some sense, that we have a microphone in front of us, which is another form of a desk.\r\n\r\n\r\nRAM DASS: Right.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2408.0,2417.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/91","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: And we have a platform, as well.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2417.0,2419.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/92","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: Absolutely. The game doesn't change, you can't get out of it no matter how hard you try. [Laughter] It's just the *illusion* of change that just... [Laughs]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2419.0,2428.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/93","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: So, is there any point at all? [Laughs; laughter; applause]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2428.0,2436.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/94","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: Not at that level. It's just spinning wheels at that level, those dances anyway.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2436.0,2441.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/95","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: What level we are talking about?\r\n\r\n\r\nRAM DASS: [Laughing] Ah, oh no!\r\n\r\n\r\nDUNCAN CAMPBELL: Oh yes!\r\n\r\n\r\nRAM DASS: Other than that level. [Laughs]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2441.0,2459.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/96","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"[BOOKMARK: PART 7]\r\n\r\n\r\nRAM DASS: In the process of changing from the desk to the microphone, to the pen, to whatever the same vehicle is over and over again, the motivations-- this is the same thing about working within desire structures, desire hierarchies. The-- there is a process going on through that whole thing, that is working on you in a different-- quite a different way, than is represented by the phenotypic behavior by whether-- I mean you can stand on the-- in front-- you are in front of a microphone at a very different motivational level than I am in front of this microphone, perhaps. Perhaps. [Laughs; laughter]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2459.0,2500.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/97","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: We're sitting on the same level--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2500.0,2502.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/98","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: I know! It looks the same, doesn't it? [Laughter] The microphones look the same, sounds come out, you know. But I suspect it's different, I don't know. [Laughter; applause] How do I get in there to find out? [Laughter; applause]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2502.0,2516.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/99","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Well, your microphone is different than mine.[Laughs]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2516.0,2524.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/100","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: Yes, well...I notice that. [Laughs; laughter] It's different than everybody's here. [Laughter]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2524.0,2536.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/101","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Well, [laughing] back to square one.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2536.0,2545.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/102","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: You didn't answer Jim's question. Jim asked you, \"What would you have done, sitting behind that desk?\"","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2545.0,2551.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/103","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"JIM GREEN: Well not quite. I asked what advice would he would have given you [laughing], sitting behind that-- [Laughter]\r\n\r\n\r\nRAM DASS: Excuse me for putting those--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2551.0,2558.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/104","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Yeah, well I do that every day. I have a desk and telephone, and couch. [Laughter; laughs]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2558.0,2569.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/105","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: The meaning of them all change. Yeah. [Laughter] You arrived at that from a different space.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2569.0,2583.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/106","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: I came to England by boat. [Laughter; laughs]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2583.0,2597.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/107","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: Right. What the other person meets in the office with you, within the office, [laughter] is perhaps a different space, than what they met with me twelve years ago.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2597.0,2613.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/108","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Well, I do feel sometimes my desk shrinks, and when we have a conversation taking place, if not optical illusion -- which I think it is, but still, the desk does shrink, and it becomes just very thin little desk. But still telephone rings, and other things happens anyway. So I wonder. [Laughs; laughter]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2613.0,2642.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/109","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: Hmm. They all seem-- the desk and the telephone and the microphone all seem much less intrusive than they did within that other system that I was working in.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2642.0,2660.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/110","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: That's possible I think, yeah.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2660.0,2661.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/111","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: And in fact my own identity, as a therapist or whatever, seems less intrusive. And the idea that the person's a patient seems less intrusive. Or the idea there's anything to *do* seems less intrusive.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2661.0,2673.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/112","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"JIM GREEN: Right. It isn't really clear what the particular problem is actually. [Laughter]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2673.0,2677.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/113","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Well there's a time gap.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2677.0,2683.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/114","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"JIM GREEN: There *is* a time gap perhaps, but perhaps not, after all...","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2683.0,2686.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/115","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Maybe need to grow up. As young therapist up to old therapist.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2686.0,2693.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/116","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"JIM GREEN: It's good if that happens in times.\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Well--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2693.0,2695.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/117","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"JIM GREEN: It's timely.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2695.0,2697.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/118","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Otherwise you die sooner.\r\n\r\n\r\nJIM GREEN: Yeah.\r\n\r\n\r\nRAM DASS: Ah! [Laughs]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2697.0,2702.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/119","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"JIM GREEN: Things should be seasonable, but it doesn't seem so urgent either perhaps.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2702.0,2707.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/120","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: That's a philosophical remark.\r\n\r\n\r\nJIM GREEN: Well yes.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2707.0,2711.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/121","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"[BOOKMARK: PART 8]\r\n\r\n\r\nDUNCAN CAMPBELL: Well maybe what we're talking about at a very simple level [laughter], is that when you've got the psychiatrist behind the desk, and *you're* on the other side of the desk, and *you're* the one that's neurotic, and *he's* the one that's sane, that already provides a certain polarity which is very difficult to get beyond. If you're the one that's neurotic, if you can't talk on an eye-level, friendly, communicative level with a therapist, it's only going to further reinforce your own feeling of being *you're* the one that's screwed up, and *you're* the one that's neurotic. And that's what we're really talking about, is how can we create a space, or a model which allows that kind of communication back and forth to take place?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2711.0,2749.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/122","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"JOHN BAKER: But I think what this conversation [laughs]--\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: If you could call it.\r\n\r\n\r\nJOHN BAKER: --is precisely the question of model. I mean when a psychiatrist sits behind his desk--\r\n\r\n\r\nRAM DASS: He has a model.\r\n\r\n\r\nJOHN BAKER: --he's got a particular model.\r\n\r\n\r\nRAM DASS: Yeah.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2749.0,2763.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/123","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"JOHN BAKER: And if you talk about enlightenment or being a guru, that likewise is a particular model. And the question is, do you reject one model in favor of a better one?\r\n\r\n\r\nRAM DASS: That's still horizontal.\r\n\r\n\r\nJOHN BAKER: That's still horizontal.\r\n\r\n\r\nRAM DASS: Yeah.\r\n\r\n\r\nJOHN BAKER: Now, I think--\r\n\r\n\r\nRAM DASS: That's a model.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2763.0,2778.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/124","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"JOHN BAKER: --I think that's what's being discussed here. The question of, is a spiritual model necessarily better than a secular one, that of a guru better than the psychiatrist? And it seems like it's a tricky point--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2778.0,2793.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/125","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: I don't think the word is \"spiritual\" and \"secular\"; it just seems to me that the training I received as a Western psychologist left me in a position where I was not open as a student, really, to keep doing the work on myself. It got me-- I mean there was a whole idea, once I'd been given the PhD and had the credentials, I knew something, and I was a knowledgeable person who, you know, then should function a certain way. And there was a certain fixity about the whole structure. And breaking out of that, back into the student role, of surrendering that, that's what seems to me the healthy quality of the growth of psychology in the West at this moment.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2793.0,2836.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/126","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"JOHN BAKER: So you-- what you've just said then is that you think that the student role is better than that of the teacher, as a model--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2836.0,2842.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/127","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: I think the student role is better than that of the teacher, yeah.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2842.0,2845.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/128","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: But then you have to have kind of-- the issue came up the other day as well, the same thing, is that should you have a constant cultural revolution of some kind or other, that when you become advanced, knowledgeable student then, you know, push back. And how far you can do that? It seems in the past in according to the tradition, that lot of the great teachers didn't have to go through self-criticism, having become great teachers; they stayed where they are. And somehow there's some gap in logic. And we have to solve that problem.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2845.0,2884.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/129","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: Did you say they didn't have to or they did have to?\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: They didn't.\r\n\r\n\r\nRAM DASS: They didn't have to.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2884.0,2887.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/130","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: When they become guru and when there was inheritance of spiritual initiation, abhisheka, and they stood. And their grandfathers honored that as well, or great-great-grandfathers as well.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2887.0,2902.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/131","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: And did that maintain the living spirit of the tradition?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2902.0,2905.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/132","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Something is living, rather than, you know, revolutionary or democracy of some kind; there's a problem with that. Maybe it's cultural, but the tradition-- old traditions came from theocracy of some kind. And our new tradition is democracy...\r\n\r\n\r\nRAM DASS: Yeah.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2905.0,2929.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/133","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: I don't know, there is a gap there; we should look into that, you know.\r\n\r\n\r\nRAM DASS: Yeah. Yeah.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2929.0,2933.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/134","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: That you can't constantly recommend people to be student constantly.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2933.0,2937.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/135","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: Well-- it doesn't-- it's the ability to be in a way in both roles, simultaneously, in the sense of staying-- you once said to me, \"It's okay--\" I said to you, \"Is it all right to keep going out and lecturing when I know how much uncooked, you know, with my model about who I thought I wasn't?\" And you said, \"As long as you remain a student.\"\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Yeah.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2937.0,2960.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/136","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: But I'm in the role of a teacher, but it's very much the role of a student. And to me these come together very beautifully; I don't find that as a contradiction that much.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2960.0,2968.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/137","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Well... something very slippery there.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2968.0,2975.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/138","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: Hmm? [Laughing] Slippery? You wanted to protect tradition and lineage and I just think--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2975.0,2980.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/139","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"DUNCAN CAMPBELL: [To Ram Dass] Well you did just say though, you know, that the student role was better than the teacher role. And there was something strange about that, because it would seem that the obvious statement would be that the student role and the teacher role are somehow the same. And I really wonder what you meant by that, when you said the student role is \"better than\" the teacher role?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2980.0,2995.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/140","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: You may end up being a teacher, but I think when you *think* you are a teacher you aren't. I mean, that's what I really-- I'm talking at a lower level -- I can't use the word \"level\" anymore. I'm talking-- TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: I suppose-- [laughter; laughs] I suppose the problem comes up is when you become a guru who's also student, and working with the people as student. But then, where's your guru? What happened to the hierarchy? Should the guru be also made into a student, and you could teach *him* or *her* that lesson? So you see there is a kind of hierarchical problem.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2995.0,3043.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/141","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: The hierarchical problem only exists in the early stages of the process. After a while the guru is everywhere; it's all the teaching. And the guru is giving you the teaching wherever you look, whoever you meet.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3043.0,3053.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/142","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Well who is the spokesman for that?\r\n\r\n\r\nRAM DASS: Your heart.\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Which is one person's heart or...?\r\n\r\n\r\nRAM DASS: Each person's heart.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3053.0,3063.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/143","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Well, so then everybody-- we have no right to be here--\r\n\r\n\r\nRAM DASS: That's true.\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: --on this platform.\r\n\r\n\r\nRAM DASS: That's equally true.\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Yeah.\r\n\r\n\r\nRAM DASS: Sure.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3063.0,3072.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/144","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: So, how we could hold the fort? [Ram Dass laughs; laughter] And what happens with lineage?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3072.0,3081.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/145","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: Well I think we do this until everybody realizes this. [Ram Dass laughs; laughter] I mean the game isn't to end up having everybody need somebody out there. Or on or out there  [pointing upwards] or then, even-- [pointing to Trungpa Rinpoche] you... [Laughter; Trungpa Rinpoche laughs] It's a self-destruct system really.\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Mr. Moderator I think you have to intervene some place.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3081.0,3118.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/146","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"[BOOKMARK: PART 9]\r\n\r\n\r\nDUNCAN CAMPBELL: Well I think we ought to get down to brass tacks then, as to what kind of system would in fact do just what you're saying? You know, what kind of system is the best design to kind of short circuit that process, while honoring all of the, you know, neurotic elements in all of us? How do you create a series of practices, for instance meditation practices, or mantra practices, or devotional practices of any kind, that free a person to get beyond, you know like his own trip about substituting one system for another? Maybe we ought to talk about it in those terms, you know, like just in terms of a system; what kind of practices seem to be the most conducive to that?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3118.0,3165.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/147","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Well you have a problem there, if I may begin, is that introducing a technique, or particular practice, it's not group effort, according to the spiritual hierarchy that we know, of *all* the traditions, great traditions of religions: Hinduism, Buddhism, Christianity, Judaism, things be handed down. There's an immediate problem. That student might say that, \"What right you have to give us this thing, that we have to sit on our ass for ten hours? What kind of authorities? Who gave you that authority?\"","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3165.0,3217.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/148","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: The student gives you that authority--\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Well when--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3217.0,3220.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/149","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: The student gives you that authority by their despair, which they're--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3220.0,3223.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/150","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: No, but when the student begin to revolt, and begin to ask *you* a question--\r\n\r\n\r\nRAM DASS: Good-- yeah.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3223.0,3229.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/151","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: And then, he takes away, you know--\r\n\r\n\r\nRAM DASS: Takes away the authority.\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: --authority. So you can't wave the Koran or the Bible, and \"This is my authority.\" There is a very awkward moment there.\r\n\r\n\r\nRAM DASS: There's a what?\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Awkward moment.\r\n\r\n\r\nRAM DASS: An awkward moment.\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Yeah.\r\n\r\n\r\nRAM DASS: Hopefully, yes.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3229.0,3246.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/152","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Well, why hopefully? [Laughing] Well maybe that's it.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3246.0,3249.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/153","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: That's the spark you talk about. That's the spark, because it's your being that is the teacher. I mean in the ultimate analysis... to you your lineage is important, to me the part of the teaching is the spark, or is the process of the being, or the connection to the being.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3249.0,3268.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/154","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Do you have anything to say about that?\r\n\r\n\r\nJIM GREEN: Nothing. [Laughter; laughs]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3268.0,3280.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/155","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: We-- just like the other day we talked about eclecticism versus a single tradition. And I think we dealt with the issue of stages of sadhana, or stages of development, and that there were stages when a person was-- had enough \"gyan\" or enough \"vidya\", enough of that kind of knowledge, to be able to honor a tradition as a functional entity to take you from here to here, or here to there or however you want to say it.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3280.0,3318.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/156","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: But the problem seem to be is that the spokesman's role. That if there is sacred, and very sane and very solid message comes down--\r\n\r\n\r\nRAM DASS: Yeah.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3318.0,3333.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/157","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: --why do you have to play the role of student, teacher, flipping back and forth?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3333.0,3345.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/158","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: You don't have to play any role. At the point where there is no role that you're particularly connected with, the whole issue is irrelevant at that point -- then you merely *are* the lineage, you are the statement of it, the living statement of it.\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Yeah, but--\r\n\r\n\r\nRAM DASS: Until then--\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: --spokesman--\r\n\r\n\r\nRAM DASS: --the optimum strategy is that of a student.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3345.0,3367.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/159","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: I think there is a [laughing] big gap somewhere.\r\n\r\n\r\nRAM DASS: Hmm?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3367.0,3369.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/160","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: There is a gap somewhere.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3369.0,3371.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/161","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"DUNCAN CAMPBELL: Well it sounds to me like what you're saying is that, you know, if you're *in* a certain role, like if you're behind the desk as the therapist, or if you're up in front of the microphone as the teacher, that there something about that that you have to take responsibility for. You have to actually *do* that with a certain kind of confidence, without providing that little escape hatch of, \"Well I'm just as neurotic as you are,\" and somehow that weakens the whole situation.\r\n\r\n\r\nRAM DASS: Does it?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3371.0,3396.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/162","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"DUNCAN CAMPBELL: It feels that way to me, and I throw that out. TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Well-- do you have anything to say John?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3396.0,3404.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/163","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"[BOOKMARK: PART 10]\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Well-- do you have anything to say John? \r\n\r\n\r\nJOHN BAKER: Well it's like, Rinpoche you were talking more like we shouldn't refer back. Let's see, I'll try a sort of a pat statement. If you take it as it's done in the Buddhist tradition, that sort of the definition of ego is that it constantly wants to secure itself, then a spiritual path becomes somewhat tricky process. Uh huh--\r\n\r\n\r\nRAM DASS: [INAUDIBLE]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3404.0,3439.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/164","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"JOHN BAKER: Because we're talking about motivation. And motivation in this sense could be the tool of ego: \"I want to get enlightened, I want to stop suffering, I want to be wise.\" Then the problem comes that if the teachings, the essence of the teachings, are in fact the spark that cuts through ego, that steps out of ego's manipulation, that goes beyond the student's or the practitioner's desire to see something, to experience something, to get someplace, that that spark has to be completely spontaneous. If you then co-opt it into the teaching and say, \"Well we're looking for this spark. And we're going to try and create it,\" then you've made-- you've put it into ego's employ, once again. And I think it's something of the same situation with the role you take. In other words, \"Sure, where the final position may be that I'm neither a teacher nor a student.\" But if you don't commit yourself to one stance or another until before you've reached that point, then you're trying to kind of-- you keep trying to co-opt-- you see you're trying to be the goal before you get to it. And you can't have that spontaneity because you keep op-opting it into ego.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3439.0,3523.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/165","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"JIM GREEN: Yes, it's as if there's an apparent progression: you start off as the \"therapist expert\" with a client, and then you realize you're neurotic too, so you remain the therapist but you acknowledge that you're neurotic. And nevertheless you remain in the role. You-- and you may even seek as a student some solution; recognize that you're neurotic and find someone who will cure you. Nevertheless you go on functioning as a therapist, who however is decent, because I-- he-- \"I acknowledge that I'm neurotic.\" And that seems to be somehow an unsatisfactory situation, although it can go on for a very long time. At some point, probably one has to see, that the play of neurosis which constitute the therapeutic situation as unsound in itself. And it may be a therapeutic situation or any sort of teaching situation. And at that point one might see the possibility that the teaching situation is not a situation: that is there's no particular situation one needs, or institution or role, in order for teaching or learning to take place. And even that there isn't a difference between teaching and learning. It seems that that-- one can imagine that sort of progression taking place. Now [INAUDIBLE].","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3523.0,3592.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/166","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"JOHN BAKER: I mean it always seems, you know, in-- there's this statement by Shantarakshita, where he says something about, \"The spark of wisdom strikes like lightning, and illumines the world.\" And I think what he's talking about is the complete, you know, spontaneity with which that has to strike, that it can't be something that we create by trying to be enlightened. I mean, it's that concept-- you like the story of Naropa, that we put in the front of the catalogue--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3592.0,3623.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/167","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: Yeah, well in that case you can be the lineage, but you can't think you are teaching a tradition, because that stifles the spark.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3623.0,3632.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/168","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"JOHN BAKER: Well, I think you-- as long as you think that you are you've got to. I mean you've got to play the game according to the rules that you've got, because you can't keep trying to change the rules to make them according to what the book say they're supposed to be. In other words it's like, accepting where you are, at whatever level, that's the place you got to accept and start with, wouldn't you say? I mean I'm sure you would.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3632.0,3655.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/169","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: Yeah, that part I would say. The [laughing] first part I didn't say-- I didn't accept the whole statement. [Laughs] That's sneaky.\r\n\r\n\r\nJOHN BAKER: But like-- it's like--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3655.0,3662.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/170","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"JIM GREEN: It's the lineage that bugs you, huh?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3662.0,3664.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/171","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: He's very--\r\n\r\n\r\nJOHN BAKER: It's like you know--\r\n\r\n\r\nRAM DASS: --shifty. [Laughter]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3664.0,3667.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/172","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"JOHN BAKER: You know what I'm trying to say.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3667.0,3673.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/173","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: I agree, \"Mother and a flag and apple pie are good,\" yes. [Laughs]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3673.0,3682.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/174","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: I think there is... [gestures to Ram Dass] please.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3682.0,3689.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/175","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: It was interesting that when I first went to the convocation exercises of the new Naropa Institute and listened to you gentlemen talking about lineage and tradition, I was somewhat taken aback, because to me I guess as a Westerner, lineage and tradition has always been connected with deadness, and the lack of spark, really, right? Now to me it is only conceivable that a lineage or a tradition can be transmitted through a living entity, who is the spark itself. In other words I think that Naropa requires Trungpa Rinpoche, right? I don't think it play-- it would spark without that. It's like well you need that flint to get the game going, right? And the flint is not that he thinks he is the teacher -- I don't, I'm not describing it, but that he *is* the teacher; that he *is* the lineage, not that he *thinks* he is the lineage. And until one *is* that thing, it is most functional, it seems to me, to remain wide open, all the time to all possibility. Which to me is what I call the student role. Even though I have to get up and teach every day.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3689.0,3761.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/176","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"JOHN BAKER: But, you've got to take a chance. I mean being wide open can't mean sort of taking the safest position, like, \"I'm a nobody.\" It's-- as long as you think you're somebody, you've got to try and *be* somebody and see what that brings. That's the really, you know, gutsy and courageous thing to do, is sticking your neck out. And then you can get it chopped off. Which would be--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3761.0,3785.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/177","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: We are *certainly* doing that now. [Laughter; Laughs]\r\n\r\n\r\nJOHN BAKER: Yeah. Here it comes.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3785.0,3796.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/178","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"DUNCAN CAMPBELL: Speaking of that, I think this is an ideal time for a break.\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: I think so, yes.\r\n\r\n\r\nJIM GREEN: It's a good time.\r\n\r\n\r\n[Applause]\r\n\r\n\r\n[GAP in Video - Return from Break]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3796.0,3820.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/179","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"[BOOKMARK: PART 11]\r\n\r\n\r\nDUNCAN CAMPBELL: Well it seems to me that one of the central questions that has been involved in this whole discussion, is what kind of model you can work with in order to develop personality beyond its own self deception. That if you give any kind of ego a model to substitute for its pre-existing model, you've created the same trap all over again. And so on one hand we can have the model of two cars in the garage, and a successful career, and then that person drops out because he finds it unsatisfactory and he becomes a spiritual seeker. And as a spiritual seeker he finds that he's seeking enlightenment, and it's the same pattern all over again. And it almost sounds to me as if it's really not quite possible for a single person to see through that self-deception on his own. And what that raises, as far as I'm concerned, is the whole question of a teacher, and a tradition in which one can commit oneself and work with a single individual who *has* that kind of awareness. Because it's really up to the teacher to bring up the ego and bust it down and bring it up again and bust it down and bring it up again and bust it down. And if there hasn't been that kind of commitment, to a tradition or a single teacher, it seems like the spiritual search could just be a kind of supermarket shopping enterprise where you pick up a technique here and a technique there. And it's almost like trying to do psychiatry without a psychiatrist, by reading a whole bunch of books on Freud and Jung. And I mean I think that's *really* the question we've been going about during this whole discussion, and I'd like to see that addressed, as to how necessary the teacher is -- the living teacher -- in order to make this Eastern model of psychological development actually work.\r\n\r\n\r\n[Ram Dass gestures to Trungpa Rinpoche; Trungpa Rinpoche points to Jim Green; laughter] \r\n\r\n\r\n[Laughter]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3820.0,3948.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/180","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"JIM GREEN: Well it does seem that we have a certain propensity to collecting things. [Laughs] There's no doubt about that. We may be collecting higher states of consciousness, or we may be collecting a spiritual path, and it seems to be very difficult to stop collecting by oneself. I would say that I find it particularly difficult to stop collecting by oneself. And it may be that one needs a teacher to exhibit that process of collecting. It may be that it is too difficult, at the more rarified levels of collecting, to be aware that that process is going on in oneself. And in that case perhaps one needs someone to point that out.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3948.0,4002.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/181","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: There is a need for a certain set of experiences that do break through places you're stuck. Whether or not you want to narrow that down to being an external physical plane teacher or not remains to be seen. That within the tradition that I feel attuned to, it is the guru's grace that breaks you out of that place. But it is not necessarily the guru's grace in some guru out there who comes up and hands you his grace or does his grace to you -- it's a much more subtle process than that. And while nobody can do it to themselves, really, because the ego keeps perpetuating itself as you pointed out, it is-- once you have been in the presence of models of possibilities, there is a faith that is generated that leads you to re-perceive perceptual shifts in the universe, so that you start to open yourself to teachings that are occurring around you. And it is through that vehicle that there are many things that hit you on the head and shake you up and undercut you, and that as far as I'm concerned that I-- that the guru can work totally on say an astral plane -- there may never be a physical tradition where you go to a school and there's a teacher, you know. I think that's too narrow a concept. That-- to me that's like collecting another car in the garage.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4002.0,4091.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/182","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"JIM GREEN: But at some level there may be a problem. For example we know about the three people who in the presence of Christ, you know, came together in Michigan at the same time. You know, \"The Three Christs of Ypsilanti.\"\r\n\r\n\r\nRAM DASS: Yeah. Yeah.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4091.0,4100.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/183","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"JIM GREEN: There is a certain problem of [laughs] becoming convinced about your inner wisdom without any sort of external check at all. And it seems that can become [INAUDIBLE]--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4100.0,4109.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/184","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: Look, we're not going to be-- enlightenment isn't something that's validated by somebody else, [laughs] you know.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4109.0,4115.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/185","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"JIM GREEN: No, but it may be that confusion is validated by somebody else.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4115.0,4119.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/186","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: Of course. [Laughter] It's also validated ultimately by the failure of the game.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4119.0,4125.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/187","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"JIM GREEN: Well but it may not be, because as one continues to generate Christ fantasies for example, even in the face of the other two Christs in the same room, there may be no invalidation possible. Unless one accepts some ground of invalidation if you like.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4125.0,4141.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/188","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: Well that would assume that there isn't the grace of the guru. I mean I don't live-- to me there's another system that's operating, quite independent of whether somebody walks into the room in Ypsilanti and says, \"You are not Christ. And I'll prove it to you, because I am,\" [laughs] or whatever.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4141.0,4158.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/189","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"[BOOKMARK: PART 12]\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Maybe you can define the term \"grace.\" What do you mean by precisely? Adhishthana or...?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4158.0,4178.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/190","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: I'm in a funny position. I remember-- I asked my guru, I said, \"Isn't-- aren't grace and karma the same thing?\" And he said, \"I won't discuss that.\" [Laughs] So I don't really know. [Laughter] From my point of view they're roughly within the same domain. That it isn't grace in the sense of light-- somebody doing something in a compassionate act free of the law, it's within the law that something happens, which you define in the sense of something being done -- you call it grace.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4178.0,4212.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/191","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: You prefer to go as far as that rational?\r\n\r\n\r\nRAM DASS: Hmm?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4212.0,4215.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/192","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: You prefer to go far-- as far as that, to be rational.\r\n\r\n\r\nRAM DASS: Yeah, I'll go that far--\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: You think so?\r\n\r\n\r\nRAM DASS: --yeah.\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Yeah?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4215.0,4222.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/193","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: It's-- you know, it's scary. It takes it out of the domain of the romance--\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Well--\r\n\r\n\r\nRAM DASS: --but it's okay.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4222.0,4227.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/194","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: That's creates the change of juxtaposition somewhere. [Laughs]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4227.0,4235.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/195","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: No, I don't think so. It just clarifies the fact that one awakens as it is one's karma to awaken. And that if it happens that there's a physical plane teacher that's the vehicle for it, great; it may be a leaf falling or it may be an astral being or it may be hitting your head or falling off a ladder.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4235.0,4256.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/196","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: How about idea of transcending karma? That's ideally supposed to be enlightenment as that you can act freely without karmic debts.\r\n\r\n\r\nRAM DASS: Mhmm.\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Because you don't make mistakes.\r\n\r\n\r\nRAM DASS: Mhmm.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4256.0,4273.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/197","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: How about that?\r\n\r\n\r\nRAM DASS: What do you mean \"how about that?\"?\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: How about that, you know, I mean--\r\n\r\n\r\nRAM DASS: That's the end point. That's the end point of it.\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: End point of it. So there is--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4273.0,4281.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/198","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: And a being who is functioning outside of karma.\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Yeah.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4281.0,4284.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/199","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: But just because they are capable of functioning outside of karma doesn't necessarily mean they function outside of the law of-- the dharmic law, which would be my karma from their point of view.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4284.0,4297.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/200","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Well I mean isn't there magic that can--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4297.0,4303.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/201","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: Only appearing so from another level.\r\n\r\n\r\nDUNCAN CAMPBELL: Another level? [Laughter]\r\n\r\n\r\nRAM DASS: Yeah, [laughter] you know...  [Trungpa Rinpoche laughs]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4303.0,4313.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/202","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"DUNCAN CAMPBELL: What is this levels about?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4313.0,4314.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/203","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: Miracles only seem miraculous when you don't know how it works. This seems miraculous if you don't know about this whole production. Which I don't, so there's... [laughs; laughter]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4314.0,4323.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/204","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Well it's... We had to be very careful on that, on the naivety and devotion, seemingly. Maybe somebody else can discuss about this, their--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4323.0,4339.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/205","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"[BOOKMARK: PART 13]\r\n\r\n\r\nDUNCAN CAMPBELL: Well it seems to me that the problem of devotion, as such, in any situation, is that a lot of people in America have come from either a Christian tradition or a Judaic tradition, which involved a certain devotional respect for that tradition. And at some point in our lives, that somehow became hollow and empty. And we became somewhat cynical about it because it had just become an empty form. And then there took place this sort of growing interest in Eastern traditions, because they seem to speak to some of us from a psychological perspective, a more direct perspective about \"who I am and the struggles I have with my own neurotic personality,\" and it made that link. But even in these Eastern traditions there is a devotional aspect. And it seems that the problem is how to properly get into that kind of devotional feeling from your own personal point of view, without making it a self-deceptive trap, the same kind of duality that you see in theocratic religions, where God is there and he's very far out, and he's all that is, and you're somehow nothing and you're working on that dualistic model in trying to attain that.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4339.0,4418.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/206","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: It's not very far along the path that you begin to live with paradox very comfortably. I can live with the fact that I can say that grace and karma are the same thing, and at the same moment I can love my guru and wait upon his grace, and live in both in those places without any apparent contradiction. You know, I mean there is a contradiction, but I don't feel discomforted by it. In other words, I don't demand that all of my-- the vehicle of opening the heart and loving something outside, and surrendering to it and that whole relationship in any way is unusable because of my understanding of the law of karma. To pit those against one another just seems to me a very early kind of understanding of either the intellect or bhakti.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4418.0,4476.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/207","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"DUNCAN CAMPBELL: But that brings us back again to the basic question of the interplay between the teacher and the student, that what's happening between this teacher and the student is not just that the student is honoring the teacher in a very bhakti devotional way, but actually the teacher, at least in the Buddhist tradition, is coming down very heavy on the student from time to time, and pointing out his self-deception, in what can be a very violent way at times. And if one has not made that process of commitment to the relationship, that could be so freakish that you would just shy away from it and go off to some other technique because it would be more comfortable. And I think that's the nitty-gritty that we're really trying to talk about. It seems that way to me--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4476.0,4515.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/208","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"[BOOKMARK: PART 14]\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Maybe we should discuss about what does actually mean bhakti, which has popular ideas, as well as very esoteric meanings behind it as well. What does mean bhakti, by bhakti. [To Ram Dass] Can you define the meaning of bhakti? I think that a lot of problems that we come up is that we take words advantage already, that not knowing what does it really mean.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4515.0,4547.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/209","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: Well, actually it's a very interesting word, because it has a lot of... Perhaps if I describe within the Bhagavad Gita the way in which bhakti is reflected, that will deal with your question. The sadhak arrives at the Brahmanic state, at which point where that being has transcended ego or transcended the gunas. At that point, they are in a position of freedom to perceive the [UNCLEAR: purusha atman?] or to perceive Krishna. And at that point, their actions henceforth become dharmic. And their relation to Krishna is one of being within him and yet separate from him. And the relationship is cemented by a devotional stance, okay.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4547.0,4613.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/210","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Mhmm. Well there may be some problems with that, in terms of how does that differ from an ordinary love affair?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4613.0,4629.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/211","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: It's not needful. It's-- there is one as well as two simultaneously.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4629.0,4639.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/212","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Well all of those happens in an ordinary love affair. If you are really in good--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4639.0,4645.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/213","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: If you're really in it, you're in it, sure.\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: --in it, you are in it yeah. If you're really in love--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4645.0,4648.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/214","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: Well I don't know what you mean by \"ordinary love affair.\" I don't know what your [laughing] ordinary love affair is.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4648.0,4651.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/215","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Ordinary, yeah. When someone really fall in love, when somebody really fall in love.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4651.0,4654.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/216","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: Well what does \"really fall in love\" mean? I-- there are many levels, there's Christ love, really fall into Christ love?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4654.0,4659.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/217","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: No. No, I'm talking about just--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4659.0,4660.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/218","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: Fall into passionate love, you want. Biochemical love?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4660.0,4662.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/219","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: --sexual, biochemical. In the very ordinary sense, you know, that all the romantic Romeo and Juliet.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4662.0,4672.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/220","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: Well that's within the realm of polarities, and this isn't.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4672.0,4676.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/221","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: But they feel union.\r\n\r\n\r\nRAM DASS: Hmm?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4676.0,4678.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/222","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: They feel a sense of union at the same time.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4678.0,4680.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/223","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: At that moment they do transcend--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4680.0,4682.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/224","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: They share same problems--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4682.0,4683.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/225","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: They transcend the fact that they're lovers.\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Yeah.\r\n\r\n\r\nRAM DASS: They become love.\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Yeah, which is absolute--\r\n\r\n\r\nRAM DASS: Which is the place, again.\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Ultimate love.\r\n\r\n\r\nRAM DASS: Yeah.\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Yeah.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4683.0,4691.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/226","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: There are moments in the ordinary love affairs that are the same thing.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4691.0,4693.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/227","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: That helps, that now we have sort out. [Laughs]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4693.0,4696.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/228","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: Yeah. That's why Krishna and the gopis are that example, of the relation to Radha, to Krishna.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4696.0,4701.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/229","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Yeah. Right, yeah. [Laughter] Well, since we worked out the [laughing] idea of bhakti, [laughs] maybe that helps us to plow through what we're trying to achieve. [Panel laughs]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4701.0,4722.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/230","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"[BOOKMARK: PART 15]\r\n\r\n\r\nDUNCAN CAMPBELL: Well there's one question before we open it up to the general audience that I'd to ask. In that in my own experience, let's say going back to psychedelics, there was-- you started out from a state of being sort of confused and neurotic, and you took acid or you took mescaline or whatever, and you had a certain, what felt like a kind of insight, you got high. And the world seemed open and beautiful. But then you came down. And what I have found in my own experience, with practices like mantra for instance, devotional practices, is that you can in fact change your state of consciousness, through a devotional practice of mantra. But it feels to me very much like reproducing the same kind of high-low situation, as with psychedelics. Like you get high after chanting a mantra for three hours, but then somehow, you're still left with how do I come back to the mundane, physical world? And I'd just to present that as a question, in terms of bhakti. As a model, as a workable problem.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4722.0,4791.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/231","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: Yeah, it isn't really-- Duncan, it isn't really that simple, because while you came down from psychedelics, you didn't come down to exactly the same place you started from.\r\n\r\n\r\nDUNCAN CAMPBELL: Oh, of course not. Sure, I agree with that.\r\n\r\n\r\n[Trungpa Rinpoche leans over and whispers something to Ram Dass; Duncan Campbell laughs]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4791.0,4809.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/232","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: Uh... [Laughter] You know, I think that almost-- most practices have the entrapment in them of the experience connected with the practice. And that that isn't ultimately what the thing is, it's just a concomitant of it if you will. And I don't see that any-- the either-- that any practices don't have that in them actually. And... there is a what I call a \"cheap high\" quality about a lot of devotional practices. But at the same moment there are transformations that are going on. And it's really the readiness of the individual as to-- like we sing every night in the class, and if you look out people are doing kirtan at many different levels: some people are singing, and some people are involved in kirtan, they are really involved in the repetition of the name of God in a much more profound way. And there is a transformation going on in their being. And as far as I'm concerned that's as legitimate a practice as meditation. No more entrapping into highs than meditational practices are.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4809.0,4886.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/233","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Well we have a problem there, is seem to be is getting back to tradition. That those words are made by somebody, and we are handing over to students. And we should really clarify our greater audience that we -- more than this people here -- that we should really tell them what is all about. And we've been jumping back and forth, this particular discussion is, that tradition, lineage, and freedom, at the same time getting back to some kind of the habits that developed by our forefathers. And we have that kind of problem there. So I wish you could say something more, so that our audience -- in the greater audience -- could relate with this. And so they may be able to chant, may be able to sit in meditation, so we could help them in some sense. Which is very necessary.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4886.0,4955.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/234","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: You want me to legitimize [laughing] tradition?\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: No--\r\n\r\n\r\nRAM DASS: Don't get me started. [Laughs]\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: --techniques or whatever. Well--\r\n\r\n\r\nRAM DASS: Yeah, I hear the point you're making--\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Yeah.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4955.0,4968.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/235","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: And it-- I think that we're, for the sake of discussion we get into issues of-- we debate about tradition in order to make it clarified, but it is certainly true that what-- the way in which we break out of one tradition is by juxtaposing it with another tradition, or confronting traditions. And that's part of what coming out of the Western psychology tradition and going into Hinduism as a tradition, and chanting Krishna's name, definitely changes my perception of psychology in that sense. And what the spiritual tradition in America is doing is reinvesting a lot of our Western traditions with spirit--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4968.0,5012.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/236","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Quite simply, that chanting mantras, what does it do to you? And what happens? You know, a very simple-minded approach. That maybe I'm taking on Duncan's role, somewhat.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5012.0,5029.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/237","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"DUNCAN CAMPBELL: The simple-minded approach. [Laughter]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5029.0,5031.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/238","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: [Laughing] It's preemptive simple-mindedness.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5031.0,5034.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/239","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Well we have to tell the world, that it's sacredness as well as it's misunderstandings that happens, you know.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5034.0,5044.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/240","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: But the sacred-- you don't have to tell people that it ought to be sacred. That the sacredness-- that's why there aren't the secrets in a way-- people can profane something, but then when they begin to appreciate what it's about then they invest the reverence. You don't tell people they ought to invest reverence. I mean I feel this stuff is available, and as people get more sophisticated, they honor it more. Like I've come to your lectures where your students sit with their feet facing you and up. Now I know that out of the tradition I come out of in the East that would be an affront to a teacher. And to them that isn't that, and they don't know, they don't understand, and they don't reverence the role of the teacher properly. I stand up when you walk in.  [Pointing to Duncan Campbell] He is one of your students, he doesn't stand up when you walk in. Now that's a difference in tradition, all right. [Panel laughs] I think-- I'm not saying that I'm-- it's right or wrong, I'm merely saying that these things come out of a certain kind of understanding and a certain kind of feeling. Not out of \"oughts\" or \"shoulds\" or you know...","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5044.0,5107.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/241","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Well I think we are-- it seems like that we are back to the Buddhist bag, at that point. That experiential-- which makes a very awkward moment here. [Laughs]\r\n\r\n\r\nRAM DASS: Makes you what?\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Awkward moment here, somehow. That we are--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5107.0,5128.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/242","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: I don't think-- the Buddhists preempt that, I mean that's...","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5128.0,5130.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/243","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Well, it's Naropa Institute's--\r\n\r\n\r\nRAM DASS: [Laughs]\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Which is--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5130.0,5136.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/244","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"[BOOKMARK: PART 16]\r\n\r\n\r\nDUNCAN CAMPBELL: One thing that I'm curious about, is like what role for instance is there for negativity, let's say, in bhakti practice? How does one deal with one's own negativity, anger and irritation and so on and so forth, in terms of that system?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5136.0,5154.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/245","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: My guru said to me, \"Ram Dass, give up anger.\" And I said to him, \"Can I even use it as a teaching device?\" And he said [shouting] \"Nay!\" [Laughter] There's the whole story. [Laughter]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5154.0,5169.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/246","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"DUNCAN CAMPBELL: What do we find in the Buddhist tradition as far as that's concerned? [Laughter; applause]\r\n\r\n\r\n[Trungpa Rinpoche gestures to John Baker; laughter]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5169.0,5185.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/247","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"JOHN BAKER: Well. [Laughter] It's funny, I was listening to you describe bhakti practice and thinking about my own, and thinking, \"Jesus, [laughing] I've really got the wrong end of the stick.\" [Laughs; laughter]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5185.0,5202.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/248","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: It's not too late to change, John. [Laughter]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5202.0,5209.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/249","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"DUNCAN CAMPBELL: But the ironic thing Ram Dass, is that *you're* the one on the panel who's always talking about the necessity of giving into despair, and entrapment and really feeling your own suffering.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5209.0,5219.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/250","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: I'm such a romantic. [Laughter]\r\n\r\n\r\nDUNCAN CAMPBELL: Uh, well.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5219.0,5222.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/251","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: It's just a big ego trap, you know, it's not--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5222.0,5224.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/252","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"JOHN BAKER: No, but I mean that's a very real question. You know, like to really feel your own despair and your own negativity and your own neurosis and somehow accept it as the manure and also build the field of bodhi. You know, and there does seem sometimes to be this kind of deceptive--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5224.0,5239.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/253","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: Devotional practices aren't all positive and loving and beautiful. There is a trem-- if you read the poets, Rumi and Kabir, there's a tremendous -- Tulsidas -- there's a tremendous amount of anguish at the separation, and the feeling of poverty if you will, you know, and that's part of the devotional quality of the sadhana too.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5239.0,5261.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/254","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"JOHN BAKER: I think you know what we're getting at is just-- it's the way in which you come at the practice. When you sit in meditation, Buddhist style, and if you have some model in your head of what it is you want to have, what you want to experience in your practice, it's a real drag. I mean you know you'll hear that one a hundred times, a thousand times, ten thousand times, and then you move onto another thing. I think it's the same thing in-- it-- I-- it *has* to be the same thing in devotional practice; you know I've done kirtan and all that. If you have a model of how you want to be as you do kirtan -- if you want to be loving, high, blissful, in touch with God -- it's going to, eventually, if you do it long enough, just be a solid drag. I think the only thing that what we're talking about here is, it's the way that you come to the practice, the sense of realism, the willingness to be what you are as you do your practicing with--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5261.0,5314.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/255","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: If you come to it with any stance at all--\r\n\r\n\r\nJOHN BAKER: Right.\r\n\r\n\r\nRAM DASS: --it's going to turn out to be a drag.\r\n\r\n\r\nJOHN BAKER: Right.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5314.0,5318.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/256","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: And then you're going to have to give that stance up. Like when we do an all night chant, the first couple of hours you're chanting for one motivation, then you get bored with that and you say \"ah screw it\" and you start to chant for another reason. And the whole thing keeps opening and opening and opening and opening or closing and closing, depending on where-- what stage you're at.\r\n\r\n\r\nJOHN BAKER: Right.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5318.0,5335.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/257","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: There isn't a model but there is change.\r\n\r\n\r\nJOHN BAKER: Right. [Laughs]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5335.0,5341.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/258","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"[BOOKMARK: AUDIENCE QUESTIONS]\r\n\r\n\r\nDUNCAN CAMPBELL: Well actually for a change, I think this might be an ideal time to open up the discussion to questions from the general audience. We have microphones and if anybody would like to ask a question, if they could simply raise their hand.\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Hopefully that questions could be precise, because you are-- we are dealing with a larger audience at this point, and that there is experience of what you have experienced could be shared with the rest of people. So if you can be precise as much as you can, that would be greatly appreciated. On behalf of United States of America. [Laughter]\r\n\r\n\r\nDUNCAN CAMPBELL: Yeah, where are the microphones? Oh. [Laughter] No.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5341.0,5421.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/259","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"[BOOKMARK: QUESTION 1]\r\n\r\n\r\nSPEAKER2: It was raining outside with a totally clear sky, the sun was out -- that's grace. Bhakti is appreciating and understanding that -- that's bhakti. I wondered if you could discuss how psychology is a religious framework, in the same way as Buddhism is a religious framework. They're both created by the human mind, they don't come out of the cloudless sky. And because of that, the role playing, the reflection on the ego, comes out of that. Could you talk about what's beyond that, the cloudless sky, beyond that?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5421.0,5466.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/260","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"DUNCAN CAMPBELL: Would you like any one particular member of the panel to address themselves to that?\r\n\r\n\r\nSPEAKER2: [INAUDIBLE WORDS] [Laughter]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5466.0,5483.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/261","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: [Gesturing to Trungpa Rinpoche; laughter] You're the cloudless sky person. [Laughs; laughter]\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: [Gestures to Ram Dass] [Laughter]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5483.0,5494.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/262","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: [Laughs] I wish I had my John Baker around, so I'd \"John\". [Laughs; laughter]\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: He's yours.\r\n\r\n\r\nRAM DASS: He's mine. [Laughs] John! [Laughs] He just gave you to me. John, answer that. [Laughter; applause]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5494.0,5526.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/263","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"JOHN BAKER: I mean what can you say about a cloudless sky, except that it doesn't have any clouds? I don't think any of the traditions try and describe the-- what you get after, at the very end of the end of the end. They always describe it in terms of negatives. The absence of neurosis. Well that's not fair either. The tongue stops. I think the only difference between psychology as a religion and say Buddhism as a religion, is in the lack of model that Buddhism offers for the goal. With the feeling being that any model is another entrapment. So that the closest you get to it in the tantras is a kind of poetic evocation of-- if you could even say that. Whereas I think that Western psychology in my understanding of it, *is* offering some kind of a model, however vague, of what the goal is. Both of them obviously are trying to work with the problem of human suffering, and I think to that sense they're both spiritual.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5526.0,5621.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/264","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: All institutions have roles, rituals, rules, language, structure. The difference between participants in institutions is the degree of attachment they have to the roles they're participating in. And the quality of a living Buddhist tradition would be that everybody is playing their role perfectly, but there's nobody home, would be one way of saying it. And most of the methods we have are within traditions, in order to get not free in sense of rejecting the tradition, but not attached, at the same moment fulfilling it, because the tradition is functional in the transmission of the dharma.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5621.0,5668.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/265","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"JOHN BAKER: But wouldn't you also say, that the only way that you can be fulfilling your role perfectly with nobody home, is to total commitment to the role?\r\n\r\n\r\nRAM DASS: Yes.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5668.0,5679.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/266","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"JOHN BAKER: You can't be splitting yourself--\r\n\r\n\r\nRAM DASS: Total involvement.\r\n\r\n\r\nJOHN BAKER: --and saying, \"I'm detached. I'm uninvolved.\"","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5679.0,5685.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/267","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: No you can't. If you're saying \"I'm detached\" you're not; that's a different kind of a thing.\r\n\r\n\r\nJOHN BAKER: Okay.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5685.0,5686.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/268","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: It's total involvement and no attachment. But it's not this self-conscious non-attach-- \"I'm not attached\"; that's an attachment.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5686.0,5694.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/269","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"JOHN BAKER: Right. I mean I'm--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5694.0,5695.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/270","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"DUNCAN CAMPBELL: Wait, hear what he's saying.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5695.0,5696.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/271","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"JOHN BAKER: I'm just concerned with what we're telling people, that if you tell people that they're supposed to walk around and feel detached from what they are, that that's very different than telling people to *be* what they are.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5696.0,5705.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/272","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: No. Yeah. But it's-- well, yeah. That was a curve.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5705.0,5714.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/273","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Why don't we give up the whole thing?\r\n\r\n\r\nRAM DASS: Huh?\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Why don't we give up the whole discussion.\r\n\r\n\r\nDUNCAN CAMPBELL: Okay, take another question.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5714.0,5719.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/274","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: As far as regard the sun and the moon and the rain is concerned, that now rain is died and beyond that is sunshine and then tonight there will be sunset. [Laughter; applause]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5719.0,5740.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/275","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"[BOOKMARK: QUESTION 2]\r\n\r\n\r\nSPEAKER3: I'd like to address this to Ram Dass and Rinpoche. I came to Naropa after finishing a master's degree in counselling. And I found myself behind that desk towards the end of my internship really freaking out. Like these people are as-- I'm as flipped out as they are, and I-- sometimes I felt like I couldn't offer them anything. And if anything I did offer was just was like my own opinion of my own trip, like you know, \"Why don't you try sitting,\" or \"Why don't you do this.\" I didn't know, so I wound up coming to Naropa, leaving that desk, in hopes of trying to find a model or a framework in which I could somehow clear my head a little bit, so I could hear more what the person was saying, what they needed, and what I-- and then I would be more open to give them something, not from me, but more just of what they needed. And I don't think that was chickening out. But I got the feeling, Rinpoche, that when you were talking to Ram Dass in a way that was chickening out. And so if you two guys could resolve that question I-- [laughter] I'd appreciate it. [Laughter]\r\n\r\n\r\nRAM DASS: [Gesturing to Trungpa Rinpoche or Jim Green] It's your question finally.\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: [Gesturing to Jim Green] Do you want to do it? [Laughter]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5740.0,5829.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/276","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: I would like to throw it back, the question, at you. What do you mean by \"chickening out\"?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5829.0,5846.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/277","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER3: Chickening out in the sense of-- well the way I felt it coming was, because I left the desk because I came here and left the people that supposedly were in need, that that was a--\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Supposedly what?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5846.0,5865.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/278","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER3: They were need of some help. That I was copping out on my responsibility as a counselor. But I got to the point where I thought, \"Fuck! I don't know what I'm doing in this place. I don't know why I'm helping these people. I don't even know who I am!\" And it just became absurd and I came here. [Laughs; laughter; applause]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5865.0,5892.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/279","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Welcome to Naropa Institute. [Laughter; applause] I'm glad you're with us.\r\n\r\n\r\nRAM DASS: The theater of the absurd.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5892.0,5912.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/280","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"You're not feeding any more to that question from that?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5912.0,5916.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/281","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Do you want to say some few words?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5916.0,5918.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/282","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: [Laughs] I feel like we're walking away from the desk if we don't.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5918.0,5923.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/283","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Okay, well go ahead. [Laughter; applause]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5923.0,5934.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/284","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: In-- there is a style of sadhana which is very much a tradition, which could be called \"the spiral\", in which you move into the marketplace, until you realize the finiteness of your predicament, or the level at which you're not doing karma yoga, or however you want to say it, or the way in which you are perpetuating suffering. And with that kind of wisdom you may go back into the cave, or to Naropa Institute, or into another setting which gives you a new perception which brings you back in a new level, which takes you back and forth around and around, in and out. And that process which seems sequential at first, and later becomes more and more synchronous, that process is all part of the relieving of human suffering, so that it's in a way, it's too narrow a view. I mean I feel that the-- I could answer very clearly when Rinpoche said, \"Should I have left my desk?\" Yeah, damn right I should have left the desk, and it's okay to come back to the desk, and it's okay to leave the desk. And it's okay to trust my heart as to what I need, whether I need to come to Naropa or stay at the desk, because that's the way the guru is guiding me, so that ultimately I can be a statement of the dharma for all beings. Is that dealing with your question?\r\n\r\n\r\nSPEAKER3: [Nods]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5934.0,6026.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/285","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Welcome to Naropa. [Laughter]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6026.0,6039.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/286","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"[BOOKMARK: QUESTION 3]\r\n\r\n\r\nSPEAKER4: I'd like to address this question to Rinpoche. Do you think that the practice of bhakti, devotional practice, is one that can bring people in harmony with the teachings of the Buddha?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6039.0,6055.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/287","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: That's a discussion that involves with the approach of Buddha. I think basically that we could say quite safely that since Buddhism is a non-theistic tradition, that it is not possible. When you trust somebody you have a ground to trust it. Either that person came from the lineage of distrustfulness, therefore you can trust in somebody. Or else that the lineage come from that ground, that person is being trusting all along all the time, which according to Buddhism it's called \"frivolous\"; one of the part of the fourth skandhas, [laughs] categories actually, according to the techniques and traditions. According to Buddhism, that you don't even worship Buddha, which a lot of people misunderstand. That we regard Buddha as example, the Enlightened One, somebody who had achieved enlightenment in one lifetime.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6055.0,6140.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/288","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So I think the question of devotion that exist in the tantric Buddhist tradition, but it is a different kind of devotion rather than just purely trusting or expanding oneself to the level that you can complete dissolve yourself; everything's done for you, particularly. But we are talking about very pragmatic development: that if you want to trust you got to be a son of your father, and you got to suck the nipples of your mother, and you have to wear diapers, and you have to eat baby food [laughs], you grow up, and you go to colleges. Then you graduate from your college, you become proud person of son of your father. It's something like that. That's why Buddhism is referred as humanistic, that as we as Buddhists we don't believe anything, except what is happening on the spot. So we could borrow the traditional phrase by saying that \"actions speaks loud than word.\" [Applause]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6140.0,6225.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/289","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"DUNCAN CAMPBELL: Well there does seem to be a certain irony in the sense that the Kagyu tradition in Tibetan Buddhism is known as the lineage of devotion. And what we're not talking about it would seem a very polarized kind of distinction between intellect and heart, but really trying to arrive at a proper understanding of devotion itself, and that there really is no polarity.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6225.0,6252.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/290","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: According to the Kagyu tradition, devotion is based on that of desolateness of your ego, which invites enormous sense of a romantic notion that you can make to your guru, your teacher. That because of sense everything is *so* desolate, that there's nothing to hang on to. And the guru provide that kind of mechanism already, therefore you can make love to your guru, and fall in love to him, and whatever he does, whatever he said, becomes very powerful message for you. And that is a part of the devotional thing. Rather than devotion from sake of theistic traditions particularly. [Laughter]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6252.0,6300.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/291","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"DUNCAN CAMPBELL: Do you want to add anything to that Ram Dass, before we take the next question?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6300.0,6304.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/292","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: He's doing fine until the last throwaway line, you know. Because I think that's-- that out of the desolation comes this making love to the guru, or making love to the inner guru or God, until the merging occurs in which case the whole thing becomes irrelevant really.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6304.0,6323.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/293","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Well we're not talking about God at this point actually.\r\n\r\n\r\nRAM DASS: Well god, guru, and self--\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: But we are talking about guru--\r\n\r\n\r\nRAM DASS: --are the same thing from where I'm standing.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6323.0,6329.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/294","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Well guru is very real, and God might be there somewhere -- I don't know where. You [INAUDIBLE]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6329.0,6338.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/295","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: You don't do any devotional practices with visualizations of--\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Well those act--\r\n\r\n\r\nRAM DASS: --buddhas of other periods and so on?\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Yeah.\r\n\r\n\r\nRAM DASS: They're real.\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Expressions of yourself, you know.\r\n\r\n\r\nRAM DASS: Sure. Well so is the guru and so is God.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6338.0,6351.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/296","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Well I think there is a very problematic situation, that I'm sure the true theologians will disagree.\r\n\r\n\r\nRAM DASS: [Laughs] If I meet one I'll ask him. [Laughs; laughter]\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Yeah.\r\n\r\n\r\nDUNCAN CAMPBELL: Is there a true theologian in the audience to ask the next question?\r\n\r\n\r\nJOHN BAKER: Uh...\r\n\r\n\r\nDUNCAN CAMPBELL: Go ahead.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6351.0,6375.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/297","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"JOHN BAKER: I think, you know, we could be familiar with the feeling of desolation that breeds a great longing. And so that you can long for release from your desolation. [Laughs]\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Well...","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6375.0,6391.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/298","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"JOHN BAKER: [Laughs] Is this the kind-- and then that kind of longing can be kind of translated into a longing for God, or a longing for the guru or a longing for whatever, yidam.\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Well--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6391.0,6401.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/299","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"JOHN BAKER: I mean that could be taken as devotion. I-- if there's a difference between that and what you're speaking of, the love affair coming out of desolation, could you make that clear?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6401.0,6411.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/300","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Well, the guru is a person you know already, you talk to him, and on the earthly body. That if you have somebody else, you know, herukas, dakinis, Jehovah, whoever you have, but those are purely expressions of a human vision that is far gone, beyond personal relationships. That is why the traditional tantric point of view is that you don't prostrate to your herukas as gurus, but you prostrate your guru who is in the form of dharmakaya; personally you prostrate. You do 100,000 prostrations, you take 100,000 recitations of refuge formula; you do that personally. So there is something very real is taking place, opposed to mentioning Joe Smith, or Dick Cavett. [Laughter]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6411.0,6480.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/301","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: But who you know-- who you think is out there as your \"real guru\" as you're saying, it is only your projection anyway, so who you making love to anyway?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6480.0,6488.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/302","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Well, your parents are also projection from that point of view.\r\n\r\n\r\nRAM DASS: Yes.\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: And yourself included--\r\n\r\n\r\nRAM DASS: Yes.\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: --but at *least* there is some reference point that--\r\n\r\n\r\nRAM DASS: Oh, it's all so--\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: --you know there *is* something. Some \"thing.\" That you don't have to make up name for them--\r\n\r\n\r\nRAM DASS: You don't make it all up--\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: --for they or them or--\r\n\r\n\r\nRAM DASS: --it's all as real as this is.\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: If you like, but that back to square one in any case. [Laughs]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6488.0,6511.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/303","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"DUNCAN CAMPBELL: Well it seems to come back to that whole notion of, you know, like there is obviously [Trungpa Rinpoche pats Ram Dass's leg; laughter] the guru principle which exists in the world. But on the other hand if one prematurely gets into a notion of guru principle and detaches himself from the sheer reality of relating to another physical being with all that entails, it could be very self-deceptive and very free for the ego to trip out, on its own notions of what it really was honoring, without having any feedback or any reference point to correct itself.\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Sure.\r\n\r\n\r\nRAM DASS: If there were no feedback.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6511.0,6547.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/304","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"JOHN BAKER: What I'm trying to get at is: is there a difference in the quality of the love affair between the student and the guru that comes out of desolation? Between that love affair, and that of a person who is longing for something which he doesn't have, which he finds in his mind -- in the experience of his mind -- say the image of God or of whatever. Do you see what I mean? Between-- is there a difference in the love affair between the student and the real guru and that of an imaginary guru. What's the quality of the difference?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6547.0,6582.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/305","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: There is enormous. One is imaginary, obviously; you know that you made it up. Other one is that you have experience already on earth. It's--\r\n\r\n\r\nRAM DASS: Well--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6582.0,6595.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/306","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: --seem to be very simple. Your parents can warn you about, \"You might get accident, you should drive your car properly.\" And your parents could show slides of kinds of collision that she or he have seen -- they have seen -- and indoctrinate you how car driving is dangerous. That's a concept. But when person, children of such parents, get into the accident, properly, and feels car collision actually taking place, then you don't need parents' indoctrination, but you *know it*, what's it's all about.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6595.0,6639.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/307","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"JOHN BAKER: So are you saying that the love affair with the guru is like a car crash?\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Yeah. [Laughter; applause]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6639.0,6649.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/308","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: Last year my guru left his body, Rinpoche. Would you then say that at that point he ceases to be functional as a guru?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6649.0,6657.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/309","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: He is a part of your subconscious mind, as well as jnana state, whatever, you know, potentialities of wakening you up. And he only comes in the form of a dream, subconscious mind, which he wakes you, constantly. But on the other hand, that if you want to go to India and meet \"the\" guy, meet the person, that you don't have room for do that, because he doesn't exist.\r\n\r\n\r\nRAM DASS: Hmm.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6657.0,6697.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/310","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Maybe you should go back and see, and in his empty room, he might be there; that's possibility. Talking about magic. And maybe that might be very creative thing to do.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6697.0,6703.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/311","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: Hmm. I'll do it! I'll look, and I'll let you know. [Laughs; Trungpa Rinpoche laughs]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6703.0,6711.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/312","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"[BOOKMARK: QUESTION 4]\r\n\r\n\r\n[Panel confers off-mic]\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: I think we should...\r\n\r\n\r\nSPEAKER5: [Singing to tune of \"Oh Lord Won't You Buy Me a Mercedes Benz\"]\r\n\r\n\r\nOh Lord won't you make me a mystic like them.\r\n\r\n\r\nI like doing mantra, I meditate each day.\r\n\r\n\r\nI pray for deliverance. I long to see your face.\r\n\r\n\r\nOh Lord, won't you send me your transcending grace.\r\n\r\n\r\nOh lord, won't you make my dharma my goal.\r\n\r\n\r\nExtinguish my ego, and clarify my soul.\r\n\r\n\r\nI search this whole lifetime, for truth that is real.\r\n\r\n\r\nOh Lord, help me realize my bodhisattva ideal.\r\n\r\n\r\n[Applause]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6711.0,6784.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/313","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And now folks, a word from our sponsors.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6784.0,6788.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/314","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: We know what you've been doing! [Laughter]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6788.0,6806.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40381/annotation/315","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"[BOOKMARK: CLOSING REMARKS]\r\n\r\n\r\nDUNCAN CAMPBELL: You've been listening to Open Secret [laughter; laughs], a series of discussions sponsored by Naropa Institute in Boulder, Colorado. I'd like to thank the people that have been with us tonight: Jim Green, John Baker, Ram Dass, and Chogyam Trungpa Rinpoche. [Applause]\r\n\r\n\r\n[Chogyam Trungpa Institute - Unedited Verbatim Transcript]\r\n\r\n\r\n[Copyright Diana J. Mukpo All Rights Reserved - Not to be Distributed or Reproduced]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6806.0,6889.92"}]},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382","type":"AnnotationPage","label":{"en":["19740711VCTR1-Captions [Transcript]"]},"items":[{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/316","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"[Audience laughter]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=23.95,30.065"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/317","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"DUNCAN CAMPBELL:\nWelcome to Open Secret,\n[laughter]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=72.3,74.84"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/318","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"a series of radio\nand television discussions","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=74.84,78.67"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/319","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that are being filmed and\nrecorded this summer","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=78.67,80.32"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/320","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"in Boulder,Colorado\nat Naropa Institute.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=80.32,85.07"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/321","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Naropa Institute was founded\nby Chogyam Trungpa Rinpoche,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=85.07,89.01"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/322","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"to create a ground in which\nthe Western academic","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=89.01,93.66"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/323","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and artistic\nand religious traditions","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=93.66,95.87"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/324","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"could interact\nwith those of the East.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=95.87,100.24"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/325","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"This evening we are discussing\nthe general topic","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=100.24,103.45"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/326","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"of psychology\nEast and West.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=103.45,106.41"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/327","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"We have with us an audience\nof over a thousand people","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=106.41,109.75"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/328","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"who have been drawn primarily\nfrom the courses","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=109.75,112.41"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/329","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"at Naropa Institute\nwhich have been taught","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=112.41,114.39"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/330","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"by Chogyam Trungpa Rinpoche\nand Ram Dass.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=114.39,118.84"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/331","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And before proceeding\ninto the discussion itself","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=118.84,121.92"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/332","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I would like to introduce\nthe people with us.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=121.92,124.7"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/333","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"We have Jim Green,\nChogyam Trungpa Rinpoche,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=124.7,129.73"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/334","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Ram Dass --formerly\nRichard Alpert [laughter]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=129.73,132.4"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/335","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"-- and John Baker.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=132.4,134.76"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/336","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"[Applause]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=134.76,149.77"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/337","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"It is open secret,\nthat's true!","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=149.77,152.95"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/338","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"[Laughs; laughter]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=152.95,163.69"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/339","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"All of these people are faculty\nmembers at Naropa Institute","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=163.69,167.3"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/340","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"during this first\nsummer session.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=167.3,169.64"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/341","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Jim Green has taught philosophy\nat Columbia and Antioch,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=169.64,173.36"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/342","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and for the last five years","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=173.36,174.62"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/343","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"has been doing psychotherapy\nin Berkeley.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=174.62,177.17"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/344","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And he's teaching courses\nat Naropa","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=177.17,178.88"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/345","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"on philosophy and psychology.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=178.88,181.095"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/346","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Chogyam Trungpa Rinpoche,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=181.095,183.31"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/347","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"the president\nof Naropa Institute,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=183.31,185.97"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/348","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"is teaching a course\non basic Buddhist meditation,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=185.97,189.12"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/349","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and on the Tibetan\nBuddhist path.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=189.12,192.94"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/350","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Ram Dass is teaching a course on\nthe yogas of the Bhagavad Gita.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=192.94,197.81"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/351","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"John Baker, the vice-president\nof Naropa Institute,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=197.81,201.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/352","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"is teaching courses\nwith Reginald Ray","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=201.0,203.18"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/353","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"on the tantric mahasiddhas\nand saints,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=203.18,205.79"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/354","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and on Buddhism in India,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=205.79,207.72"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/355","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and is in the process of writing\na book on Buddhist psychology.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=207.72,212.91"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/356","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Now it seems to me that perhaps\none way to start this","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=212.91,216.4"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/357","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"would be in terms\nof the notion of ego.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=216.4,219.52"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/358","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"That if we talk about\nthe Western philosophical","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=219.52,222.62"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/359","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"or psychological approach--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=222.62,225.36"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/360","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Who are you?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=225.36,227.01"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/361","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"DUNCAN CAMPBELL:\nMy name is Duncan Campbell,\nI forgot that.[Laughter]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=227.01,231.15"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/362","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I'm the moderator.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=231.15,235.015"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/363","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"We're talking about ego.\n[Laughter; applause]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=235.015,259.35"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/364","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"DUNCAN CAMPBELL:\nOkay, now that I've remembered\nwho I am [laughs; laughter],","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=259.35,264.57"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/365","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I'd like to put the question\nto the general discussion,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=264.57,268.13"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/366","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"as to the different ways","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=268.13,270.05"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/367","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"in which the Western\npsychiatric tradition","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=270.05,273.68"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/368","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and the religious\nand psychological traditions","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=273.68,276.03"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/369","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"of the East approach\nthis notion of ego,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=276.03,279.16"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/370","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"or personal identification.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=279.16,281.25"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/371","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And what the differences\nmight be,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=281.25,282.87"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/372","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and what each of\nthe two traditions","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=282.87,284.59"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/373","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"might have to learn\nfrom each other.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=284.59,288.44"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/374","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"It would seem that\non the members of the panel","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=288.44,290.21"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/375","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"perhaps Ram Dass would be the\nbest qualified to speak to that.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=290.21,295.37"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/376","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"[Laughter]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=295.37,297.13"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/377","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: Especially since\nI have two names.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=297.13,300.12"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/378","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"[Laughs; laughter]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=300.12,310.1"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/379","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Well it's been interesting to me\nover the past twelve years","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=310.1,315.11"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/380","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"to remember that as a\npsychologist, child development,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=315.11,320.93"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/381","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"a developmental psychologist,\none of my major concerns","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=320.93,326.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/382","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"was with theories\nof the developing ego","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=326.0,329.16"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/383","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"of the individual,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=329.16,330.74"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/384","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and the development\nof an ego that has integrity","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=330.74,336.3"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/385","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and that is effective\nin coping with the environment.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=336.3,342.9"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/386","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Working with people at Harvard\nsuch as Erik Erikson,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=342.9,348.26"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/387","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and with behaviorists concerned\nwith converting Freud's ideas","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=350.21,355.48"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/388","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"of the development\nof identification,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=355.48,357.3"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/389","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"the development of personality\nand personality structure,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=357.3,360.61"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/390","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"it seemed at that time as if\nthe ego was a very real,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=360.61,364.7"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/391","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"solid, and necessary part\nof the healthy","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=364.7,375.64"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/392","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"functioning of an organism.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=375.64,378.37"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/393","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And when I started to work\nwith psychedelics it 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ego.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=388.95,392.52"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/396","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And I began to think maybe","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=392.52,393.89"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/397","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"we were going to go\nthe other way now;","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=393.89,396.28"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/398","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that we were now\ngoing to unwind the ego,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=396.28,398.52"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/399","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"or get out from under it.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=398.52,400.59"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/400","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"In Hinduism there is a thing\ncalled the ahamkara","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=400.59,403.24"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/401","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"which is a structure\nlike the ego,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=403.24,406.69"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/402","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and the game is, of awakening,\nis to transcend that structure.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=406.69,411.52"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/403","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Not to get rid of it because\nthe ego is very functional,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=411.52,414.87"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/404","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"but to at least\nnot be attached to it.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=414.87,419.3"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/405","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Seems like a statement\nfor openers.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=419.3,423.08"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/406","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"DUNCAN CAMPBELL:\nWell in the Buddhist tradition","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=425.14,426.47"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/407","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I think the interesting thing","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=426.47,427.67"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/408","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"is that they start\nfrom a concept of no self.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=427.67,431.08"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/409","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"That somehow the whole project\nof involving oneself","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=431.08,434.32"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/410","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"with the Buddhist\nmeditation practice","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=434.32,436.08"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/411","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and with the Buddhist\nsystem of thought,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=436.08,437.97"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/412","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"is to work from a premise that\nin fact the ego doesn't exist,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=437.97,441.74"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/413","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that it's not even there;\nthere some concept of emptiness,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=441.74,445.43"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/414","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that is the ultimate reality\nif we can speak in those terms.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=445.43,449.01"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/415","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And I wondered\nwhat the implications","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=449.01,450.34"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/416","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"of that point of view","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=450.34,451.58"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/417","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"are for dealing\nwith personality,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=451.58,455.17"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/418","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"or neurosis in the life\nof various individuals.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=455.17,458.81"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/419","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"JIM GREEN:\nWell, as a practical matter","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=458.81,461.29"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/420","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"in my experience as a therapist,\nwhat seemed to happen","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=461.29,466.48"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/421","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"is that I was involved\nin people--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=466.48,469.29"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/422","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"with people\nwhose life dramas","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=469.29,471.57"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/423","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"seemed to be more\nor less unsuccessful.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=471.57,473.79"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/424","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And as a therapist my task was\nto help them rewrite the script,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=473.79,476.82"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/425","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"so that there was\na better drama.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=476.82,478.86"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/426","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And to some extent\nwe were successful","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=478.86,481.2"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/427","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and the drama was better.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=481.2,482.8"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/428","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"But it was never\nquite satisfactory;","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=482.8,484.72"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/429","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"there always seemed to be\nsomething quite wrong","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=484.72,486.52"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/430","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"ad infinitum\nabout those dramas.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=486.52,489.04"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/431","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And it seems in some way\nthat the problem was,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=489.04,491.63"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/432","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"not that the drama\nwas quite wrong","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=491.63,493.31"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/433","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"but that there was a drama.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=493.31,494.81"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/434","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"In some way it was\nthe energy in the drama","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=494.81,497.15"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/435","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"which produced the difficulty.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=497.15,499.08"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/436","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And when we worked somehow\nto make the drama less dramatic,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=499.08,503.24"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/437","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"it seemed that a great\nmany problems simply dissolved.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=503.24,508.7"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/438","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: In doing therapy now\nover the past ten years I--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=508.7,512.77"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/439","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"it's interesting that as\nthe role of the therapist,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=512.77,515.53"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/440","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"the concept of what you do\nin relation to another person","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=515.53,518.12"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/441","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"has changed a great deal.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=518.12,519.41"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/442","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Because before it seemed\nvery horizontal:","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=519.41,522.02"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/443","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"you were substituting one ego\nstructure for another,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=522.02,524.21"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/444","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"a more effective one.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=524.21,525.66"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/445","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Now it seems to me\nyou're still doing that,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=525.66,528.18"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/446","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"but you're doing it from a place\nin yourself of not being","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=528.18,530.89"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/447","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"attached to ego structures,\nso that at the same moment","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=530.89,533.45"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/448","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"you're putting one\nin the place of another,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=533.45,535.05"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/449","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"you're not investing it\nwith an emotional attachment,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=535.05,540.06"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/450","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that you would be if you thought\nyou were a therapist.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=540.06,543.1"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/451","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"In other words,\nwhen people way to me,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=543.1,545.88"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/452","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\"Is therapy\nstill okay within...\"","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=545.88,548.16"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/453","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"You know I say,\n\"If Buddha were your therapist","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=548.16,549.72"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/454","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"you'd get enlightened, you know.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=549.72,551.28"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/455","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"But if your therapist thinks\nhe's a therapist watch out.\"","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=551.28,553.73"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/456","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"You know, it's that place.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=553.73,558.08"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/457","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"JIM GREEN:\nWe do seem to be engaged though","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=560.25,561.57"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/458","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"in some process of slowing down\nthe substitution of structures,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=561.57,564.66"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/459","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that is a great deal\nthe interest in the drama","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=564.66,566.56"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/460","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"is in the kaleidoscopic\nvariety of the structures,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=566.56,568.82"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/461","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"both for the therapist\nand for the therapee.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=568.82,571.26"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/462","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And it seems that we want\nto try to slow down","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=571.26,574.32"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/463","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that process of production\nof structures a little bit.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=574.32,578.28"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/464","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS:\nBut, Rinpoche said or wrote,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=578.28,583.35"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/465","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that you had to become somebody\nbefore you could become nobody.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=583.35,586.68"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/466","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And-- or I think you did,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=586.68,588.01"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/467","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and I don't want to put\nwords in your mouth,\n[laughs]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=588.01,590.525"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/468","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"you can handle yourself.\n[Laughs; laughter]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=590.525,593.95"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/469","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And it seems to me\nthat's what we end up doing in--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=593.95,596.85"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/470","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that the psychotherapy domain\nis at this moment.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=596.85,600.32"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/471","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"JIM GREEN: I'm not sure\nthat I agree entirely.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=600.32,601.99"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/472","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"It seems that one needs not to\nhave a sense of being nobody,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=601.99,607.62"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/473","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"but I'm not sure that one needs\nto have the sense","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=607.62,609.56"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/474","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"of being \"somebody\" necessarily.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=609.56,611.42"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/475","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"But it seems there ought\nto be a way","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=611.42,613.74"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/476","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"to avoid that particular\nroute, of--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=613.74,618.38"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/477","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"there ought to be\na possibility of moving","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=618.38,620.35"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/478","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"from feeling like a nobody,\nwhich is a very negative state--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=620.35,622.65"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/479","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: I didn't mean that\nthey would experience","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=622.65,624.13"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/480","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"being a nobody,\nthey'd just be nobody.\n[Laughs]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=624.13,626.58"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/481","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"JIM GREEN:\nYeah. Oh, I see, okay.\n[Laughs; laughter]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=626.58,632.62"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/482","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"DUNCAN CAMPBELL:\nWell one of the things\nthat's always interested me","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=637.144,640.09"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/483","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"is that it seems\nthat a lot of people in America","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=640.09,643.28"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/484","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"are familiar in some general\nsense with the notion of ego,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=643.28,647.16"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/485","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and certain\npsychological terminology","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=647.16,649.13"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/486","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that we get from Freud\nor Adler or Jung or whatever,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=649.13,653.56"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/487","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"as vehicles to try to deal\nwith our own personality.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=653.56,657.21"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/488","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And the interesting thing\nabout the Eastern traditions","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=657.21,660.15"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/489","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"is the discovery that in\nthe Eastern religious traditions","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=660.15,664.68"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/490","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"they are talking about\nvery much the same thing;","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=664.68,667.69"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/491","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"in fact in some of\nthose traditions","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=667.69,669.07"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/492","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"they even talk\nin terms of ego.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=669.07,671.28"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/493","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And so the bridge is actually\nquite an easy one to make.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=671.28,674.29"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/494","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"It's not the matter of trying\nto absorb something so foreign","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=674.29,677.39"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/495","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and exotic that you\ncan't relate with it at all.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=677.39,679.98"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/496","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"But in fact, in most cases\nthe attraction seems to be","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=679.98,683.08"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/497","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that they are speaking\ndirectly to your own struggle","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=683.08,686.41"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/498","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"to kind of understand\nyour own personal drama","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=686.41,689.12"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/499","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and how you can work with it.\nAnd in that light it would seem","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=689.12,692.67"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/500","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that there might be\nsome real differences","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=692.67,696.27"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/501","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"between a Western psychology --","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=696.27,700.32"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/502","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"which seems to be premised\non the notion","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=700.32,702.08"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/503","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"of building up a strong ego","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=702.08,703.8"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/504","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"capable of playing\nthe game successfully --","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=703.8,707.32"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/505","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and an Eastern psychology\npremised on the notion","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=707.32,710.37"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/506","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that there *is* no ego,\nwhich has the concomitant danger","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=710.37,714.25"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/507","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that you could just lapse\ninto some sort of passivity","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=714.25,717.91"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/508","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"or a state where,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=717.91,721.53"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/509","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"you know, your energy\nwas completely inactive.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=721.53,723.43"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/510","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And both of those\nseem to be cliches.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=723.43,726.22"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/511","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And I thought maybe perhaps in\nthe course of this conversation","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=726.22,729.16"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/512","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"we could try to clarify\nsome of those popular notions","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=729.16,732.46"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/513","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"as to what the interplay\nreally was","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=732.46,734.98"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/514","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"between these Western\nand Eastern approaches.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=734.98,738.86"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/515","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I mean for instance, Jim,\ndo you actually think","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=741.83,745.42"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/516","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that the Eastern\npsychological approach","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=745.42,747.2"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/517","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"*has* a danger\nof lapsing into passivity?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=747.2,749.79"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/518","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I mean that\nis the popular notion,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=749.79,751.9"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/519","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and in your experience\nhave you found that,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=751.9,753.74"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/520","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"in your own experience\nwith Buddhism for instance?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=753.74,755.45"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/521","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"JIM GREEN:\nWell no, no.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=755.45,756.69"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/522","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"There is the sense\nthat somehow one's ego","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=756.69,758.68"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/523","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"is going to be ripped off","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=758.68,759.94"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/524","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"if one becomes involved\nwith meditation practice","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=759.94,762.39"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/525","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"or anything of that sort,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=762.39,763.71"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/526","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and one is going to lapse\ninto a sort of helplessness,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=763.71,767.91"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/527","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and that doesn't seem to be\nentirely a theoretical issue,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=767.91,770.55"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/528","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"it seems to be\na practical issue,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=770.55,772.33"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/529","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that in the situation\nof meditation practice,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=772.33,775.53"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/530","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"or in the situation\nin a therapeutic context,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=775.53,778.22"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/531","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"in which some space is allowed\nto emerge within the conflict,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=778.22,782.3"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/532","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"within the drama,\nthat typically some energy","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=782.3,787.29"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/533","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"appears which before\nwasn't available.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=787.29,791.13"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/534","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So that in fact life\nbegins to enter,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=791.13,795.56"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/535","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"where before rigid structures,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=795.56,797.08"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/536","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that rigid structures\nof the drama","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=797.08,798.62"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/537","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and the roles prevented it\nfrom entering at all.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=798.62,804.15"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/538","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And in some way the problem\nseems to arise out","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=804.15,806.36"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/539","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"of creating\ntheoretical polarities,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=806.36,808.54"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/540","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"like the ones you describe,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=808.54,811.23"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/541","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"which have the function\nvery well","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=811.23,812.54"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/542","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"of staving off\nthe actual experience.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=812.54,815.29"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/543","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"It seems to reduce\nthe anxiety","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=815.29,818.11"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/544","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"about having\none's ego ripped off","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=818.11,819.86"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/545","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and being a helpless body\nor something of that sort.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=819.86,822.06"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/546","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"DUNCAN CAMPBELL:\nWhat do you mean","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=822.06,823.33"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/547","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"having one's ego ripped off?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=823.33,824.92"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/548","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"JIM GREEN:\nWell there's the sense","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=824.92,826.16"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/549","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that somehow Eastern religions\nor meditation practice","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=826.16,828.79"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/550","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"are after one,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=828.79,830.13"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/551","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"they're after what one\nconsiders most valuable,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=830.13,833.54"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/552","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and that one has to sacrifice\nimmediately everything one is,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=833.54,836.3"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/553","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"as if somehow everything one\nis were the enemy initially.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=836.3,839.52"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/554","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So some sense of opposition,\nbetween what is--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=839.52,842.68"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/555","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"what one is and what one\nis required to be,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=842.68,846.03"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/556","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"according to these\nreligious teachings.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=846.03,847.53"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/557","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And that doesn't seem to be\nquite a sound understanding","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=847.53,850.33"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/558","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"of what we're doing,\nit's....","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=850.33,853.31"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/559","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\nI think one of the problems\nthat we have to--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=853.31,856.835"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/560","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"misunderstandings\nthat come up,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=856.835,861.465"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/561","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"is I think that,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=861.465,863.92"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/562","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"speaking from a traditional\npoint of view of Buddhism,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=865.39,869.65"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/563","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that there is big\nmisunderstanding, universally.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=869.65,881.75"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/564","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And both Easterners\nand Westerners believe in ego.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=881.75,889.36"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/565","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And ego is the subject\nof discussion,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=889.36,897.23"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/566","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and ego is subject\nof development,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=897.23,901.07"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/567","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and hope -- the only hope --\nand those things been presented.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=901.07,906.35"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/568","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"But on the other hand\nBuddhist point of view","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=906.35,909.75"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/569","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"is not particularly that\nof the Eastern point of view,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=909.75,914.15"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/570","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"*or* the Western point of view,\nparticularly,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=914.15,916.25"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/571","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"but somehow\npeculiarly Buddhistic,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=916.25,920.27"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/572","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"which doesn't belong\nto a particular category.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=920.27,924.5"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/573","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"That Buddha for instance\nrefused to identify himself","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=925.11,929.09"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/574","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"with the national ego\nof India, at the time.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=929.09,932.83"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/575","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And he broke through systems,\ncaste systems,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=932.83,936.86"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/576","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"all kinds of other systems,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=936.86,938.83"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/577","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and he even broke through\nhis own meditation master.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=938.83,944.28"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/578","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"That he found that\nthere's something's wrong there,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=944.28,947.29"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/579","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"at the time.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=947.29,949.45"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/580","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And the only conclusion\nthat he come up","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=949.45,952.72"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/581","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"is that maybe\nthere's a wrongness,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=952.72,962.28"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/582","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"which is traditionally known\nas \"duhkha\", suffering.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=962.28,965.77"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/583","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And maybe such suffering\ndoes not belong to anybody","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=965.77,969.38"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/584","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"*at all*.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=969.38,970.89"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/585","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"That maybe there is\nanother possibility is that even","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=970.89,974.87"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/586","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"*this* doesn't exist,\nthat *you* don't exist.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=974.87,978.72"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/587","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And maybe that's\nthe message of sam--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=978.72,980.68"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/588","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"message of transcending\nfrom samsara to nirvana,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=980.68,985.47"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/589","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"is entirely different category.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=985.47,987.13"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/590","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So I think if you stick too much\nterms of debating","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=987.13,990.94"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/591","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"between the East\nand West theory,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=990.94,993.06"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/592","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"somehow we don't get\nthe message across.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=993.06,995.84"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/593","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I'm not saying particularly\nBuddha was a smart person,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=995.84,999.14"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/594","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and I'm all for it\nparticularly,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=999.14,1001.56"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/595","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"but it's a different perspective\nthat Buddha has presented;","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1001.56,1007.41"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/596","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"has a different dimension\naltogether.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1007.41,1011.45"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/597","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Kind of a humanistic person,\n2,500 years ago,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1015.08,1024.02"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/598","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"who disbelieve in humanism,\nor egohood, whatever.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1024.02,1031.28"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/599","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Which is I think subject\nthat we are discussing,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1031.28,1034.96"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/600","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"in terms of psychology.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1034.96,1036.8"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/601","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And therefore,\nteaching of Buddha","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1036.8,1038.51"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/602","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"had become highly\npsychologically-oriented","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1038.51,1041.79"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/603","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"from that point onward,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1041.79,1043.5"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/604","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"rather than\nbehavior-oriented as such,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1043.5,1046.41"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/605","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"or culturally-oriented as such,\nthat it's non-cultural thing.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1046.41,1050.4"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/606","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"It's sort of revolutionary idea,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1050.4,1051.89"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/607","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"which still could be more\nrevolutionary as time goes on,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1051.89,1057.38"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/608","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"in my way of thinking anyway.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1057.38,1059.65"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/609","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So I think there's a point\nthere that the--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1059.65,1066.51"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/610","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"all kinds of behavior patterns\nthat we could present,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1066.51,1071.9"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/611","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"to make ego-less or ego-hood,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1071.9,1075.92"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/612","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"but at the time,\nwe are doing something with it.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1075.92,1079.65"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/613","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And the real idea seems to be\nis that to find out,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1079.65,1088.56"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/614","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"discover, is anything at all?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1089.34,1093.35"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/615","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"That's the question that nobody\nhas really looked at.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1093.35,1096.6"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/616","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And we presume that\nthere is something happening,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1096.6,1101.52"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/617","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and as if that\nyou have bought the cart,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1101.52,1106.45"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/618","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and you never discuss\nabout the horses.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1106.45,1109.05"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/619","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And that's what Buddha\nis getting at,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1109.05,1110.83"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/620","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"is that let us discuss what kind\nof horse we're going to have.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1110.83,1113.81"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/621","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Is there horse at all or not?\nIs it worth buying the cart?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1113.81,1117.72"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/622","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And that's kind of\nfundamental thing","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1117.72,1120.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/623","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that we might inject\nin this particular situation.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1120.0,1122.88"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/624","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So which makes\nthings more lively.\n[Laughter]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1122.88,1128.982"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/625","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS:\nIn the developmental part","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1128.982,1131.31"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/626","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"of an individual's growth,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1131.31,1138.26"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/627","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"from infancy onward,\nin the West it's assumed","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1138.26,1143.01"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/628","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that a certain structure will\ndevelop just for functioning.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1143.01,1148.24"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/629","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"That is, the sucking\nbehavior will start,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1148.24,1150.53"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/630","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and the sort of basic\nneeds systems","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1150.53,1153.42"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/631","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"will build a structure\naround them","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1153.42,1155.19"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/632","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"which will become psychological\nin nature.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1155.19,1158.5"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/633","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And that that will be\na necessity for survival.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1158.5,1161.9"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/634","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And only after that can\nsome other conditions occur.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1161.9,1167.68"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/635","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Now, how does that fit in\nwith what you've just said?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1167.68,1173.15"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/636","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Well I think\nthat's fits perfectly well.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1173.15,1177.99"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/637","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"That there is\na big misunderstanding,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1177.99,1188.23"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/638","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"out of nothingness.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1188.23,1189.97"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/639","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So we're dwelling\non the misunderstanding,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1189.97,1191.92"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/640","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"as if anchor.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1191.92,1194.75"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/641","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And we built up\nthe misunderstanding --","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1194.75,1198.58"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/642","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"whatever it is, you know,\nbuilt life out of it.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1198.58,1201.61"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/643","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And it seems okay, functional;","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1201.61,1203.86"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/644","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"we might building house\non ice block, or you know,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1203.86,1206.56"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/645","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\"Let's decorate nicely.\nAnd let's, you know,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1206.56,1210.11"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/646","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"disregard the ice block,\nbut we still got to do that.\"","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1210.11,1213.48"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/647","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"But then some point we begin\nto find in a spring,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1213.48,1217.34"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/648","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"or in the summer,\nthat the spirituality is begin","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1217.34,1221.31"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/649","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"to question\nyour foundation altogether.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1221.31,1225.52"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/650","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"But I think that's the point,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1225.52,1227.33"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/651","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"is that misunderstanding\nin this case","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1227.33,1232.27"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/652","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"is the pain and uncertainty,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1232.27,1236.44"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/653","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"possibilities of nonexistent,\nbut still existing.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1236.44,1239.56"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/654","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"When child cry,\ncry for nonexistence,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1239.56,1243.85"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/655","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"there *is* this--\nthat message happens constantly.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1243.85,1246.79"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/656","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And the child suck nipple","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1246.79,1248.17"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/657","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"because child wanted to have\nsome connection,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1248.17,1251.63"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/658","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"make sure that there's\na relative reference","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1251.63,1253.22"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/659","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that child *could* exist\nor *does* exist,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1253.22,1255.76"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/660","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"which are the expressions\nof all kinds of panic,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1255.76,1258.5"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/661","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"which builds the society\nfrom that point of view.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1258.5,1261.94"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/662","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"But on the other hand\nthat doesn't necessarily mean","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1261.94,1263.9"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/663","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that we should\nabandon everything,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1263.9,1265.89"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/664","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and we should abandon\nas soon as child is born,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1265.89,1269.08"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/665","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and throw it out.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1269.08,1272.23"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/666","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"But we should build\nthose misunderstandings","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1272.23,1275.73"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/667","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"to the level\nthat misunderstandings","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1275.73,1277.33"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/668","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"becomes a source\nof understanding of *some* kind.\n[Laughs; laughter]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1277.33,1285.68"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/669","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"DUNCAN CAMPBELL:\nWell it sounds like in a way","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1285.68,1287.71"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/670","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that the process\nthat Buddha went through","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1287.71,1290.63"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/671","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"was starting out\nas a prince,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1290.63,1292.72"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/672","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and someone who became\ndisillusioned with --","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1292.72,1295.3"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/673","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"we want to cast this\nin psychological terminology --","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1295.3,1297.95"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/674","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that desire structure\nof being a prince,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1297.95,1301.06"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/675","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"or that kind\nof material existence.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1301.06,1303.36"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/676","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"He then rebounded or reacted\nto the other pole","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1303.36,1306.1"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/677","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"of searching for\nsome sort of meaning,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1306.1,1308.92"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/678","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"in a kind of\nan ascetic structure,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1308.92,1311.72"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/679","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"being for several years\nwith the yogis.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1311.72,1313.87"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/680","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And then that itself\nproved dissatisfactory,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1313.87,1316.31"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/681","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and it seemed like\nwhat he then discovered","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1316.31,1318.85"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/682","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"was that somehow the whole\npsychological pattern","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1318.85,1322.33"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/683","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"of what was carrying him\nfrom one pole to the other","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1322.33,1324.86"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/684","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"was really what was\ninteresting to look at.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1324.86,1327.3"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/685","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And the only way\nhe could look at that","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1327.3,1328.72"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/686","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"was by studying\nhis own mind.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1328.72,1330.49"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/687","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\nWell obviously, you know,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1330.49,1331.98"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/688","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I mean you can't call\nsomebody a liar","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1331.98,1336.75"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/689","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"unless there is something\nto prove","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1336.75,1338.67"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/690","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that there's a truth exist.\nYou know it's as simple as that,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1338.67,1343.28"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/691","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that polarity is always there,\nthat there is--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1343.28,1348.87"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/692","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"the materialism\nis taking place,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1349.66,1351.9"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/693","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"in the domestic level\nof Buddha's kingdom,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1351.9,1357.03"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/694","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"palace,\nhis parents and everything,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1357.03,1359.59"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/695","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and then when he abandoned that\nhe latch on to something else.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1359.59,1363.5"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/696","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Which is still path to glory of\nor glorifying ego or something,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1363.5,1368.82"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/697","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that he still went on.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1368.82,1370.98"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/698","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"But then when he realize the --\nwhat's the word? -- polarity.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1370.98,1382.12"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/699","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"That he should look closely:\nwhat he is doing is--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1382.12,1387.8"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/700","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"actually what he's actually\ndoing it or not.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1387.8,1390.71"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/701","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"That then he begin to realize\nhe wasn't doing anything at all,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1390.71,1396.88"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/702","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"but he was just purely\nplaying a game, at--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1396.88,1401.51"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/703","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"you know,\npretend to be a saint.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1401.51,1404.62"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/704","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"But actually that\nhe find himself","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1404.62,1407.24"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/705","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"in the trapped up\nin the sainthood,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1407.24,1408.59"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/706","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"or whatever, you know.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1408.59,1411.14"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/707","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"That's the crux of the matter\nseem to be.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1411.14,1413.63"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/708","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I mean the-- I think one of\nthe greatest development","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1413.63,1417.3"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/709","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that the Westerners--\nWestern world is discovered","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1417.3,1421.52"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/710","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"is the law of relative--\nrelativity.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1421.52,1426.97"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/711","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And I would say as soon\nas the law of relativity","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1426.97,1430.51"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/712","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"has given birth in this country\nor in the Western world,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1430.51,1436.21"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/713","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that he was--\nBuddha mind is begin to work.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1436.98,1443.99"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/714","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And before that people have\nnever thought of *comparing*,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1443.99,1449.05"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/715","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and people just *presumed*,\nyou know, like we presumed ego.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1449.05,1454.19"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/716","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And you know,\nthe question doesn't arise,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1454.19,1457.27"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/717","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that \"everything seem\nto be okay,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1457.27,1460.56"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/718","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"but let's check the details.\"","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1460.56,1463.68"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/719","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"You know, that's become\nthe problematic question.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1463.68,1468.98"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/720","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"You have anything to say\nabout that? [Laughter]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1468.98,1473.09"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/721","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"JIM GREEN: [Laughs]\nI think that I do.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1473.09,1474.94"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/722","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I wanted to ask you what,\nin response, what one says to--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1474.94,1481.81"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/723","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"what you say to someone\nwho feels that the game","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1481.81,1484.76"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/724","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"or the series of games\nare what there is?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1484.76,1488.42"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/725","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And that if one\ngives up the games,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1488.42,1490.6"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/726","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"or even the sequence of games,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1490.6,1492.48"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/727","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"one is left with nothing\nwhich is worth surviving for.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1492.48,1498.23"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/728","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Which is what?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1498.23,1499.68"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/729","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"JIM GREEN: Which is worth\nsurviving for, living for.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1499.68,1501.21"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/730","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\nI see.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1501.21,1502.49"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/731","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Well I mean that's the precisely\nthe point you see.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1502.49,1506.31"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/732","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"We haven't explored\nanother kind of life, at all.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1506.31,1510.04"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/733","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"We thought this *the* it,\nthis is it, you know.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1510.04,1512.59"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/734","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"We haven't even step out\nof our front door.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1512.59,1518.15"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/735","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So there *is* something else,\nthere may *be* something else,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1518.15,1521.46"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/736","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"but let's let us experience it,\nyou know,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1521.46,1523.53"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/737","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that's very intellectually\nvery difficult to prove,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1523.53,1526.27"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/738","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"because that we are in-build\nall kinds of concepts and ideas;","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1526.27,1531.24"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/739","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"the whole thing become\nvery solid already.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1531.24,1533.07"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/740","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"But there's another\nversion of survival,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1533.07,1537.2"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/741","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"other than trying to be--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1537.2,1539.42"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/742","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"trying to survive with\nthe basic necessity of ego.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1539.42,1543.33"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/743","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I mean that's, to my mind,\nthat is enlightenment,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1543.33,1547.22"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/744","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"is there's another version\nof survival,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1547.22,1549.25"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/745","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"without trying to survive.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1549.25,1551.93"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/746","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I mean that's\nthe big question actually.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1551.93,1555.18"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/747","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"That *is it*.\n[Laughs]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1555.18,1557.14"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/748","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"JIM GREEN: And in some ways\nit seems not at all","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1557.14,1559.97"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/749","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"to be a theoretical question;","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1559.97,1561.41"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/750","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"it seems that as long\nas we rest in a theory,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1561.41,1565.37"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/751","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"we rest in a state of hopeless\ninternal conflict","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1565.37,1569.02"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/752","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and contradiction.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1569.02,1570.81"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/753","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And as soon as we take\na first step","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1570.81,1572.68"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/754","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"outside that particular circle\nof conflict and contradiction,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1572.68,1576.51"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/755","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"well something happens\nor it doesn't, perhaps.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1576.51,1580.81"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/756","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"But it seems as if the step\nneeds to be taken in some way.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1580.81,1583.45"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/757","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Some exploration\nneeds to take place","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1583.45,1585.46"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/758","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"if the issue is to be\nresolved for each person .","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1585.46,1590.21"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/759","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Well said.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1590.21,1592.59"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/760","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"JOHN BAKER:\nBut what is the motivation","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1593.13,1594.9"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/761","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"for taking this\nkind of a step?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1594.9,1596.11"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/762","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Well, we're\nhaving a panel discussion.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1596.11,1599.34"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/763","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"[Laughter]\nWell--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1599.34,1603.46"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/764","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS:\nWell then I'll answer it.\n[Laughter; laughs]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1603.46,1605.96"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/765","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\nWhy don't you say it?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1605.96,1608.04"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/766","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS:\nDespair. Despair.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1608.04,1609.48"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/767","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"That was what-- that's the model\nthat Buddha demonstrates.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1609.48,1613.77"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/768","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Despair of the finiteness\nof whatever structures","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1613.77,1617.39"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/769","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"he found himself in over\nand over again.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1617.39,1619.31"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/770","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"They weren't paying off.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1619.31,1620.57"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/771","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"DUNCAN CAMPBELL: But then\nhow can you create a system,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1620.57,1622.65"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/772","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"which goes beyond\nthe very notion of systems,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1622.65,1624.94"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/773","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"since that seems\nto be the problem?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1624.94,1626.42"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/774","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"That the problem of ego is that\nit continually creates a system.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1626.42,1629.43"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/775","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS:\nYou can't create it,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1629.43,1630.67"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/776","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"but you can be it.\nYou don't create it.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1630.67,1632.37"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/777","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"JIM GREEN:\nRight.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1632.37,1633.61"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/778","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"But it also because people\nseem to be somewhat imperfect.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1633.61,1636.34"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/779","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"It may be that we\nfor some time","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1636.34,1638.28"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/780","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"hold a carrot\nin front of ourselves.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1638.28,1640.92"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/781","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"That may be necessary,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1640.92,1643.21"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/782","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"particularly if we're aware that\nthe carrot doesn't quite exist","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1643.21,1645.78"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/783","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"even though it's there.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1645.78,1647.08"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/784","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: That's the desire for\nenlightenment you're talking of.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1647.08,1648.69"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/785","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"JIM GREEN: Yeah, the desire\nfor enlightenment, right.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1648.69,1650.45"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/786","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Or for any one\nof number of things","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1650.45,1651.85"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/787","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"connected with enlightenment.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1651.85,1653.09"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/788","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: Yeah.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1653.09,1654.31"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/789","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"DUNCAN CAMPBELL: Well the desire\nfor enlightenment itself","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1654.31,1655.79"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/790","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"seems to be somewhat\na contradiction in terms.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1655.79,1657.83"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/791","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"That the more you\ndesire enlightenment,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1657.83,1659.82"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/792","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"the less you\ncan be enlightened,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1659.82,1661.05"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/793","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"because you think\nthere's something to get.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1661.05,1662.87"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/794","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: But you find that out\nin the course","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1662.87,1664.53"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/795","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"of pursuing the desire\nfor enlightenment.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1664.53,1666.52"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/796","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"JIM GREEN: Right. It seems\nto be an imperfect world.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1666.52,1668.66"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/797","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"[Laughter] And...","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1668.66,1672.9"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/798","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Well it *is* an imperfect\nworld in some ways,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1674.19,1676.08"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/799","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and it seems that at times\nactions are paradoxical.\n[Laughter]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1676.08,1681.21"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/800","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: Well you couldn't\nhave it more perfect","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1681.21,1682.7"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/801","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"than that, you know.\nThe thing destroys itself.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1682.7,1685.502"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/802","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"JIM GREEN:\nI'll try to remember that.\n[Laughs; laughter]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1685.502,1686.75"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/803","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS:\nThe thing that destroys itself.\n[Laughs]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1686.75,1691.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/804","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"But the relativistic thing,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1691.0,1693.64"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/805","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"you know, the way\npsychological theory is built","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1693.64,1697.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/806","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"is built out of the range\nof the person's experiences,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1697.0,1700.2"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/807","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"the psychologists'-- theoretical\npsychologists' experiences,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1700.2,1703.72"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/808","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"in terms of getting\ndeductive theories","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1703.72,1707.6"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/809","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"from which to deduce.\nAnd until we put into,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1707.6,1715.75"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/810","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"infuse into, Western psychology,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1715.75,1718.62"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/811","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"people who are living\nby an alternative--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1718.62,1724.1"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/812","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"in an alternative domain\nif you will,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1724.1,1726.01"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/813","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"or however we want to say,\nthe--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1726.01,1728.05"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/814","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"a space which doesn't work\nfrom within ego structure.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1728.05,1733.56"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/815","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"There's no possibility\nthat we can apply","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1733.56,1735.46"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/816","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that relativity\nto psychological theory,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1735.46,1738.32"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/817","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"because we can't speculate","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1738.32,1739.78"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/818","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"about the possibility\nof the buddha mind,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1739.78,1742.47"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/819","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"if you will,\nfrom outside of it,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1742.47,1745.5"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/820","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and have the theory worth a damn\nas far as I can figure.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1745.5,1748.72"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/821","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"You know, so it seems to me\nthat many psychologists--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1748.72,1751.71"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/822","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I mean I feel part of\na large group of psychologists","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1751.71,1754.59"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/823","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"who are driven inside,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1754.59,1756.81"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/824","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"because of the dissatisfaction\nwith behaviorism.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1756.81,1759.66"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/825","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Because you can't\nstudy it as object.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1759.66,1761.77"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/826","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Ultimately you've got to\n*be* it, and until you be--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1761.77,1764.91"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/827","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"you can feel that gap, you just\ncan't jump that relative system,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1764.91,1768.6"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/828","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"you can't jump out\nof your absolutistic prison,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1768.6,1772.52"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/829","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"if you will.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1772.52,1773.79"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/830","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"DUNCAN CAMPBELL: In fact I think\nthat's the way you first","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1773.79,1775.31"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/831","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"got into Eastern religions\nas I remember:","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1775.31,1777.37"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/832","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"the story you used\nto tell about","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1777.37,1778.71"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/833","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"being on the other side\nof the desk,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1778.71,1780.68"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/834","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"where the student\nwould come in,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1780.68,1782.01"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/835","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and you were the therapist,\nand he was the problem.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1782.01,1784.83"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/836","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And his game wasn't\nas successful,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1784.83,1786.86"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/837","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and your game\nwas more successful,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1786.86,1788.58"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/838","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and your whole role\nas psychologist","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1788.58,1790.76"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/839","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"seemed to be simply to tell him\nhow to play the game better.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1790.76,1793.73"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/840","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And then you began to think\nthat there was maybe something","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1793.73,1796.72"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/841","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"about this game itself\nthat was to be questioned.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1796.72,1800.02"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/842","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And so off you went.\nHere we are.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1800.02,1802.99"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/843","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"JIM GREEN: Here we are.\n[Laughs; laughter]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1802.99,1805.16"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/844","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: Because then I had\nto hide my neurosis,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1805.16,1806.9"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/845","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"now I can just exhibit them.\n[Laughs; laughter]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1806.9,1820.59"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/846","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\nI think we might discuss","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1820.59,1822.36"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/847","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"about the question of the notion\nof alternatives.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1822.36,1828.14"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/848","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"That might be important point\nto discuss at this point.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1829.58,1834.1"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/849","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Should person be trained,\ndisciplined, in a certain way,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1836.43,1846.68"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/850","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that there is\nno alternatives left.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1846.68,1849.66"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/851","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Or should a person\nto be inspired,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1849.66,1853.11"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/852","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"there's lots of alternatives\nand you are free.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1853.11,1857.11"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/853","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I think that is\ncrux of the matter,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1857.11,1858.98"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/854","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that psychology East and West,\nor whatever you like to call it,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1858.98,1862.44"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/855","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that the alternative\nhas a positive aspect,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1862.44,1870.62"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/856","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and also had its negative aspect\nas well at the same time.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1870.62,1874.02"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/857","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And which is largely\nthe Western therapy work","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1874.02,1876.73"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/858","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"is based on\nis alternative,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1876.73,1880.18"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/859","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"the therapy work is regarded\nas alternative thing.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1880.18,1883.76"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/860","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\"Better than something else.\"","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1883.76,1886.4"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/861","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And also various practice\nof spiritual discipline","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1886.4,1891.85"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/862","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that all the--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1891.85,1893.13"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/863","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"most of therapists\nwould get into,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1893.13,1896.75"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/864","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"are the discovery\nof a better world.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1896.75,1901.82"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/865","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Which in itself\nis a binding factor;","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1901.82,1906.14"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/866","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"it is good at the same time\nbecause gives you new insight,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1906.14,1909.7"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/867","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"but on the other hand\nthat would be misunderstandable.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1909.7,1912.79"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/868","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"There is that problem.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1912.79,1915.7"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/869","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Anybody has anything to say\nabout that? [Laughter]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1917.74,1928.85"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/870","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS:\nWell there are a couple\nof levels at which that...","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1936.574,1941.76"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/871","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"First of all, the individual\npsychologist's fear of","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1944.84,1948.836"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/872","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"her or his own death puts a\nboundary on the game anyway,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1948.836,1954.45"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/873","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and starts to make a finiteness\nto the possibilities that they--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1954.45,1958.01"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/874","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"they're willing to consider.\nThat's the first part of it.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1958.01,1960.72"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/875","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And then the kind of lack\nof humility that exists in--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1960.72,1966.69"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/876","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"often exists in social science,\nmakes one conclude","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1966.69,1971.42"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/877","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that one already knows\nall the possibilities,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1971.42,1974.32"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/878","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"or that one could know\nthem intellectually. That--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1974.32,1977.15"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/879","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"it seems to me that a lot\nof the boundaries","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1977.15,1978.84"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/880","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"are put on\nby the intellect,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1978.84,1980.9"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/881","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"without recognizing like\nintuitive possibilities","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1980.9,1985.94"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/882","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"in the universe.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1985.94,1987.3"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/883","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And the intellect\nfeels very finite to me,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1987.3,1990.07"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/884","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"in terms of what it's possible\nability to conceive of,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1990.07,1994.82"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/885","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"if you will.\nThat's your domain, not mine.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=1994.82,2001.16"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/886","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"JIM GREEN:\nI couldn't agree more.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2001.16,2002.52"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/887","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"On the other hand though,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2002.52,2003.73"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/888","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"on the other hand\nthere is a certain,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2003.73,2007.23"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/889","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"how to say it,\nlegitimacy and integrity","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2007.23,2009.79"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/890","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"to that life which is\na life of drama","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2009.79,2014.98"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/891","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and [UNCLEAR: gain? game?],\nwhich it makes very difficult","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2016.56,2018.97"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/892","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"to step outside\nof even momentarily.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2018.97,2023.05"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/893","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And that seems all right.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2023.05,2024.4"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/894","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I mean in some sense\nit seems a mistake","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2024.4,2026.35"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/895","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"to attack that head\non in some way,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2026.35,2029.6"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/896","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"because that attacking head\non seems only to intensify,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2029.6,2032.42"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/897","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"in any case, the struggle.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2032.42,2034.76"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/898","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"As you know, if you've\ntalked with therapists","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2034.76,2036.63"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/899","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"who are very intellectual;","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2036.63,2040.06"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/900","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"it's as if some softening of\na situation has to take place.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2040.06,2044.217"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/901","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS:\nI don't think you do anything\nto anybody else anyway.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2044.217,2045.045"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/902","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"JIM GREEN: Yeah, right.\nRAM DASS:\nYou don't attack them,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2045.045,2047.02"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/903","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"you just do it to yourself.\nLike--\nJIM GREEN: You do it--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2047.02,2049.55"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/904","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: --undercutting\nyour own structures,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2049.55,2052.22"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/905","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"your intellectual understanding\nof psychodynamics--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2052.22,2055.15"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/906","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\nWell... excuse me.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2055.15,2060.08"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/907","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I think there might be\nsome problems with that,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2061.58,2063.96"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/908","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"is that you are not helping\nsomebody at all, anybody at all.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2063.96,2073.01"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/909","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"But you are trying\nto learn very much,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2073.01,2077.01"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/910","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"by using somebody\nelse's examples,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2077.01,2079.48"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/911","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that there is a kind of\nvery exclusive kind of confused","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2079.48,2090.25"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/912","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"arhat kind of a problem\nthat you know you are--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2090.25,2096.47"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/913","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"like the example that Duncan\nwas talking about,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2097.68,2101.25"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/914","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that you felt\nin the early days","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2101.25,2104.74"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/915","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that the students\non the other side of desk,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2104.74,2107.28"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/916","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"you are on this side,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2107.28,2109.22"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/917","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and you found that was\nvery ironically strange.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2109.22,2116.2"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/918","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"But then you didn't dealt\nwith it, but you took off.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2116.2,2124.25"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/919","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: To fight\nanother day, if you will.\n[Laughs; laughter]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2125.15,2127.76"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/920","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\nYeah, well I mean,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2127.76,2129.38"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/921","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"let us discuss\nabout that as well.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2129.38,2130.96"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/922","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And there is a problem of that\nbecoming too self-centered,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2130.96,2136.85"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/923","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"you know, that--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2136.85,2138.61"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/924","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: Or too compassionate,\nto proceed with a game","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2138.61,2140.52"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/925","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"which is perpetuating illusion.\n[Laughter]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2140.52,2143.05"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/926","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\nYeah, but then in the meantime","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2143.05,2145.51"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/927","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"the other person is suspended.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2145.51,2149.03"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/928","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"You know, until you did\nyour research work","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2149.03,2152.225"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/929","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"the other person\nis suspended","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2152.225,2153.19"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/930","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and going through\nthe same problem,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2153.19,2154.83"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/931","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"maybe behind *another* desk.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2154.83,2156.63"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/932","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS:\nLook, you go into a cave","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2156.63,2157.9"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/933","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"for a period of time,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2157.9,2159.16"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/934","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and yet you already knew about\nthe need to alleviate suffering,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2159.16,2162.07"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/935","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and you're not going to say\nyou can't justify","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2162.07,2164.06"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/936","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"spending times\nin retreats in caves.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2164.06,2167.03"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/937","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"You were in\nthe same predicament.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2167.03,2168.42"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/938","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\nWell that's what I mean.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2168.42,2169.92"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/939","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"That's what I mean.\nLet us discuss about that.\n[Laughs; laughter]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2169.92,2173.79"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/940","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: I think it's a very\nnarrow concept to think","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2173.79,2175.47"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/941","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that you relieve suffering","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2175.47,2176.68"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/942","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"by staying on the firing line\nall the time.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2176.68,2178.35"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/943","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"When I was in India and sitting\nat the temple I used to think,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2178.35,2181.34"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/944","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\"Well maybe I'm copping out,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2181.34,2182.61"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/945","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"because all these guys\nlike Allen Ginsberg,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2182.61,2184.96"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/946","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and all these boys are out\nfighting the fight,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2184.96,2186.69"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/947","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"the good fight, here","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2186.69,2187.98"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/948","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I am sitting at a temple,\nyou know, what am I doing?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2187.98,2190.19"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/949","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Why aren't I out there\nin Chicago at the riots,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2190.19,2192.33"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/950","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and so on?\" [Laughter]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2192.33,2193.64"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/951","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And I began to think\nthat the inner battle","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2193.64,2195.45"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/952","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"was really where the battle line\nwas for all of us.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2195.45,2198.62"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/953","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"It wasn't necessarily out there,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2198.62,2200.29"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/954","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"sitting in the desk,\nin the therapy office.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2200.29,2202.13"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/955","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Do you mean\nthat will cost a lot of lives?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2202.13,2204.47"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/956","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: Hmm?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2204.47,2205.76"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/957","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\nCost a lot of lives--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2205.76,2207.04"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/958","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS:\nYeah. At least one hopefully.\n[Laughs]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2207.04,2208.51"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/959","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\n--in the meantime.\nIn the meantime.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2208.51,2210.94"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/960","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: In the meantime it\nwould cost a lot of lives, yes.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2210.94,2212.52"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/961","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Yeah.\nRAM DASS: Sure. Of course.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2212.52,2215.44"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/962","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"JIM GREEN: Rinpoche, what would\nyour particular advice","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2215.44,2217.54"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/963","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"to Ram Dass have been?\n[Laughter; applause]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2217.54,2225.073"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/964","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\nWhat did he say?\nJIM GREEN: He said,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2226.455,2228.28"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/965","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\"what would your particular\nadvice to Ram Dass have been","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2228.28,2230.96"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/966","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"when he was behind\nthe desk?\"","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2230.96,2233.502"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/967","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"[Laughter; applause]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2233.502,2242.177"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/968","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"JOHN BAKER:\nYou know a minute ago","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2246.22,2247.67"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/969","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"you said that the reason\nfor giving up this world","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2247.67,2253.87"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/970","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and entering a world","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2253.87,2255.14"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/971","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"which *possibly* beyond\nour imagination","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2255.14,2258.84"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/972","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"might not have anything worth\nliving for in it, is despair.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2258.84,2264.09"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/973","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And I've heard you Rinpoche","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2264.09,2265.36"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/974","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"speak about reaching\nthe depths of despair.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2265.36,2269.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/975","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"You have to become\ncompletely hopeless,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2269.0,2271.51"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/976","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"which is even\nbeyond despair.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2271.51,2274.75"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/977","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"But it seems that\nwhat you're talking about","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2275.81,2277.89"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/978","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"is the question of how one\ngenerates that kind of despair","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2277.89,2281.75"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/979","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that makes one willing\nto step out of ego,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2281.75,2284.49"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/980","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"into a world in which--\nI mean no one wants to die.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2284.49,2288.9"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/981","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Everyone's afraid of that;","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2288.9,2290.14"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/982","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"there must be\na tremendous impetus","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2290.14,2292.93"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/983","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that propels us out of a world\nwhere albeit we're suffering,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2292.93,2296.19"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/984","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"but at least it's familiar","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2296.19,2297.96"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/985","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and it has it's petty pleasures\nand not so petty pleasures,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2297.96,2302.85"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/986","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"rather intense ecstasies\nand so forth.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2302.85,2305.76"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/987","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So you know, how does one go\nabout generating","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2305.76,2309.88"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/988","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that kind of impetus,\nto make a person want to,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2309.88,2312.75"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/989","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"or *able* to step out\nof the world of ego?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2312.75,2317.16"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/990","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\nWell we haven't come","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2318.19,2320.96"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/991","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"to the conclusion\nyet at this point actually,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2320.96,2323.93"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/992","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that should we examine\nthat possibility","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2323.93,2328.71"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/993","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"or should we just try\nto develop and grow our ego.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2328.71,2335.1"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/994","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Materialistically\nor spiritually.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2335.1,2337.54"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/995","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"We haven't discussed\nthe first point","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2337.54,2339.32"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/996","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"so the second point seem\nto be obsolete, in some sense.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2339.32,2343.6"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/997","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"That's what I'm trying\nto get at,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2343.6,2345.18"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/998","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"is that there are lot of people\nlistening to us here,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2345.18,2349.08"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/999","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"as well as there will be viewers\nin the rest of the country,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2349.08,2353.84"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1000","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and people are concerned\nabout that, you know.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2353.84,2355.98"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1001","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I think we should make\nvery clear to them,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2355.98,2358.97"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1002","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that maybe quite possibly--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2358.97,2360.35"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1003","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: That you don't\nwalk away from your desk.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2360.35,2361.75"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1004","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\nI beg your pardon?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2361.75,2362.98"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1005","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS:\nIs that what you're saying,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2362.98,2364.21"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1006","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that you don't walk away\nfrom your desk?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2364.21,2365.41"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1007","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\nWell whatever, you know.\n[Laughs: laughter]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2365.41,2368.04"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1008","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"That wasn't particular thing.\nThat's one facet of it.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2368.04,2369.88"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1009","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: Yeah, I don't think\nit would be bad","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2369.88,2371.12"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1010","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"if a lot of therapists\nwalked away from their desks.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2371.12,2373.1"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1011","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"[Applause]\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Yeah?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2373.1,2374.35"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1012","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: I mean statistically\nthe recidivism rate","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2374.35,2377.32"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1013","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"is just about the same,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2377.32,2378.61"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1014","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"whether people go\nto therapists or not.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2378.61,2380.79"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1015","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So Western therapy isn't really\ndoing that well, you know.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2380.79,2383.79"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1016","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"JIM GREEN: Yeah, but the issue\nseems to be a more general one,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2383.79,2386.65"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1017","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"of walking out of one life\ninto another one.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2386.65,2389.58"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1018","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Walking out of one life\nwhich one has behind the desk","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2389.58,2392.07"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1019","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"immediately into another","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2392.07,2393.37"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1020","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"which one has when\none's leaves the desk,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2393.37,2396.35"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1021","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"which I'm sure\nwasn't your sense.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2396.35,2397.67"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1022","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And it doesn't seem\nto be that way.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2397.67,2400.156"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1023","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS:\nThere's no real dropout,\nif you miss that--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2400.156,2401.52"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1024","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"JIM GREEN:\nThere's no real dropout.\nRAM DASS: Yeah, yeah.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2401.52,2403.08"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1025","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"JIM GREEN:\nAnd it seems that that's one\nof the meanings of a path,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2403.08,2405.56"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1026","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that really when\none leaves the desk one","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2405.56,2406.92"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1027","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"is in the same place\nin some sense?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2406.92,2408.56"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1028","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\nYeah. Well in a some sense,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2408.56,2410.33"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1029","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that we have a microphone\nin front of us,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2410.33,2415.34"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1030","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"which is another form\nof a desk.\nRAM DASS: Right.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2415.34,2417.77"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1031","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\nAnd we have a platform, as well.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2417.77,2419.07"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1032","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: Absolutely.\nThe game doesn't change,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2419.07,2420.41"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1033","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"you can't get out of it\nno matter how hard you try.\n[Laughter]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2420.41,2425.8"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1034","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"It's just the *illusion*\nof change that just...\n[Laughs]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2425.8,2428.76"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1035","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\nSo, is there any point at all?\n[Laughs; laughter; applause]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2428.76,2436.17"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1036","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS:\nNot at that level.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2436.17,2438.29"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1037","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"It's just spinning\nwheels at that level,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2438.29,2440.06"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1038","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"those dances anyway.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2440.06,2441.491"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1039","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\nWhat level we are talking about?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2441.491,2444.561"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1040","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: [Laughing]\nAh, oh no!\nDUNCAN CAMPBELL: Oh yes!","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2444.561,2451.026"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1041","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS:\nOther than that level.\n[Laughs]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2451.32,2457.344"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1042","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS:\nIn the process of changing","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2459.77,2462.17"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1043","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"from the desk to the microphone,\nto the pen,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2462.17,2466.48"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1044","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"to whatever the same vehicle\nis over and over again,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2466.48,2470.89"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1045","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"the motivations--\nthis is the same thing about","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2470.89,2473.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1046","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"working within desire\nstructures,\ndesire hierarchies.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2473.0,2476.98"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1047","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"The-- there is a process going\non through that whole thing,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2476.98,2482.15"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1048","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that is working on you\nin a different--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2482.15,2484.28"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1049","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"quite a different way,\nthan is represented","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2484.28,2487.95"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1050","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"by the phenotypic behavior\nby whether--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2487.95,2490.28"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1051","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I mean you can stand\non the-- in front--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2490.28,2492.63"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1052","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"you are in front\nof a microphone","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2492.63,2494.07"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1053","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"at a very different\nmotivational level","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2494.07,2495.81"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1054","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"than I am in front\nof this microphone, perhaps.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2495.81,2498.57"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1055","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Perhaps.\n[Laughs; laughter]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2498.57,2500.9"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1056","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: We're sitting\non the same level--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2500.9,2502.29"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1057","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: I know! It looks\nthe same, doesn't it?\n[Laughter]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2502.29,2505.64"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1058","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"The microphones look the same,\nsounds come out, you know.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2505.64,2508.72"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1059","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"But I suspect it's different,\nI don't know.\n[Laughter; applause]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2508.72,2512.38"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1060","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"How do I get in there\nto find out?\n[Laughter; applause]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2512.38,2516.45"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1061","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\nWell, your microphone\nis different than mine.[Laughs]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2516.45,2519.6"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1062","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS:\nYes, well...I notice that.\n[Laughs; laughter]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2521.331,2524.07"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1063","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"It's different\nthan everybody's here.\n[Laughter]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2524.07,2534.266"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1064","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\nWell, [laughing]\nback to square one.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2536.81,2544.32"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1065","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: You didn't answer\nJim's question.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2545.45,2547.05"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1066","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Jim asked you,\n\"What would you have done,\nsitting behind that desk?\"","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2547.05,2551.18"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1067","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"JIM GREEN:\nWell not quite.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2551.18,2552.44"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1068","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I asked what advice would\nhe would have given\nyou [laughing],","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2552.44,2556.03"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1069","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"sitting behind that--\n[Laughter]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2556.03,2557.9"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1070","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS:\nExcuse me for putting those--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2557.9,2559.15"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1071","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\nYeah, well I do that every day.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2559.15,2561.99"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1072","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I have a desk and telephone,\nand couch.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2561.99,2566.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1073","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"[Laughter; laughs]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2566.0,2569.82"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1074","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS:\nThe meaning of them all change.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2569.82,2573.42"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1075","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Yeah.\n[Laughter]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2573.42,2578.525"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1076","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"You arrived at that\nfrom a different space.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2578.525,2581.92"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1077","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\nI came to England by boat.\n[Laughter; laughs]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2583.77,2597.16"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1078","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: Right.\nWhat the other person meets","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2597.16,2602.01"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1079","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"in the office with you,\nwithin the office,\n[laughter]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2602.01,2608.635"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1080","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"is perhaps a different space,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2608.635,2610.62"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1081","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"than what they met\nwith me twelve years ago.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2610.62,2612.95"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1082","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\nWell, I do feel","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2612.95,2614.22"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1083","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"sometimes my desk shrinks,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2614.22,2616.49"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1084","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and when we have\na conversation taking place,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2616.49,2620.47"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1085","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"if not optical illusion --\nwhich I think it is,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2620.47,2625.07"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1086","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"but still,\nthe desk does shrink,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2625.07,2627.93"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1087","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and it becomes just\nvery thin little desk.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2627.93,2630.85"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1088","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"But still telephone rings,\nand other things happens anyway.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2630.85,2635.51"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1089","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So I wonder.\n[Laughs; laughter]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2635.51,2647.695"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1090","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS:\nHmm. They all seem--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2647.695,2648.88"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1091","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"the desk and the telephone\nand the microphone","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2648.88,2650.94"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1092","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"all seem much less intrusive","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2650.94,2654.61"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1093","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"than they did within that other\nsystem that I was working in.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2655.23,2660.22"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1094","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\nThat's possible I think, yeah.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2660.22,2661.88"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1095","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS:\nAnd in fact my own identity,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2661.88,2664.11"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1096","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"as a therapist or whatever,\nseems less intrusive.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2664.11,2666.83"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1097","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And the idea that the person's\na patient seems less intrusive.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2666.83,2670.26"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1098","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Or the idea there's anything\nto *do* seems less intrusive.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2670.26,2673.6"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1099","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"JIM GREEN:\nRight. It isn't really clear","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2673.6,2674.82"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1100","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"what the particular\nproblem is actually.\n[Laughter]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2674.82,2677.83"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1101","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\nWell there's a time gap.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2681.815,2683.94"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1102","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"JIM GREEN:\nThere *is* a time gap perhaps,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2683.94,2685.39"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1103","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"but perhaps not,\nafter all...","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2685.39,2686.61"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1104","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\nMaybe need to grow up.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2686.61,2689.82"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1105","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"As young therapist up\nto old therapist.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2689.82,2693.08"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1106","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"JIM GREEN: It's good\nif that happens in times.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2693.08,2694.73"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1107","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Well--\nJIM GREEN: It's timely.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2694.73,2697.28"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1108","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\nOtherwise you die sooner.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2697.28,2698.62"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1109","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"JIM GREEN: Yeah.\nRAM DASS: Ah! [Laughs]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2698.62,2702.98"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1110","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"JIM GREEN:\nThings should be seasonable,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2702.98,2704.2"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1111","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"but it doesn't seem\nso urgent either perhaps.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2704.2,2707.66"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1112","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\nThat's a philosophical remark.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2707.66,2709.24"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1113","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"JIM GREEN: Well yes.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2709.24,2711.24"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1114","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"DUNCAN CAMPBELL: Well maybe what\nwe're talking about","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2711.24,2712.67"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1115","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"at a very simple level\n[laughter],","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2712.67,2714.14"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1116","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"is that when you've got the\npsychiatrist behind the desk,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2714.14,2717.73"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1117","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and *you're* on the other side\nof the desk,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2717.73,2719.37"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1118","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and *you're* the one\nthat's neurotic,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2719.37,2720.8"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1119","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and *he's* the one\nthat's sane,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2720.8,2722.66"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1120","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that already provides\na certain polarity","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2722.66,2724.6"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1121","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"which is very difficult\nto get beyond.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2724.6,2726.89"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1122","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"If you're the one\nthat's neurotic,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2726.89,2728.25"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1123","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"if you can't talk\non an eye-level,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2728.25,2729.98"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1124","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"friendly, communicative level\nwith a therapist,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2729.98,2732.45"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1125","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"it's only going\nto further reinforce","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2732.45,2734.86"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1126","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"your own feeling of being","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2734.86,2736.44"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1127","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"*you're* the one\nthat's screwed up,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2736.44,2737.66"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1128","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and *you're* the one\nthat's neurotic.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2737.66,2739.34"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1129","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And that's what\nwe're really talking about,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2739.34,2740.67"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1130","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"is how can we create a space,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2740.67,2742.98"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1131","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"or a model which allows\nthat kind of communication","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2742.98,2746.55"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1132","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"back and forth to take place?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2746.55,2749.41"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1133","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"JOHN BAKER: But I think what\nthis conversation [laughs]--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2749.41,2754.99"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1134","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\nIf you could call it.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2754.99,2756.9"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1135","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"JOHN BAKER: --is precisely\nthe question of model.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2756.9,2758.37"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1136","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I mean when a psychiatrist\nsits behind his desk--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2758.37,2760.975"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1137","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: He has a model.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2760.975,2761.491"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1138","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"JOHN BAKER:\n--he's got a particular model.\nRAM DASS: Yeah.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2761.491,2763.47"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1139","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"JOHN BAKER: And if you talk\nabout enlightenment","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2763.47,2764.77"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1140","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"or being a guru,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2764.77,2766.44"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1141","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that likewise\nis a particular model.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2766.44,2769.07"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1142","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And the question is,\ndo you reject one model","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2769.07,2771.09"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1143","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"in favor of a better one?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2771.09,2772.37"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1144","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS:\nThat's still horizontal.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2772.37,2773.62"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1145","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"JOHN BAKER:\nThat's still horizontal.\nRAM DASS: Yeah.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2773.62,2776.07"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1146","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"JOHN BAKER:\nNow, I think--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2776.07,2777.33"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1147","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS:\nThat's a model.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2777.33,2778.54"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1148","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"JOHN BAKER: --I think that's\nwhat's being discussed here.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2778.54,2782.7"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1149","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"The question of,\nis a spiritual model","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2782.7,2784.84"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1150","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"necessarily better\nthan a secular one,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2784.84,2787.59"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1151","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that of a guru better\nthan the psychiatrist?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2787.59,2791.93"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1152","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And it seems like\nit's a tricky point--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2791.93,2793.31"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1153","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: I don't think the word\nis \"spiritual\" and \"secular\";","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2793.31,2795.99"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1154","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"it just seems to me\nthat the training I received","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2795.99,2799.69"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1155","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"as a Western psychologist\nleft me in a position","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2799.69,2804.4"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1156","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"where I was not open\nas a student, really,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2804.4,2808.15"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1157","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"to keep doing\nthe work on myself.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2808.15,2812.37"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1158","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"It got me--\nI mean there was a whole idea,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2812.37,2814.21"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1159","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"once I'd been given the PhD\nand had the credentials,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2814.21,2816.76"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1160","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I knew something,\nand I was a knowledgeable person","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2816.76,2820.52"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1161","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"who, you know, then\nshould function a certain way.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2820.52,2822.59"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1162","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And there was a certain fixity\nabout the whole structure.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2822.59,2826.4"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1163","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And breaking out of that,\nback into the student role,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2826.4,2829.6"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1164","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"of surrendering that,\nthat's what seems to me","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2829.6,2831.82"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1165","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"the healthy quality\nof the growth of psychology","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2831.82,2835.62"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1166","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"in the West at this moment.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2835.62,2836.86"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1167","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"JOHN BAKER: So you--\nwhat you've just said then","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2836.86,2838.59"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1168","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"is that you think that\nthe student role is better","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2838.59,2840.25"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1169","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"than that of the teacher,\nas a model--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2840.25,2842.73"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1170","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: I think\nthe student role is better","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2842.73,2844.26"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1171","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"than that of the teacher, yeah.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2844.26,2845.53"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1172","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: But then you\nhave to have kind of--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2845.53,2850.14"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1173","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"the issue came up\nthe other day as well,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2850.14,2852.11"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1174","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"the same thing,\nis that should you have","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2852.11,2854.95"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1175","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"a constant cultural revolution\nof some kind or other,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2854.95,2858.27"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1176","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that when you become advanced,\nknowledgeable student then,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2858.27,2861.78"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1177","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"you know, push back.\nAnd how far you can do that?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2861.78,2866.93"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1178","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"It seems in the past\nin according to the tradition,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2866.93,2869.64"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1179","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that lot of the great teachers","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2869.64,2871.13"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1180","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"didn't have to go through\nself-criticism,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2871.13,2874.4"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1181","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"having become great teachers;\nthey stayed where they are.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2874.4,2878.56"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1182","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And somehow\nthere's some gap in logic.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2878.56,2881.87"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1183","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And we have to solve\nthat problem.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2881.87,2883.37"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1184","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS:\nDid you say they didn't have to\nor they did have to?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2883.37,2885.88"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1185","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: They didn't.\nRAM DASS: They didn't have to.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2885.88,2887.15"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1186","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\nWhen they become guru","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2887.15,2888.63"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1187","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and when there was inheritance\nof spiritual initiation,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2888.63,2893.7"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1188","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"abhisheka, and they stood.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2893.7,2897.46"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1189","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And their grandfathers honored\nthat as well,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2897.46,2900.87"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1190","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"or great-great-grandfathers\nas well.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2900.87,2902.46"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1191","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: And did that maintain","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2902.46,2903.74"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1192","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"the living spirit\nof the tradition?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2903.74,2905.28"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1193","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\nSomething is living,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2905.28,2906.52"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1194","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"rather than, you know,\nrevolutionary or democracy","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2906.52,2910.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1195","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"of some kind;\nthere's a problem with that.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2910.0,2913.09"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1196","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Maybe it's cultural,\nbut the tradition--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2913.09,2916.51"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1197","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"old traditions came\nfrom theocracy of some kind.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2916.51,2923.61"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1198","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And our new tradition\nis democracy...\nRAM DASS: Yeah.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2923.61,2929.27"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1199","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: I don't know,\nthere is a gap there;","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2929.27,2930.89"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1200","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"we should look into that,\nyou know.\nRAM DASS: Yeah. Yeah.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2930.89,2933.44"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1201","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: That you can't\nconstantly recommend people","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2933.44,2935.79"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1202","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"to be student constantly.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2935.79,2937.58"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1203","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: Well-- it doesn't--\nit's the ability to be in a way","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2937.58,2941.77"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1204","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"in both roles, simultaneously,\nin the sense of staying--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2941.77,2945.87"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1205","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"you once said to me,\n\"It's okay--\"","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2945.87,2947.84"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1206","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I said to you, \"Is it all right\nto keep going out","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2947.84,2950.68"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1207","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and lecturing when I know\nhow much uncooked,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2950.68,2953.32"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1208","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"you know, with my model about\nwho I thought I wasn't?\"","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2953.32,2956.58"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1209","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And you said, \"As long\nas you remain a student.\"\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Yeah.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2956.58,2960.44"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1210","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: But I'm in\nthe role of a teacher,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2960.44,2962.25"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1211","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"but it's very much\nthe role of a student.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2962.25,2964.17"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1212","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And to me these come together\nvery beautifully;","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2964.17,2966.41"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1213","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I don't find that\nas a contradiction that much.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2966.41,2968.63"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1214","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\nWell...","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2968.63,2971.81"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1215","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"something very slippery there.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2972.787,2974.99"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1216","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: Hmm?\n[Laughing]\nSlippery?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2974.99,2977.54"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1217","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"You wanted to\nprotect tradition and lineage","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2977.54,2979.04"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1218","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and I just think--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2979.04,2980.28"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1219","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"DUNCAN CAMPBELL:\nWell you did just say though,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2980.28,2981.5"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1220","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"you know,\nthat the student role","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2981.5,2982.77"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1221","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"was better\nthan the teacher role.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2982.77,2984.07"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1222","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And there was something\nstrange about that,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2984.07,2985.79"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1223","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"because it would seem\nthat the obvious statement","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2985.79,2988.2"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1224","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"would be that the student role\nand the teacher role","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2988.2,2990.15"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1225","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"are somehow the same.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2990.15,2991.77"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1226","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And I really wonder\nwhat you meant by that,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2991.77,2993.33"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1227","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"when you said\nthe student role","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2993.33,2994.57"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1228","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"is \"better than\"\nthe teacher role?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2994.57,2995.78"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1229","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS:\nYou may end up being a teacher,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2995.78,2997.59"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1230","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"but I think when you *think*\nyou are a teacher you aren't.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=2997.59,3000.41"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1231","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I mean, that's what I really--\nI'm talking at a lower level --","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3000.41,3003.51"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1232","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I can't use the word \"level\"\nanymore.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3003.51,3005.02"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1233","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I'm talking--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3005.02,3006.105"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1234","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: I suppose--\n[laughter; laughs]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3006.105,3009.175"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1235","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I suppose the problem comes up","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3009.175,3011.16"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1236","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"is when you become a guru\nwho's also student,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3011.16,3020.06"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1237","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and working with the people\nas student.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3020.06,3023.24"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1238","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"But then, where's your guru?\nWhat happened to the hierarchy?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3023.24,3031.47"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1239","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Should the guru be also\nmade into a student,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3031.47,3034.82"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1240","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and you could teach *him*\nor *her* that lesson?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3034.82,3038.68"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1241","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So you see there is a kind\nof hierarchical problem.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3038.68,3043.89"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1242","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: The hierarchical\nproblem only exists","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3043.89,3045.8"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1243","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"in the early stages\nof the process.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3045.8,3048.02"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1244","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"After a while the guru\nis everywhere;","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3048.02,3049.68"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1245","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"it's all the teaching.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3049.68,3050.92"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1246","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And the guru is giving you\nthe teaching","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3050.92,3052.29"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1247","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"wherever you look,\nwhoever you meet.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3052.29,3053.55"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1248","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Well who is\nthe spokesman for that?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3053.55,3056.32"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1249","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: Your heart.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3056.32,3058.17"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1250","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Which is one\nperson's heart or...?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3058.17,3061.75"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1251","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: Each person's heart.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3061.75,3063.18"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1252","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\nWell, so then everybody--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3063.18,3065.79"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1253","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"we have no right to be here--\nRAM DASS: That's true.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3065.79,3068.38"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1254","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\n--on this platform.\nRAM DASS: That's equally true.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3068.38,3070.88"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1255","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Yeah.\nRAM DASS: Sure.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3070.88,3072.74"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1256","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\nSo, how we could hold the fort?\n[Ram Dass laughs; laughter]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3072.74,3078.19"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1257","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And what happens with lineage?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3078.19,3080.83"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1258","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS:\nWell I think we do this","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3081.57,3082.78"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1259","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"until everybody realizes this.\n[Laughter]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3082.78,3088.875"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1260","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I mean the game isn't to end up","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3088.875,3092.32"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1261","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"having everybody need\nsomebody out there.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3092.32,3096.07"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1262","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Or on or out there or then,\neven-- you...\n[Laughter]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3096.07,3108.15"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1263","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"It's a self-destruct\nsystem really.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3108.15,3111.8"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1264","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\nMr. Moderator I think","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3115.84,3117.09"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1265","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"you have to intervene\nsome place.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3117.09,3118.34"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1266","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"DUNCAN CAMPBELL:\nWell I think we ought","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3118.34,3119.56"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1267","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"to get down\nto brass tacks then,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3119.56,3120.82"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1268","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"as to what kind of system\nwould in fact do","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3120.82,3125.69"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1269","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"just what you're saying?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3125.69,3127.32"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1270","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"You know, what kind of system\nis the best design","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3127.32,3130.67"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1271","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"to kind of short circuit\nthat process,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3130.67,3132.92"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1272","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"while honoring all of the,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3132.92,3135.38"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1273","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"you know, neurotic elements\nin all of us?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3135.38,3138.89"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1274","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"How do you create\na series of practices,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3138.89,3141.56"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1275","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"for instance meditation\npractices, or mantra practices,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3141.56,3144.72"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1276","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"or devotional practices\nof any kind,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3144.72,3147.31"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1277","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that free a person\nto get beyond,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3147.31,3151.42"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1278","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"you know like his own trip","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3151.42,3152.69"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1279","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"about substituting one system\nfor another?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3152.69,3156.96"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1280","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Maybe we ought to talk\nabout it in those terms,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3158.11,3160.86"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1281","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"you know, like just\nin terms of a system;","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3160.86,3162.28"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1282","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"what kind of practices seem to\nbe the most conducive to that?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3162.28,3165.52"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1283","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\nWell you have a problem there,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3165.52,3167.4"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1284","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"if I may begin,\nis that introducing a technique,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3167.4,3176.47"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1285","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"or particular practice,\nit's not group effort,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3176.47,3183.84"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1286","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"according to the spiritual\nhierarchy that we know,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3183.84,3186.69"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1287","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"of *all* the traditions,\ngreat traditions of religions:","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3186.69,3189.56"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1288","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Hinduism, Buddhism,\nChristianity,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3189.56,3191.77"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1289","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Judaism,\nthings be handed down.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3191.77,3195.95"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1290","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"There's an immediate problem.\nThat student might say that,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3198.69,3204.7"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1291","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\"What right you have to\ngive us this thing,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3204.7,3206.95"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1292","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that we have to sit\non our ass for ten hours?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3206.95,3212.32"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1293","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"What kind of authorities?\nWho gave you that authority?\"","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3213.02,3217.88"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1294","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: The student gives\nyou that authority--\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Well when--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3217.88,3220.53"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1295","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: The student gives you\nthat authority by their despair,\nwhich they're--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3220.53,3223.44"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1296","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: No, but when\nthe student begin to revolt,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3223.44,3226.57"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1297","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and begin to ask *you*\na question--\nRAM DASS: Good-- yeah.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3226.57,3229.2"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1298","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: And then,\nhe takes away, you know--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3229.2,3231.86"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1299","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS:\nTakes away the authority.\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: --authority.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3231.86,3235.1"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1300","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So you can't wave the Koran\nor the Bible,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3235.1,3238.44"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1301","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and \"This is my authority.\"","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3238.44,3241.08"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1302","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"There is a very\nawkward moment there.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3241.08,3242.62"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1303","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: There's a what?\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\nAwkward moment.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3242.62,3245.17"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1304","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: An awkward moment.\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Yeah.\nRAM DASS: Hopefully, yes.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3245.17,3247.39"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1305","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\nWell, why hopefully? [Laughing]\nWell maybe that's it.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3247.39,3249.82"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1306","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS:\nThat's the spark you talk about.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3249.82,3251.13"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1307","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"That's the spark, because it's\nyour being that is the teacher.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3251.13,3255.12"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1308","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I mean in\nthe ultimate analysis...","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3255.12,3257.75"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1309","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"to you your lineage\nis important,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3257.75,3260.6"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1310","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"to me the part of the teaching\nis the spark,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3260.6,3264.23"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1311","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"or is the process of the being,\nor the connection to the being.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3264.23,3268.55"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1312","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Do you have\nanything to say about that?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3268.55,3269.615"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1313","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"JIM GREEN: Nothing.\n[Laughter; laughs]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3269.615,3280.99"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1314","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS:\nWe-- just like the other day","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3280.99,3282.63"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1315","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"we talked about eclecticism\nversus a single tradition.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3282.63,3288.49"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1316","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And I think we dealt with\nthe issue of stages of sadhana,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3288.49,3293.94"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1317","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"or stages of development,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3293.94,3295.55"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1318","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and that there were stages\nwhen a person was--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3295.55,3300.83"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1319","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"had enough \"gyan\"\nor enough \"vidya\",","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3300.83,3305.36"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1320","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"enough of that\nkind of knowledge,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3305.36,3307.25"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1321","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"to be able to honor a tradition\nas a functional entity","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3307.25,3312.04"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1322","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"to take you from here to here,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3312.04,3315.5"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1323","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"or here to there or however\nyou want to say it.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3315.5,3317.89"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1324","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\nBut the problem seem to be\nis that the spokesman's role.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3317.89,3323.95"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1325","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"That if there is sacred,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3324.79,3327.34"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1326","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and very sane and very\nsolid message comes down--\nRAM DASS: Yeah.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3327.34,3333.17"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1327","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\n--why do you have to play","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3333.17,3338.56"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1328","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"the role of student, teacher,\nflipping back and forth?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3338.56,3345.43"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1329","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS:\nYou don't have to play any role.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3345.43,3349.1"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1330","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"At the point\nwhere there is no role","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3351.39,3353.11"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1331","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that you're particularly\nconnected with,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3353.11,3354.99"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1332","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"the whole issue is irrelevant\nat that point --","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3354.99,3356.86"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1333","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"then you merely *are*\nthe lineage,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3356.86,3358.74"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1334","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"you are the statement of it,\nthe living statement of it.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3358.74,3360.63"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1335","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Yeah, but--\nRAM DASS: Until then--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3360.63,3361.91"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1336","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: --spokesman--\nRAM DASS: --the optimum strategy\nis that of a student.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3361.91,3367.04"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1337","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\nI think there is a [laughing]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3367.04,3368.33"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1338","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"big gap somewhere.\nRAM DASS: Hmm?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3368.33,3369.99"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1339","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\nThere is a gap somewhere.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3369.99,3371.26"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1340","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"DUNCAN CAMPBELL:\nWell it sounds to me like what","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3371.26,3372.53"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1341","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"you're saying is that, you know,\nif you're *in* a certain role,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3372.53,3375.07"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1342","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"like if you're behind the desk\nas the therapist,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3375.07,3377.2"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1343","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"or if you're up in front of\nthe microphone as the teacher,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3377.2,3379.99"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1344","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that there something about that","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3379.99,3381.25"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1345","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that you have to take\nresponsibility for.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3381.25,3383.49"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1346","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"You have to actually *do*","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3383.49,3384.74"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1347","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that with a certain\nkind of confidence,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3384.74,3386.46"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1348","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"without providing\nthat little escape hatch of,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3386.46,3389.38"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1349","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\"Well I'm just as neurotic\nas you are,\"","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3389.38,3391.63"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1350","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and somehow that weakens\nthe whole situation.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3391.63,3395.49"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1351","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: Does it?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3395.49,3396.84"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1352","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"DUNCAN CAMPBELL:\nIt feels that way to me,\nand I throw that out.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3396.84,3398.66"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1353","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Well--\ndo you have anything\nto say John?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3398.66,3403.36"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1354","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"JOHN BAKER:\nWell it's like,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3404.31,3406.01"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1355","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Rinpoche you\nwere talking more like","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3406.01,3408.33"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1356","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"we shouldn't refer back.\nLet's see,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3408.33,3414.4"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1357","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I'll try a sort\nof a pat statement.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3414.4,3419.04"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1358","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"If you take it as it's done\nin the Buddhist tradition,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3419.04,3423.64"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1359","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that sort of\nthe definition of ego","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3423.64,3426.5"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1360","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"is that it constantly\nwants to secure itself,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3426.5,3431.48"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1361","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"then a spiritual path\nbecomes somewhat tricky process.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3431.48,3435.62"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1362","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Uh huh--\nRAM DASS: [INAUDIBLE]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3435.62,3439.27"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1363","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"JOHN BAKER: Because we're\ntalking about motivation.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3439.27,3442.88"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1364","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And motivation in this sense\ncould be the tool of ego:","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3442.88,3448.49"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1365","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\"I want to get enlightened,\nI want to stop suffering,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3448.49,3452.06"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1366","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I want to be wise.\"","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3452.06,3455.4"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1367","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Then the problem comes that\nif the teachings,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3455.4,3458.08"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1368","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"the essence of the teachings,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3458.08,3460.07"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1369","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"are in fact the spark\nthat cuts through ego,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3460.07,3462.98"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1370","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that steps out\nof ego's manipulation,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3462.98,3464.75"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1371","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that goes beyond\nthe student's","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3464.75,3466.71"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1372","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"or the practitioner's desire\nto see something,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3466.71,3472.87"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1373","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"to experience something,\nto get someplace,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3472.87,3476.39"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1374","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that that spark has to be\ncompletely spontaneous.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3476.39,3479.52"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1375","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"If you then co-opt it into\nthe teaching and say,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3479.52,3481.86"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1376","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\"Well we're looking\nfor this spark.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3481.86,3484.01"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1377","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And we're going to try\nand create it,\"","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3484.01,3485.96"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1378","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"then you've made--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3485.96,3487.24"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1379","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"you've put it into\nego's employ, once again.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3487.24,3490.62"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1380","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And I think it's something\nof the same situation","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3490.62,3494.95"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1381","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"with the role you take.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3494.95,3497.38"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1382","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"In other words, \"Sure, where\nthe final position may be that","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3497.38,3505.66"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1383","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I'm neither a teacher\nnor a student.\"","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3505.66,3508.71"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1384","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"But if you don't commit yourself\nto one stance or another","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3508.71,3510.86"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1385","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"until before you've reached\nthat point,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3510.86,3513.82"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1386","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"then you're trying to kind of--\nyou keep trying to co-opt--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3513.82,3516.28"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1387","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"you see you're trying to be\nthe goal before you get to it.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3516.28,3519.06"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1388","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And you can't have\nthat spontaneity","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3519.06,3520.31"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1389","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"because you keep\nop-opting it into ego.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3520.31,3523.24"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1390","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"JIM GREEN: Yes, it's as if\nthere's an apparent progression:","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3523.24,3525.66"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1391","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"you start off as the \"therapist\nexpert\" with a client,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3525.66,3528.74"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1392","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and then you realize\nyou're neurotic too,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3528.74,3530.76"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1393","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"so you remain the therapist","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3530.76,3532.4"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1394","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"but you acknowledge\nthat you're neurotic.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3532.4,3534.01"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1395","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And nevertheless\nyou remain in the role.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3534.01,3536.53"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1396","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"You-- and you may even seek\nas a student some solution;","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3536.53,3540.58"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1397","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"recognize that you're neurotic","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3540.58,3541.91"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1398","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and find someone\nwho will cure you.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3541.91,3543.36"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1399","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Nevertheless you go\non functioning as a therapist,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3543.36,3545.55"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1400","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"who however is decent,\nbecause I-- he--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3545.55,3548.82"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1401","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\"I acknowledge\nthat I'm neurotic.\"","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3548.82,3550.86"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1402","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And that seems to be somehow\nan unsatisfactory situation,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3550.86,3553.85"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1403","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"although it can go on\nfor a very long time.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3553.85,3556.26"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1404","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"At some point,\nprobably one has to see,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3556.26,3559.46"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1405","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that the play of neurosis","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3559.46,3561.14"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1406","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"which constitute the therapeutic\nsituation as unsound in itself.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3561.14,3564.85"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1407","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And it may be\na therapeutic situation","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3564.85,3566.6"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1408","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"or any sort of\nteaching situation.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3566.6,3569.47"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1409","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And at that point one\nmight see the possibility","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3569.47,3572.25"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1410","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that the teaching situation\nis not a situation:","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3572.25,3575.59"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1411","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that is there's no particular\nsituation one needs,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3575.59,3577.8"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1412","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"or institution or role,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3577.8,3579.41"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1413","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"in order for teaching\nor learning to take place.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3579.41,3581.89"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1414","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And even that there isn't\na difference","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3581.89,3583.33"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1415","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"between teaching and learning.\nIt seems that that--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3583.33,3585.82"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1416","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"one can imagine that sort\nof progression taking place.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3585.82,3588.18"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1417","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Now [INAUDIBLE].","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3588.18,3592.2"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1418","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"JOHN BAKER:\nI mean it always seems,\nyou know, in--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3592.2,3596.12"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1419","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"there's this statement\nby Shantarakshita,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3596.12,3598.96"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1420","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"where he says\nsomething about,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3598.96,3601.1"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1421","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\"The spark of wisdom\nstrikes like lightning,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3601.1,3605.11"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1422","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and illumines the world.\"","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3605.11,3606.88"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1423","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And I think what he's talking\nabout is the complete,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3606.88,3610.52"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1424","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"you know, spontaneity\nwith which that has to strike,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3610.52,3612.64"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1425","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that it can't be something\nthat we create","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3612.64,3614.91"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1426","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"by trying to be enlightened.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3614.91,3616.99"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1427","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I mean, it's that concept--\nyou like the story of Naropa,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3616.99,3621.17"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1428","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that we put in the front\nof the catalogue--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3621.17,3622.96"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1429","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS:\nYeah, well in that case\nyou can be the lineage,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3622.96,3625.52"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1430","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"but you can't think\nyou are teaching a tradition,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3625.52,3630.09"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1431","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"because that stifles\nthe spark.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3630.09,3632.67"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1432","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"JOHN BAKER:\nWell, I think you--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3632.67,3633.98"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1433","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"as long as you think\nthat you are you've got to.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3633.98,3636.72"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1434","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I mean you've got\nto play the game","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3636.72,3638.68"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1435","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"according to the rules\nthat you've got,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3638.68,3640.8"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1436","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"because you can't keep\ntrying to change the rules","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3640.8,3643.06"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1437","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"to make them according\nto what the book say","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3643.06,3644.82"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1438","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"they're supposed to be.\nIn other words it's like,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3644.82,3647.75"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1439","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"accepting where you are,\nat whatever level,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3647.75,3651.56"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1440","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that's the place you got\nto accept and start with,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3651.56,3654.04"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1441","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"wouldn't you say?\nI mean I'm sure you would.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3654.04,3655.72"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1442","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS:\nYeah, that part I would say.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3655.72,3656.98"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1443","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"The [laughing]\nfirst part I didn't say--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3656.98,3658.41"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1444","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I didn't accept\nthe whole statement.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3658.41,3660.16"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1445","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"[Laughs]\nThat's sneaky.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3660.16,3661.41"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1446","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"JOHN BAKER:\nBut like-- it's like--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3661.41,3662.65"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1447","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"JIM GREEN: It's the lineage\nthat bugs you, huh?\nRAM DASS: He's very--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3662.65,3665.19"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1448","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"JOHN BAKER:\nIt's like you know--\nRAM DASS: --shifty. [Laughter]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3665.19,3667.69"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1449","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"JOHN BAKER:\nYou know what I'm trying to say.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3667.69,3672.72"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1450","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS:\nI agree, \"Mother and a flag","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3672.72,3674.04"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1451","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and apple pie are good,\"\nyes. [Laughs]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3674.04,3682.3"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1452","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\nI think there is... please.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3682.3,3689.49"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1453","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: It was interesting\nthat","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3689.49,3690.76"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1454","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"when I first went\nto the convocation exercises","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3690.76,3695.77"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1455","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"of the new Naropa Institute\nand listened to you gentlemen","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3695.77,3699.83"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1456","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"talking about lineage\nand tradition,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3699.83,3702.77"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1457","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I was somewhat\ntaken aback,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3702.77,3704.32"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1458","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"because to me I guess\nas a Westerner, lineage","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3704.32,3706.84"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1459","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and tradition has always been\nconnected with deadness,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3706.84,3710.55"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1460","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and the lack of spark,\nreally, right?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3710.55,3713.62"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1461","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Now to me it is only conceivable\nthat a lineage or a tradition","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3713.62,3717.02"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1462","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"can be transmitted\nthrough a living entity,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3717.02,3720.44"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1463","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"who is the spark itself.\nIn other words I think","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3720.44,3725.11"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1464","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that Naropa requires\nTrungpa Rinpoche, right?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3725.11,3729.43"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1465","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I don't think it play--\nit would spark without that.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3729.43,3732.71"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1466","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"It's like well\nyou need that flint","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3732.71,3733.94"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1467","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"to get the game going, right?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3733.94,3736.07"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1468","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And the flint is not that\nhe thinks he is the teacher --","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3736.07,3739.43"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1469","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I don't, I'm not describing it,\nbut that he *is* the teacher;","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3739.43,3743.3"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1470","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that he *is* the lineage,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3743.3,3744.57"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1471","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"not that he *thinks*\nhe is the lineage.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3744.57,3747.13"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1472","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And until one *is* that thing,\nit is most functional,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3747.13,3752.08"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1473","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"it seems to me,\nto remain wide open,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3752.08,3754.2"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1474","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"all the time to all possibility.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3754.2,3756.28"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1475","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Which to me is what I call\nthe student role.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3756.28,3758.57"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1476","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Even though I have to get up\nand teach every day.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3758.57,3761.22"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1477","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"JOHN BAKER: But, you've got\nto take a chance.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3761.22,3764.29"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1478","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I mean being wide open\ncan't mean","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3764.29,3766.66"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1479","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"sort of taking the safest\nposition, like, \"I'm a nobody.\"","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3766.66,3771.02"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1480","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"It's-- as long as you think\nyou're somebody,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3771.02,3773.32"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1481","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"you've got to try","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3773.32,3774.54"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1482","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and *be* somebody\nand see what that brings.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3774.54,3777.11"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1483","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"That's the really,\nyou know, gutsy","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3777.11,3778.69"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1484","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and courageous thing to do,\nis sticking your neck out.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3778.69,3782.3"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1485","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And then you can get it\nchopped off. Which would be--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3782.3,3785.75"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1486","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: We are *certainly*\ndoing that now.\n[Laughter; Laughs]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3785.75,3788.79"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1487","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"JOHN BAKER:\nYeah. Here it comes.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3790.17,3792.2"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1488","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"DUNCAN CAMPBELL:\nSpeaking of that,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3795.91,3797.17"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1489","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I think this is\nan ideal time for a break.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3797.17,3799.86"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1490","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\nI think so, yes.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3799.86,3801.11"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1491","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"JIM GREEN: It's a good time.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3801.11,3804.28"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1492","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"[Applause]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3804.28,3815.892"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1493","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"DUNCAN CAMPBELL:\nWell it seems to me","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3833.695,3834.66"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1494","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that one of\nthe central questions","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3834.66,3836.14"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1495","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that has been involved\nin this whole discussion,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3836.14,3838.26"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1496","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"is what kind of model\nyou can work with","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3838.26,3841.43"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1497","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"in order to develop personality\nbeyond its own self deception.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3841.43,3845.82"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1498","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"That if you give\nany kind of ego a model","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3845.82,3848.53"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1499","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"to substitute\nfor its pre-existing model,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3848.53,3851.56"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1500","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"you've created the same trap\nall over again.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3851.56,3853.95"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1501","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And so on one hand","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3853.95,3855.22"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1502","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"we can have the model\nof two cars in the garage,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3855.22,3857.64"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1503","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and a successful career,\nand then that person drops out","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3857.64,3860.85"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1504","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"because he finds\nit unsatisfactory","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3860.85,3862.48"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1505","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and he becomes\na spiritual seeker.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3862.48,3864.88"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1506","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And as a spiritual seeker\nhe finds","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3864.88,3866.75"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1507","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that he's seeking enlightenment,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3866.75,3868.85"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1508","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and it's the same pattern\nall over again.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3868.85,3871.29"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1509","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And it almost sounds to me as if\nit's really not quite possible","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3871.29,3875.15"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1510","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"for a single person","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3875.15,3876.51"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1511","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"to see through\nthat self-deception on his own.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3876.51,3880.58"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1512","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And what that raises,\nas far as I'm concerned,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3880.58,3883.99"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1513","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"is the whole question\nof a teacher,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3883.99,3886.72"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1514","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and a tradition in which\none can commit oneself","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3886.72,3889.85"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1515","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and work with\na single individual","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3889.85,3891.99"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1516","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"who *has*\nthat kind of awareness.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3891.99,3894.12"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1517","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Because it's really up to\nthe teacher to bring up the ego","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3894.12,3898.03"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1518","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and bust it down\nand bring it up again","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3898.03,3899.98"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1519","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and bust it down and bring it\nup again and bust it down.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3899.98,3903.44"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1520","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And if there hasn't been\nthat kind of commitment,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3903.44,3905.95"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1521","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"to a tradition\nor a single teacher,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3905.95,3908.15"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1522","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"it seems like\nthe spiritual search","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3908.15,3909.81"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1523","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"could just be a kind of\nsupermarket shopping enterprise","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3909.81,3913.36"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1524","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"where you pick up a technique\nhere and a technique there.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3913.36,3916.38"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1525","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And it's almost like trying\nto do psychiatry","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3916.38,3918.35"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1526","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"without a psychiatrist,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3918.35,3920.47"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1527","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"by reading a whole bunch\nof books on Freud and Jung.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3920.47,3923.26"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1528","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And I mean I think\nthat's *really*","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3923.26,3924.73"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1529","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"the question\nwe've been going about","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3924.73,3926.2"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1530","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"during this whole discussion,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3926.2,3927.41"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1531","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and I'd like to see\nthat addressed,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3927.41,3929.8"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1532","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"as to how necessary the teacher\nis -- the living teacher --","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3929.8,3933.18"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1533","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"in order to make\nthis Eastern model","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3933.18,3935.24"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1534","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"of psychological development\nactually work.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3935.24,3938.76"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1535","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"[Laughter]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3938.76,3948.59"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1536","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"JIM GREEN:\nWell it does seem that we have","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3948.59,3950.51"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1537","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"a certain propensity\nto collecting things.\n[Laughs]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3950.51,3954.895"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1538","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"There's no doubt about that.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3954.895,3956.23"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1539","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"We may be collecting\nhigher states of consciousness,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3956.23,3960.28"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1540","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"or we may be collecting\na spiritual path,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3960.28,3963.93"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1541","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and it seems to be\nvery difficult","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3963.93,3965.79"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1542","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"to stop collecting by oneself.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3965.79,3968.54"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1543","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I would say that I find it\nparticularly difficult","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3968.54,3970.69"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1544","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"to stop collecting\nby oneself.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3970.69,3975.22"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1545","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And it may be\nthat one needs a teacher","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3975.22,3979.63"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1546","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"to exhibit that process\nof collecting.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3979.63,3983.21"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1547","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"It may be that\nit is too difficult,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3983.21,3986.7"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1548","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"at the more rarified levels\nof collecting,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3986.7,3989.3"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1549","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"to be aware that that process\nis going on in oneself.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3989.3,3992.34"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1550","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And in that case perhaps one\nneeds someone to point that out.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=3992.34,3998.841"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1551","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: There is a need\nfor a certain set of experiences","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4002.77,4007.01"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1552","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that do break\nthrough places you're stuck.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4007.01,4010.85"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1553","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Whether or not you want\nto narrow that down","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4010.85,4012.88"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1554","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"to being an external\nphysical plane teacher","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4012.88,4016.06"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1555","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"or not remains to be seen.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4016.06,4018.93"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1556","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"That within the tradition\nthat I feel attuned to,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4018.93,4027.54"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1557","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"it is the guru's grace that\nbreaks you out of that place.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4027.54,4032.34"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1558","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"But it is not necessarily\nthe guru's grace in some guru","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4032.34,4035.77"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1559","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"out there who comes up\nand hands you his grace","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4035.77,4037.95"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1560","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"or does his grace to you --","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4037.95,4040.04"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1561","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"it's a much more\nsubtle process than that.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4040.04,4042.54"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1562","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And while nobody can do it\nto themselves, really,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4042.54,4045.38"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1563","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"because the ego keeps\nperpetuating itself","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4045.38,4047.54"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1564","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"as you pointed out,\nit is--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4047.54,4050.72"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1565","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"once you have been\nin the presence","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4050.72,4053.04"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1566","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"of models\nof possibilities,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4053.04,4055.7"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1567","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"there is a faith\nthat is generated that leads you","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4055.7,4059.28"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1568","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"to re-perceive perceptual shifts\nin the universe,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4059.28,4063.09"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1569","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"so that you start\nto open yourself","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4063.09,4067.59"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1570","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"to teachings that are\noccurring around you.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4067.59,4070.18"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1571","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And it is through that vehicle","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4070.18,4072.32"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1572","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that there are many things\nthat hit you on the head","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4072.32,4074.56"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1573","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and shake you up\nand undercut you,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4074.56,4076.38"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1574","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and that as far as\nI'm concerned that I--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4076.38,4079.74"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1575","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that the guru can work totally\non say an astral plane --","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4079.74,4082.61"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1576","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"there may never be\na physical tradition","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4082.61,4085.47"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1577","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"where you go to a school\nand there's a teacher, you know.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4085.47,4087.6"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1578","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I think that's too narrow\na concept. That--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4087.6,4089.16"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1579","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"to me that's like collecting\nanother car in the garage.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4089.16,4091.27"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1580","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"JIM GREEN: But at some level\nthere may be a problem.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4091.27,4092.8"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1581","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"For example we know\nabout the three people","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4092.8,4094.66"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1582","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"who in the presence\nof Christ,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4094.66,4096.51"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1583","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"you know, came together\nin Michigan at the same time.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4096.51,4098.36"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1584","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"You know, \"The Three\nChrists of Ypsilanti.\"\nRAM DASS: Yeah. Yeah.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4098.36,4101.08"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1585","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"JIM GREEN:\nThere is a certain problem\nof [laughs]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4101.08,4103.73"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1586","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"becoming convinced\nabout your inner wisdom","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4103.73,4105.84"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1587","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"without any sort\nof external check at all.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4105.84,4107.93"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1588","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And it seems that can become\n[INAUDIBLE]--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4107.93,4109.54"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1589","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS:\nLook, we're not going to be--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4109.54,4111.31"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1590","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"enlightenment isn't something\nthat's validated","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4111.31,4113.04"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1591","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"by somebody else,\n[laughs] you know.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4113.04,4115.74"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1592","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"JIM GREEN: No, but it may be\nthat confusion","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4115.74,4117.19"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1593","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"is validated\nby somebody else.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4117.19,4119.69"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1594","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: Of course. [Laughter]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4119.69,4121.58"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1595","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"It's also validated ultimately\nby the failure of the game.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4121.58,4125.53"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1596","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"JIM GREEN:\nWell but it may not be,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4125.53,4126.74"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1597","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"because as one continues\nto generate","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4126.74,4128.56"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1598","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Christ fantasies\nfor example,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4128.56,4130.03"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1599","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"even in the face of the other\ntwo Christs in the same room,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4130.03,4133.6"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1600","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"there may be\nno invalidation possible.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4133.6,4137.56"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1601","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Unless one accepts some ground\nof invalidation if you like.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4137.56,4141.33"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1602","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS:\nWell that would assume","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4141.33,4142.54"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1603","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that there isn't\nthe grace of the guru.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4142.54,4145.01"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1604","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I mean I don't live--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4145.01,4146.33"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1605","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"to me there's another system\nthat's operating,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4146.33,4148.69"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1606","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"quite independent","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4148.69,4149.93"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1607","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"of whether somebody walks\ninto the room in Ypsilanti","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4149.93,4152.82"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1608","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and says, \"You are not Christ.\nAnd I'll prove it to you,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4152.82,4155.58"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1609","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"because I am,\" [laughs]\nor whatever.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4155.58,4158.52"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1610","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\nMaybe you can define","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4158.52,4159.76"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1611","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"the term \"grace.\"\nWhat do you mean by precisely?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4159.76,4164.62"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1612","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Adhishthana or...?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4166.34,4169.3"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1613","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS:\nI'm in a funny position.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4178.78,4180.2"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1614","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I remember--\nI asked my guru, I said,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4180.2,4182.26"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1615","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\"Isn't-- aren't grace\nand karma the same thing?\"","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4182.26,4185.32"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1616","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And he said, \"I won't discuss\nthat.\" [Laughs]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4185.32,4188.09"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1617","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So I don't really know.\n[Laughter]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4188.09,4191.06"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1618","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"From my point of view they're\nroughly within the same domain.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4191.06,4194.25"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1619","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"That it isn't grace\nin the sense of light--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4194.25,4196.95"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1620","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"somebody doing something\nin a compassionate act","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4196.95,4200.89"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1621","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"free of the law,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4200.89,4203.27"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1622","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"it's within the law\nthat something happens,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4203.27,4205.48"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1623","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"which you define in the sense\nof something being done --","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4205.48,4210.16"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1624","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"you call it grace.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4210.16,4212.69"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1625","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: You prefer\nto go as far as that rational?\nRAM DASS: Hmm?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4212.69,4215.9"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1626","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\nYou prefer to go far--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4215.9,4217.26"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1627","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"as far as that,\nto be rational.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4217.26,4219.42"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1628","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS:\nYeah, I'll go that far--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4219.42,4221.609"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1629","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: You think so?\nRAM DASS: --yeah.\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Yeah?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4221.609,4222.14"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1630","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: It's--\nyou know, it's scary.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4222.14,4223.41"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1631","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"It takes it out of the domain\nof the romance--\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Well--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4223.41,4226.33"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1632","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: --but it's okay.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4226.33,4227.55"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1633","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\nThat's creates the change","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4227.55,4230.1"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1634","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"of juxtaposition somewhere.\n[Laughs]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4230.1,4235.49"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1635","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS:\nNo, I don't think so.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4235.49,4237.37"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1636","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"It just clarifies the fact\nthat one awakens","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4237.37,4240.52"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1637","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"as it is one's karma to awaken.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4240.52,4243.27"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1638","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And that if it happens that\nthere's a physical plane teacher","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4243.27,4246.24"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1639","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that's the vehicle for it,\ngreat;","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4246.24,4247.57"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1640","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"it may be a leaf falling\nor it may be an astral being","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4247.57,4250.68"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1641","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"or it may be hitting your head\nor falling off a ladder.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4250.68,4256.17"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1642","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: How about idea\nof transcending karma?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4256.17,4262.56"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1643","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"That's ideally supposed\nto be enlightenment","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4262.56,4264.97"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1644","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"as that you can act freely\nwithout karmic debts.\nRAM DASS: Mhmm.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4264.97,4270.21"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1645","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\nBecause you don't make mistakes.\nRAM DASS: Mhmm.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4270.21,4272.71"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1646","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\nHow about that?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4272.71,4275.585"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1647","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: What do you mean\n\"how about that?\"?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4275.585,4275.586"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1648","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\nHow about that,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4275.586,4276.72"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1649","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"you know, I mean--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4276.72,4277.95"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1650","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: That's the end point.\nThat's the end point of it.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4277.95,4279.65"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1651","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\nEnd point of it. So there is--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4279.65,4281.47"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1652","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: And a being who is\nfunctioning outside of karma.\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Yeah.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4281.47,4284.98"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1653","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: But just because\nthey are capable","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4284.98,4287.52"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1654","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"of functioning\noutside of karma","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4287.52,4288.78"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1655","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"doesn't necessarily mean\nthey function","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4288.78,4290.7"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1656","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"outside of the law of--\nthe dharmic law,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4290.7,4293.35"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1657","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"which would be my karma\nfrom their point of view.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4293.35,4297.05"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1658","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Well I mean\nisn't there magic that can--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4297.05,4303.07"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1659","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: Only appearing so\nfrom another level.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4303.07,4308.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1660","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"DUNCAN CAMPBELL: Another level?\n[Laughter]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4308.7,4312.515"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1661","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS:\nYeah, [laughter] you know...","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4312.515,4312.8"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1662","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"DUNCAN CAMPBELL:\nWhat is this levels about?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4312.8,4314.08"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1663","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS:\nMiracles only seem miraculous","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4314.08,4315.99"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1664","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"when you don't know\nhow it works.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4315.99,4317.65"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1665","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"This seems miraculous\nif you don't know","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4317.65,4319.55"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1666","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"about this whole production.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4319.55,4320.715"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1667","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Which I don't, so there's...\n[laughs; laughter]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4320.715,4323.17"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1668","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\nWell it's...","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4323.17,4325.17"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1669","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"We had to be\nvery careful on that,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4325.17,4326.64"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1670","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"on the naivety\nand devotion, seemingly.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4326.64,4333.75"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1671","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Maybe somebody else\ncan discuss about this, their--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4333.75,4339.27"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1672","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"DUNCAN CAMPBELL:\nWell it seems to me","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4339.27,4340.5"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1673","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that the problem of devotion,\nas such, in any situation,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4340.5,4343.7"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1674","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"is that a lot of people\nin America","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4343.7,4345.57"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1675","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"have come from either\na Christian tradition","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4345.57,4347.75"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1676","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"or a Judaic tradition,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4347.75,4349.35"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1677","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"which involved a certain\ndevotional respect","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4349.35,4352.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1678","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"for that tradition.\nAnd at some point in our lives,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4352.0,4357.08"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1679","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that somehow became\nhollow and empty.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4357.08,4359.89"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1680","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And we became\nsomewhat cynical about it","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4359.89,4361.59"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1681","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"because it had just become\nan empty form.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4361.59,4366.17"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1682","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And then there took place\nthis sort of growing interest","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4366.17,4369.58"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1683","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"in Eastern traditions,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4369.58,4370.9"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1684","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"because they seem to speak\nto some of us","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4370.9,4373.28"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1685","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"from a psychological\nperspective,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4373.28,4374.97"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1686","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"a more direct perspective about\n\"who I am and the struggles","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4374.97,4378.4"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1687","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I have with my own\nneurotic personality,\"","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4378.4,4380.52"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1688","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and it made that link.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4380.52,4382.46"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1689","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"But even in these\nEastern traditions","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4382.46,4384.45"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1690","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"there is a devotional aspect.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4384.45,4387.05"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1691","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And it seems that the problem\nis how to properly","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4387.05,4393.56"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1692","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"get into\nthat kind of devotional feeling","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4394.82,4397.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1693","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"from your own\npersonal point of view,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4397.0,4398.66"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1694","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"without making it\na self-deceptive trap,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4398.66,4403.29"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1695","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"the same kind of duality that\nyou see in theocratic religions,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4403.29,4407.38"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1696","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"where God is there\nand he's very far out,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4407.38,4410.23"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1697","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and he's all that is,\nand you're somehow nothing","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4410.23,4413.41"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1698","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and you're working on\nthat dualistic model","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4413.41,4415.32"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1699","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"in trying to attain that.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4415.32,4418.17"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1700","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: It's not very far\nalong the path","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4418.17,4420.85"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1701","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that you begin to live\nwith paradox very comfortably.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4420.85,4425.4"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1702","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I can live with the fact","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4425.4,4426.74"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1703","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that I can say that grace\nand karma are the same thing,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4426.74,4430.21"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1704","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and at the same moment\nI can love my guru","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4430.21,4432.98"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1705","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and wait upon his grace,\nand live in both in those places","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4432.98,4436.47"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1706","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"without any apparent\ncontradiction.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4436.47,4438.62"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1707","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"You know, I mean\nthere is a contradiction,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4438.62,4441.17"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1708","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"but I don't feel\ndiscomforted by it.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4441.17,4443.21"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1709","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"In other words, I don't demand\nthat all of my--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4443.21,4446.45"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1710","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"the vehicle of opening the heart\nand loving something outside,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4446.45,4450.79"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1711","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and surrendering to it","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4450.79,4452.76"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1712","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and that whole relationship\nin any way is unusable","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4452.76,4458.84"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1713","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"because of my understanding\nof the law of karma.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4458.84,4463.55"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1714","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"To pit those against\none another","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4464.81,4466.22"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1715","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"just seems to me a very early\nkind of understanding","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4466.22,4471.03"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1716","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"of either\nthe intellect or bhakti.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4471.03,4474.49"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1717","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"DUNCAN CAMPBELL:\nBut that brings us back again","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4476.42,4477.73"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1718","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"to the basic question\nof the interplay","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4477.73,4480.1"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1719","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"between the teacher\nand the student,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4480.1,4482.11"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1720","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that what's happening between\nthis teacher and the student","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4482.11,4484.26"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1721","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"is not just that the student\nis honoring the teacher","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4484.26,4487.04"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1722","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"in a very bhakti devotional way,\nbut actually the teacher,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4487.04,4490.78"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1723","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"at least in\nthe Buddhist tradition,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4490.78,4492.14"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1724","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"is coming down very heavy on\nthe student from time to time,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4492.14,4494.95"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1725","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and pointing out\nhis self-deception,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4494.95,4496.72"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1726","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"in what can be\na very violent way at times.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4496.72,4499.87"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1727","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And if one has not made\nthat process of commitment","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4499.87,4502.6"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1728","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"to the relationship,\nthat could be so freakish","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4502.6,4505.59"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1729","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that you would just\nshy away from it","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4505.59,4507.93"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1730","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and go off to some\nother technique","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4507.93,4509.48"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1731","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"because it would be\nmore comfortable.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4509.48,4511.53"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1732","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And I think that's\nthe nitty-gritty","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4511.53,4512.97"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1733","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that we're really\ntrying to talk about.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4512.97,4514.45"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1734","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"It seems that way to me--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4514.45,4515.67"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1735","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\nMaybe we should discuss about","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4515.67,4516.94"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1736","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"what does actually mean bhakti,\nwhich has popular ideas,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4516.94,4522.01"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1737","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"as well as very esoteric\nmeanings behind it as well.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4522.01,4525.54"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1738","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"What does mean bhakti,\nby bhakti.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4525.54,4528.44"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1739","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Can you define\nthe meaning of bhakti?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4528.44,4534.18"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1740","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I think that a lot of problems\nthat we come up","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4539.15,4541.23"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1741","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"is that we take\nwords advantage already,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4541.23,4544.55"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1742","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that not knowing\nwhat does it really mean.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4544.55,4547.46"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1743","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: Well, actually\nit's a very interesting word,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4547.46,4554.95"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1744","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"because it has a lot of...","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4554.95,4558.88"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1745","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Perhaps if I describe\nwithin the Bhagavad Gita","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4560.81,4567.66"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1746","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"the way in which bhakti\nis reflected,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4567.66,4570.14"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1747","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that will deal\nwith your question.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4570.14,4573.98"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1748","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"The sadhak arrives\nat the Brahmanic state,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4575.24,4581.73"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1749","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"at which point where that being\nhas transcended ego","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4581.73,4586.29"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1750","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"or transcended the gunas.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4586.29,4588.03"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1751","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"At that point, they are\nin a position of freedom","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4588.03,4591.75"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1752","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"to perceive\nthe [UNCLEAR: purusha atman?]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4591.75,4593.69"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1753","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"or to perceive Krishna.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4593.69,4595.54"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1754","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And at that point, their actions\nhenceforth become dharmic.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4595.54,4600.19"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1755","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And their relation to Krishna\nis one of being within him","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4600.19,4605.42"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1756","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and yet separate from him.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4605.42,4607.87"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1757","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And the relationship is cemented\nby a devotional stance, okay.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4607.87,4613.49"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1758","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Mhmm.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4613.49,4615.85"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1759","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Well there may be\nsome problems with that,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4615.85,4619.57"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1760","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"in terms of how does that differ\nfrom an ordinary love affair?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4619.57,4628.19"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1761","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: It's not needful.\nIt's--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4629.34,4634.43"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1762","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"there is one as well\nas two simultaneously.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4634.43,4639.23"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1763","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\nWell all of those happens","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4639.86,4641.08"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1764","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"in an ordinary love affair.\nIf you are really in good--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4641.08,4644.75"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1765","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS:\nIf you're really in it,\nyou're in it, sure.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4644.75,4646.57"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1766","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\n--in it, you are in it yeah.\nIf you're really in love--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4646.57,4648.62"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1767","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS:\nWell I don't know what you mean\nby \"ordinary love affair.\"","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4648.62,4650.205"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1768","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I don't know what your\n[laughing]\nordinary love affair is.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4650.205,4652.03"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1769","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\nOrdinary, yeah.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4652.03,4652.51"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1770","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"When someone\nreally fall in love,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4652.51,4653.72"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1771","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"when somebody\nreally fall in love.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4653.72,4654.96"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1772","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: Well what does\n\"really fall in love\" mean?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4654.96,4656.28"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1773","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I-- there are many levels,\nthere's Christ love,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4656.28,4657.84"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1774","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"really fall\ninto Christ love?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4657.84,4659.09"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1775","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\nNo. No, I'm talking about just--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4659.09,4660.33"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1776","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: Fall into\npassionate love, you want.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4660.33,4661.68"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1777","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Biochemical love?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4661.68,4662.92"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1778","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\n--sexual, biochemical.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4662.92,4664.5"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1779","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"In the very ordinary sense,\nyou know,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4664.5,4668.1"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1780","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that all the romantic\nRomeo and Juliet.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4668.1,4672.66"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1781","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: Well that's within\nthe realm of polarities,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4672.66,4674.66"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1782","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and this isn't.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4674.66,4676.22"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1783","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\nBut they feel union.\nRAM DASS: Hmm?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4676.22,4678.8"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1784","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: They feel a\nsense of union at the same time.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4678.8,4680.73"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1785","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: At that moment\nthey do transcend--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4680.73,4681.96"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1786","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\nThey share same problems--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4681.96,4683.22"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1787","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: They transcend\nthe fact that they're lovers.\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Yeah.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4683.22,4685.23"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1788","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: They become love.\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\nYeah, which is absolute--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4685.23,4687.06"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1789","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS:\nWhich is the place, again.\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Ultimate love.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4687.06,4689.59"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1790","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: Yeah.\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Yeah.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4689.59,4691.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1791","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: There are moments\nin the ordinary love affairs","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4691.0,4692.76"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1792","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that are the same thing.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4692.76,4693.97"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1793","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: That helps,\nthat now we have sort out.\n[Laughs]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4693.97,4696.97"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1794","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: Yeah.\nThat's why Krishna and the gopis","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4696.97,4699.13"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1795","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"are that example, of the\nrelation to Radha, to Krishna.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4699.13,4702.14"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1796","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Yeah.\nRight, yeah.\n[Laughter]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4702.14,4709.68"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1797","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Well, since we worked out\nthe [laughing]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4709.68,4712.99"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1798","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"idea of bhakti, [laughs]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4712.99,4716.3"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1799","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"maybe that helps us to plow\nthrough","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4716.3,4718.395"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1800","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"what we're trying to achieve.\n[Panel laughs]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4718.395,4722.54"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1801","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"DUNCAN CAMPBELL:\nWell there's one question","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4722.54,4723.84"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1802","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"before we open it up\nto the general audience","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4723.84,4726.66"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1803","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that I'd to ask.\nIn that in my own experience,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4726.66,4730.46"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1804","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"let's say going back\nto psychedelics,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4730.46,4733.35"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1805","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"there was--\nyou started out from a state","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4733.35,4736.21"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1806","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"of being sort of confused\nand neurotic,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4736.21,4738.17"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1807","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and you took acid or you\ntook mescaline or whatever,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4738.17,4741.11"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1808","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and you had a certain, what felt\nlike a kind of insight,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4741.11,4743.65"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1809","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"you got high. And the world\nseemed open and beautiful.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4743.65,4748.97"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1810","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"But then you came down.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4748.97,4750.68"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1811","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And what I have found\nin my own experience,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4750.68,4752.88"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1812","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"with practices like mantra\nfor instance,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4752.88,4755.43"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1813","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"devotional practices,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4755.43,4757.17"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1814","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"is that you can in fact change\nyour state of consciousness,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4757.17,4760.68"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1815","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"through a devotional\npractice of mantra.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4760.68,4763.98"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1816","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"But it feels to me\nvery much like reproducing","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4763.98,4767.43"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1817","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"the same kind\nof high-low situation,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4767.43,4771.1"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1818","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"as with psychedelics.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4771.1,4772.37"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1819","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Like you get high after chanting\na mantra for three hours,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4772.37,4775.15"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1820","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"but then somehow,\nyou're still left","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4775.15,4777.89"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1821","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"with how do I come back\nto the mundane, physical world?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4777.89,4781.91"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1822","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And I'd just to present\nthat as a question,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4781.91,4784.59"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1823","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"in terms of bhakti.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4784.59,4787.49"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1824","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"As a model,\nas a workable problem.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4789.99,4791.6"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1825","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS:\nYeah, it isn't really--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4791.6,4793.68"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1826","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Duncan, it isn't\nreally that simple,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4793.68,4795.26"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1827","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"because while you came down\nfrom psychedelics,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4795.26,4799.32"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1828","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"you didn't come down to exactly\nthe same place you started from.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4799.32,4802.08"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1829","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"DUNCAN CAMPBELL:\nOh, of course not.\nSure, I agree with that.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4802.08,4805.693"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1830","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS:\nUh...\n[Laughter]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4817.928,4820.661"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1831","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"You know, I think that almost--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4820.661,4822.53"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1832","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"most practices\nhave the entrapment","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4822.53,4824.59"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1833","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"in them of the experience\nconnected with the practice.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4824.59,4827.42"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1834","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And that that isn't ultimately\nwhat the thing is,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4827.42,4830.92"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1835","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"it's just a concomitant\nof it if you will.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4830.92,4834.99"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1836","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And I don't see that any--\nthe either--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4834.99,4839.09"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1837","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that any practices don't have\nthat in them actually.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4839.09,4843.49"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1838","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And...","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4843.49,4845.79"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1839","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"there is a what I call\na \"cheap high\" quality","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4850.78,4853.31"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1840","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"about a lot of\ndevotional practices.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4853.31,4856.53"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1841","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"But at the same moment","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4856.53,4857.84"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1842","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"there are transformations\nthat are going on.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4857.84,4859.68"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1843","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And it's really the readiness\nof the individual as to--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4859.68,4862.13"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1844","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"like we sing every night\nin the class,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4862.13,4864.44"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1845","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and if you look out people\nare doing kirtan","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4864.44,4867.43"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1846","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"at many different levels:\nsome people are singing,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4867.43,4869.65"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1847","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and some people\nare involved in kirtan,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4869.65,4871.49"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1848","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"they are really involved\nin the repetition","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4871.49,4873.34"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1849","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"of the name of God\nin a much more profound way.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4873.34,4875.78"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1850","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And there is a transformation\ngoing on in their being.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4875.78,4877.9"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1851","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And as far as I'm concerned","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4877.9,4879.1"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1852","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that's as legitimate\na practice as meditation.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4879.1,4882.43"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1853","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"No more entrapping into highs\nthan meditational practices are.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4882.43,4886.33"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1854","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\nWell we have a problem there,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4886.33,4888.1"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1855","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"is seem to be is\ngetting back to tradition.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4888.1,4892.32"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1856","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"That those words\nare made by somebody,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4892.32,4896.58"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1857","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and we are handing over\nto students.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4896.58,4901.45"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1858","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And we should really clarify\nour greater audience that we --","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4901.45,4905.54"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1859","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"more than this people here --","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4905.54,4907.56"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1860","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that we should really tell them\nwhat is all about.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4907.56,4911.32"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1861","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And we've been jumping\nback and forth,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4911.32,4914.42"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1862","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"this particular discussion is,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4914.42,4916.53"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1863","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that tradition, lineage,\nand freedom,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4916.53,4920.87"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1864","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"at the same time getting back\nto some kind of the habits","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4920.87,4926.01"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1865","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that developed\nby our forefathers.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4926.01,4929.73"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1866","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And we have that\nkind of problem there.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4929.73,4932.64"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1867","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So I wish you could say\nsomething more,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4932.64,4937.13"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1868","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"so that our audience --","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4937.13,4939.66"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1869","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"in the greater audience --\ncould relate with this.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4939.66,4943.49"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1870","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And so they may\nbe able to chant,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4943.49,4946.36"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1871","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"may be able to sit\nin meditation,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4946.36,4948.82"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1872","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"so we could help them\nin some sense.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4948.82,4953.3"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1873","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Which is very necessary.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4953.3,4954.98"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1874","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: You want me\nto legitimize\n[laughing] tradition?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4954.98,4957.59"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1875","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: No--\nRAM DASS: Don't get me started.\n[Laughs]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4957.59,4960.3"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1876","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\n--techniques or whatever. Well--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4960.3,4965.7"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1877","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: Yeah, I hear the point\nyou're making--\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Yeah.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4965.7,4968.36"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1878","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: And it--\nI think that we're,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4968.36,4969.86"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1879","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"for the sake of discussion\nwe get into issues of--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4969.86,4974.4"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1880","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"we debate about tradition\nin order to make it clarified,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4974.4,4977.82"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1881","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"but it is certainly true\nthat what--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4977.82,4981.62"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1882","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"the way in which we break\nout of one tradition","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4981.62,4984.77"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1883","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"is by juxtaposing it\nwith another tradition,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4984.77,4988.17"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1884","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"or confronting traditions.\nAnd that's part of what coming","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4988.17,4994.67"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1885","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"out of the Western\npsychology tradition","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4994.67,4996.69"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1886","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and going into Hinduism\nas a tradition,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4996.69,4999.21"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1887","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and chanting Krishna's name,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=4999.21,5001.39"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1888","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"definitely changes my perception\nof psychology in that sense.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5001.39,5005.32"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1889","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And what\nthe spiritual tradition\nin America is doing","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5005.32,5009.29"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1890","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"is reinvesting a lot of our\nWestern traditions with spirit--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5009.29,5012.05"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1891","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Quite simply,\nthat chanting mantras,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5012.05,5019.47"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1892","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"what does it do to you?\nAnd what happens?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5019.47,5022.97"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1893","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"You know, a very\nsimple-minded approach.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5022.97,5025.42"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1894","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"That maybe I'm taking\non Duncan's role, somewhat.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5025.42,5028.71"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1895","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"DUNCAN CAMPBELL:\nThe simple-minded approach.\n[Laughter]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5028.71,5031.185"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1896","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: [Laughing]\nIt's preemptive\nsimple-mindedness.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5031.185,5034.92"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1897","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\nWell we have to tell the world,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5034.92,5036.51"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1898","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that it's sacredness as well\nas it's misunderstandings","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5036.51,5042.59"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1899","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that happens, you know.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5042.59,5043.88"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1900","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS:\nBut the sacred--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5043.88,5045.11"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1901","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"you don't have to tell people\nthat it ought to be sacred.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5045.11,5047.5"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1902","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"That the sacredness--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5047.5,5048.87"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1903","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that's why there aren't\nthe secrets in a way--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5048.87,5051.29"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1904","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"people can profane something,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5051.29,5053.59"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1905","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"but then when they begin\nto appreciate","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5053.59,5055.97"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1906","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"what it's about\nthen they invest the reverence.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5055.97,5058.59"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1907","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"You don't tell people\nthey ought to invest reverence.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5058.59,5060.99"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1908","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I mean I feel this stuff\nis available,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5060.99,5065.36"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1909","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and as people\nget more sophisticated,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5065.36,5067.77"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1910","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"they honor it more.\nLike I've come to your lectures","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5067.77,5071.95"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1911","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"where your students sit with\ntheir feet facing you and up.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5071.95,5076.03"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1912","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Now I know that out\nof the tradition","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5076.03,5077.53"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1913","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I come out of in the East","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5077.53,5078.76"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1914","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that would be an affront\nto a teacher.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5078.76,5080.88"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1915","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And to them that isn't that,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5080.88,5083.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1916","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and they don't know,\nthey don't understand,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5083.0,5084.64"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1917","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and they don't reverence the\nrole of the teacher properly.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5084.64,5087.44"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1918","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I stand up when you walk in.\nHe is one of your students,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5087.44,5091.4"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1919","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"he doesn't stand up\nwhen you walk in.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5091.4,5092.79"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1920","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Now that's a difference\nin tradition, all right.\n[Panel laughs]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5092.79,5095.68"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1921","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I think-- I'm not saying\nthat I'm-- it's right or wrong,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5095.68,5099.32"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1922","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I'm merely saying\nthat these things come out","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5099.32,5101.55"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1923","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"of a certain\nkind of understanding","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5101.55,5103.41"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1924","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and a certain kind of feeling.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5103.41,5104.89"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1925","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Not out of \"oughts\"\nor \"shoulds\" or you know...","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5104.89,5107.36"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1926","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\nWell I think we are--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5107.36,5108.6"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1927","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"it seems like that we are\nback to the Buddhist bag,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5108.6,5110.95"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1928","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"at that point.\nThat experiential--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5110.95,5118.89"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1929","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"which makes a very\nawkward moment here.\n[Laughs]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5121.13,5123.94"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1930","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: Makes you what?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5123.94,5125.18"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1931","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\nAwkward moment here,\nsomehow. That we are--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5125.18,5127.255"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1932","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: I don't think--\nthe Buddhists preempt that,\nI mean that's...","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5127.255,5130.13"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1933","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\nWell, it's Naropa Institute's--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5130.13,5133.71"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1934","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: [Laughs]\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Which is--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5133.71,5136.56"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1935","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"DUNCAN CAMPBELL: One thing that\nI'm curious about,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5136.56,5138.06"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1936","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"is like what role for instance\nis there for negativity,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5138.06,5142.82"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1937","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"let's say, in bhakti practice?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5142.82,5145.23"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1938","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"How does one deal\nwith one's own negativity,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5145.23,5147.54"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1939","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"anger and irritation\nand so on and so forth,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5147.54,5151.04"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1940","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"in terms of that system?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5151.04,5154.93"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1941","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: My guru said to me,\n\"Ram Dass, give up anger.\"","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5154.93,5158.37"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1942","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And I said to him, \"Can I even\nuse it as a teaching device?\"","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5158.37,5161.96"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1943","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And he said\n[shouting] \"Nay!\" [Laughter]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5161.96,5167.43"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1944","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"There's the whole story.\n[Laughter]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5167.43,5169.95"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1945","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"DUNCAN CAMPBELL: What do we find\nin the Buddhist tradition","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5169.95,5171.55"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1946","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"as far as\nthat's concerned?\n[Laughter; applause]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5171.55,5185.77"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1947","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"JOHN BAKER: Well.\n[Laughter]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5185.77,5190.6"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1948","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"It's funny, I was listening\nto you describe bhakti practice","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5190.6,5193.47"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1949","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and thinking about my own,\nand thinking, \"Jesus, [laughing]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5193.47,5195.96"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1950","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I've really got\nthe wrong end of\nthe stick.\" [Laughs; laughter]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5195.96,5202.03"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1951","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: It's not too late\nto change, John.\n[Laughter]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5202.03,5209.89"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1952","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"DUNCAN CAMPBELL:\nBut the ironic thing Ram Dass,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5209.89,5211.4"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1953","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"is that *you're* the one\non the panel","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5211.4,5212.95"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1954","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"who's always talking\nabout the necessity","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5212.95,5214.64"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1955","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"of giving into despair,\nand entrapment","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5214.64,5217.18"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1956","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and really feeling\nyour own suffering.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5217.18,5219.24"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1957","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: I'm such a romantic.\n[Laughter]\nDUNCAN CAMPBELL: Uh, well.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5219.24,5222.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1958","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS:\nIt's just a big ego trap,\nyou know, it's not--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5222.0,5224.49"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1959","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"JOHN BAKER: No, but I mean\nthat's a very real question.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5224.49,5226.05"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1960","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"You know, like to really\nfeel your own despair","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5226.05,5228.29"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1961","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and your own negativity\nand your own neurosis","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5228.29,5230.33"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1962","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and somehow accept it\nas the manure","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5230.33,5233.98"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1963","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and also build\nthe field of bodhi.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5233.98,5235.6"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1964","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"You know, and there does seem","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5235.6,5237.01"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1965","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"sometimes to be\nthis kind of deceptive--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5237.01,5239.51"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1966","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: Devotional practices\naren't all positive","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5239.51,5241.73"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1967","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and loving and beautiful.\nThere is a trem--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5241.73,5243.86"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1968","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"if you read the poets,\nRumi and Kabir,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5243.86,5246.8"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1969","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"there's a tremendous --\nTulsidas --","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5246.8,5248.77"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1970","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"there's a tremendous amount\nof anguish at the separation,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5248.77,5253.24"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1971","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and the feeling of poverty\nif you will, you know,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5253.24,5258.02"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1972","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and that's part of\nthe devotional quality","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5258.02,5260.49"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1973","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"of the sadhana too.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5260.49,5261.79"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1974","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"JOHN BAKER: I think you know\nwhat we're getting at is just--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5261.79,5264.25"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1975","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"it's the way in which\nyou come at the practice.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5264.25,5268.27"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1976","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"When you sit in meditation,\nBuddhist style,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5268.93,5271.73"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1977","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and if you have some model\nin your head","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5271.73,5273.53"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1978","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"of what it is\nyou want to have,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5273.53,5276.12"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1979","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"what you want to experience\nin your practice,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5276.12,5277.88"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1980","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"it's a real drag.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5277.88,5279.45"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1981","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I mean you know you'll hear\nthat one a hundred times,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5279.45,5281.57"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1982","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"a thousand times,\nten thousand times,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5281.57,5283.65"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1983","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and then you move\nonto another thing.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5283.65,5285.64"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1984","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I think it's the same thing in--\nit-- I--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5285.64,5289.72"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1985","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"it *has* to be the same thing\nin devotional practice;","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5289.72,5292.25"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1986","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"you know I've done kirtan\nand all that.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5292.25,5294.2"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1987","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"If you have a model of how you\nwant to be as you do kirtan --","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5294.2,5296.54"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1988","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"if you want to be loving, high,\nblissful, in touch with God --","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5296.54,5299.94"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1989","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"it's going to, eventually,\nif you do it long enough,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5299.94,5301.63"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1990","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"just be a solid drag.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5301.63,5303.89"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1991","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I think the only thing that what\nwe're talking about here is,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5303.89,5307.53"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1992","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"it's the way that you come\nto the practice,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5307.53,5308.96"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1993","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"the sense of realism,\nthe willingness","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5308.96,5311.69"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1994","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"to be what you are\nas you do your practicing with--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5311.69,5314.02"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1995","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: If you come to it\nwith any stance at all--\nJOHN BAKER: Right.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5314.02,5316.58"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1996","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: --it's going to turn\nout to be a drag.\nJOHN BAKER: Right.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5316.58,5319.04"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1997","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: And then you're going\nto have to give that stance up.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5319.04,5320.71"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1998","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Like when we do\nan all night chant,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5320.71,5322.69"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/1999","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"the first couple of hours you're\nchanting for one motivation,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5322.69,5325.77"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2000","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"then you get bored with that\nand you say \"ah screw it\"","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5325.77,5328.3"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2001","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and you start to chant\nfor another reason.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5328.3,5329.77"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2002","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And the whole thing keeps\nopening and opening","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5329.77,5331.69"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2003","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and opening and opening\nor closing and closing,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5331.69,5333.32"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2004","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"depending on where--\nwhat stage you're at.\nJOHN BAKER: Right.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5333.32,5336.03"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2005","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: There isn't a model\nbut there is change.\nJOHN BAKER: Right. [Laughs]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5336.03,5341.44"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2006","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"DUNCAN CAMPBELL:\nWell actually for a change,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5341.44,5342.81"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2007","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I think this might be\nan ideal time","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5342.81,5345.34"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2008","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"to open up the discussion\nto questions","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5345.34,5347.79"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2009","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"from the general audience.\nWe have microphones","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5347.79,5353.51"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2010","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and if anybody would like\nto ask a question,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5353.51,5355.5"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2011","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"if they could simply\nraise their hand.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5355.5,5359.02"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2012","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Hopefully that\nquestions could be precise,\nbecause you are--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5365.51,5371.41"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2013","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"we are dealing with a larger\naudience at this point,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5371.41,5377.77"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2014","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and that there is experience\nof what you have experienced","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5377.77,5383.11"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2015","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"could be shared\nwith the rest of people.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5383.11,5384.66"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2016","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So if you can be precise\nas much as you can,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5384.66,5388.02"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2017","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that would be\ngreatly appreciated.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5388.02,5391.91"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2018","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"On behalf of United States\nof America.\n[Laughter]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5391.91,5402.71"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2019","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"DUNCAN CAMPBELL:\nYeah, where are the microphones?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5402.71,5406.02"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2020","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Oh.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5408.16,5410.175"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2021","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"[Laughter] No.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5413.26,5418.36"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2022","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER2: It was raining outside\nwith a totally clear sky,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5421.16,5424.64"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2023","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"the sun was out --\nthat's grace.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5424.64,5428.09"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2024","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Bhakti is appreciating\nand understanding that --","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5428.09,5431.63"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2025","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that's bhakti.\nI wondered if you could discuss","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5431.63,5436.97"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2026","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"how psychology\nis a religious framework,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5436.97,5439.45"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2027","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"in the same way as Buddhism\nis a religious framework.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5439.45,5443.66"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2028","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"They're both created\nby the human mind,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5443.66,5446.06"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2029","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"they don't come out\nof the cloudless sky.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5446.06,5449.34"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2030","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And because of that,\nthe role playing,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5449.34,5451.96"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2031","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"the reflection on the ego,\ncomes out of that.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5451.96,5455.03"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2032","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Could you talk about\nwhat's beyond that,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5455.03,5458.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2033","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"the cloudless sky, beyond that?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5458.0,5461.93"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2034","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"DUNCAN CAMPBELL: Would you like\nany one particular member","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5466.42,5468.01"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2035","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"of the panel\nto address themselves to that?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5468.01,5470.34"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2036","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER2: [INAUDIBLE WORDS]\n[Laughter]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5470.34,5483.39"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2037","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS:\nYou're the cloudless sky person.\n[Laughs; laughter]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5483.39,5490.281"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2038","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: [Laughs]\nI wish I had my John Baker\naround,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5503.418,5506.232"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2039","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"so I'd \"John\".\n[Laughs; laughter]\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: He's yours.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5506.278,5512.41"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2040","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: He's mine. [Laughs]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5512.41,5513.37"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2041","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"John! [Laughs]\nHe just gave you to me.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5513.37,5516.65"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2042","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"John, answer that.\n[Laughter; applause]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5516.65,5526.69"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2043","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"JOHN BAKER: I mean what can you\nsay about a cloudless sky,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5526.69,5530.22"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2044","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"except that it doesn't\nhave any clouds?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5530.22,5533.59"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2045","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I don't think\nany of the traditions","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5536.07,5541.16"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2046","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"try and describe the--\nwhat you get after,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5541.16,5546.96"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2047","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"at the very end\nof the end of the end.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5546.96,5548.99"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2048","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"They always describe it\nin terms of negatives.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5548.99,5552.64"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2049","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"The absence of neurosis.\nWell that's not fair either.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5553.38,5559.64"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2050","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"The tongue stops.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5568.63,5571.42"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2051","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I think the only difference\nbetween psychology as a religion","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5573.02,5577.56"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2052","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and say\nBuddhism as a religion,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5577.56,5580.34"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2053","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"is in the lack of model that\nBuddhism offers for the goal.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5580.34,5586.3"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2054","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"With the feeling being that\nany model is another entrapment.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5586.3,5589.91"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2055","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So that the closest\nyou get to it in the tantras","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5589.91,5592.03"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2056","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"is a kind of\npoetic evocation of--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5592.03,5596.61"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2057","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"if you could even say that.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5596.61,5599.58"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2058","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Whereas I think\nthat Western psychology","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5601.56,5603.75"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2059","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"in my understanding of it,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5603.75,5605.28"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2060","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"*is* offering\nsome kind of a model,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5605.28,5607.95"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2061","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"however vague,\nof what the goal is.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5607.95,5612.15"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2062","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Both of them obviously\nare trying to work","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5612.15,5613.76"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2063","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"with the problem\nof human suffering,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5613.76,5615.81"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2064","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and I think to that sense\nthey're both spiritual.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5615.81,5620.12"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2065","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS:\nAll institutions have roles,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5621.5,5624.56"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2066","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"rituals, rules,\nlanguage, structure.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5624.56,5628.64"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2067","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"The difference between\nparticipants in institutions","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5628.64,5631.45"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2068","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"is the degree of attachment\nthey have to the roles","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5631.45,5633.85"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2069","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"they're participating in.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5633.85,5635.74"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2070","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And the quality of a living\nBuddhist tradition","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5635.74,5638.72"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2071","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"would be that everybody is\nplaying their role perfectly,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5638.72,5641.49"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2072","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"but there's nobody home,\nwould be one way of saying it.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5641.49,5645.08"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2073","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And most of the methods\nwe have are within traditions,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5645.08,5653.16"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2074","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"in order to get not\nfree in sense","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5653.16,5655.85"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2075","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"of rejecting the tradition,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5655.85,5657.65"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2076","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"but not attached, at the\nsame moment fulfilling it,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5657.65,5662.88"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2077","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"because the tradition\nis functional","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5662.88,5664.42"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2078","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"in the transmission\nof the dharma.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5664.42,5668.39"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2079","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"JOHN BAKER:\nBut wouldn't you also say,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5668.39,5670.34"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2080","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that the only way that you can\nbe fulfilling your role","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5670.34,5674.74"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2081","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"perfectly with nobody home,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5674.74,5676.52"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2082","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"is to total commitment\nto the role?\nRAM DASS: Yes.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5676.52,5679.41"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2083","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"JOHN BAKER: You can't be\nsplitting yourself--\nRAM DASS: Total involvement.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5679.41,5681.84"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2084","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"JOHN BAKER: --and saying,\n\"I'm detached. I'm uninvolved.\"","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5681.84,5683.04"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2085","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: No you can't.\nIf you're saying\n\"I'm detached\" you're not;","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5683.04,5684.8"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2086","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that's a different\nkind of a thing.\nJOHN BAKER: Okay.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5684.8,5687.25"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2087","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: It's total involvement\nand no attachment.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5687.25,5689.89"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2088","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"But it's not this\nself-conscious non-attach--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5689.89,5692.08"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2089","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\"I'm not attached\";\nthat's an attachment.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5692.08,5693.9"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2090","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"JOHN BAKER: Right. I mean I'm--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5693.9,5695.29"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2091","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"DUNCAN CAMPBELL:\nWait, hear what he's saying.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5695.29,5696.57"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2092","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"JOHN BAKER: I'm just concerned\nwith what we're telling people,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5696.57,5698.41"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2093","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that if you tell people that\nthey're supposed to walk around","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5698.41,5700.77"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2094","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and feel detached\nfrom what they are,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5700.77,5703.17"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2095","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that that's very different\nthan telling people","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5703.17,5704.94"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2096","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"to *be* what they are.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5704.94,5706.18"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2097","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: No. Yeah.\nBut it's-- well, yeah.\nThat was a curve.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5706.18,5713.98"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2098","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Why don't we\ngive up the whole thing?\nRAM DASS: Huh?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5713.98,5716.72"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2099","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Why don't\nwe give up the whole discussion.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5716.72,5718.13"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2100","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"DUNCAN CAMPBELL:\nOkay, take another question.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5718.13,5719.35"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2101","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\nAs far as regard the sun\nand the moon","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5719.35,5722.615"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2102","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and the rain is concerned,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5722.615,5724.13"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2103","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that now rain is died\nand beyond that is sunshine","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5724.13,5728.94"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2104","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and then tonight\nthere will be sunset.\n[Laughter; applause]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5728.94,5740.16"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2105","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER3:\nI'd like to address this","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5740.16,5741.39"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2106","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"to Ram Dass and Rinpoche.\nI came to Naropa","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5741.39,5745.84"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2107","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"after finishing a master's\ndegree in counselling.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5745.84,5749.81"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2108","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And I found myself\nbehind that desk","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5749.81,5753.72"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2109","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"towards the end of my internship\nreally freaking out.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5753.72,5756.55"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2110","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Like these people are as--\nI'm as flipped out as they are,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5756.55,5762.75"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2111","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and I-- sometimes I felt like\nI couldn't offer them anything.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5762.75,5767.45"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2112","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And if anything I did offer","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5767.45,5769.49"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2113","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"was just was like my own opinion\nof my own trip, like you know,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5769.49,5774.97"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2114","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\"Why don't you try sitting,\"\nor \"Why don't you do this.\"","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5774.97,5777.34"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2115","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I didn't know, so I wound up\ncoming to Naropa,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5777.34,5780.07"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2116","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"leaving that desk,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5780.07,5781.64"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2117","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"in hopes of trying\nto find a model or a framework","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5781.64,5785.23"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2118","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"in which I could somehow\nclear my head a little bit,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5785.23,5788.72"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2119","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"so I could hear more\nwhat the person was saying,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5788.72,5791.23"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2120","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"what they needed,\nand what I--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5791.23,5792.63"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2121","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and then I would be more open\nto give them something,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5792.63,5795.74"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2122","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"not from me, but more\njust of what they needed.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5795.74,5799.26"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2123","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And I don't think\nthat was chickening out.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5799.26,5802.38"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2124","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"But I got the feeling, Rinpoche,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5802.38,5805.22"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2125","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that when you were talking\nto Ram Dass","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5805.22,5807.3"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2126","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"in a way\nthat was chickening out.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5807.3,5810.24"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2127","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And so if you two guys\ncould resolve that question I--\n[laughter]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5810.24,5814.97"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2128","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I'd appreciate it.\n[Laughter]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5814.97,5817.322"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2129","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS:\nIt's your question finally.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5817.322,5820.499"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2130","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\nDo you want to do it?\n[Laughter]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5820.499,5829.04"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2131","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I would like to throw it back,\nthe question, at you.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5829.04,5841.36"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2132","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"What do you mean\nby \"chickening out\"?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5841.36,5844.95"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2133","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER3:\nChickening out in the sense of--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5846.82,5850.21"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2134","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"well the way\nI felt it coming was,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5852.0,5855.16"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2135","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"because I left the desk\nbecause I came here","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5855.16,5858.86"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2136","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and left the people\nthat supposedly were in need,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5858.86,5862.8"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2137","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that that was a--\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\nSupposedly what?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5862.8,5865.41"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2138","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER3:\nThey were need of some help.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5865.41,5866.91"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2139","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"That I was copping out on my\nresponsibility as a counselor.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5866.91,5870.6"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2140","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"But I got to the point\nwhere I thought, \"Fuck!","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5870.6,5872.74"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2141","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I don't know what\nI'm doing in this place.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5872.74,5875.09"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2142","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I don't know why\nI'm helping these people.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5875.09,5876.73"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2143","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I don't even know\nwho I am!\"","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5876.73,5878.74"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2144","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And it just became absurd\nand I came here.\n[Laughs; laughter; applause]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5878.74,5892.25"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2145","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\nWelcome to Naropa Institute.\n[Laughter; applause]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5892.25,5896.99"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2146","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I'm glad you're with us.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5896.99,5899.5"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2147","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS:\nThe theater of the absurd.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5899.5,5902.52"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2148","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"You're not feeding any more\nto that question from that?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5912.43,5916.64"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2149","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Do you want\nto say some few words?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5916.64,5918.81"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2150","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: [Laughs]\nI feel like we're walking away","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5918.81,5921.44"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2151","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"from the desk if we don't.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5921.44,5923.21"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2152","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\nOkay, well go ahead.\n[Laughter; applause]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5923.21,5934.04"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2153","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS:\nIn--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5934.04,5936.38"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2154","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"there is a style of sadhana\nwhich is very much a tradition,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5940.84,5949.34"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2155","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"which could be called\n\"the spiral\",","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5949.34,5952.57"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2156","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"in which you move\ninto the marketplace,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5952.57,5955.76"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2157","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"until you realize the finiteness\nof your predicament,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5955.76,5958.49"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2158","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"or the level at which\nyou're not doing karma yoga,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5958.49,5960.98"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2159","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"or however you want\nto say it,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5960.98,5962.74"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2160","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"or the way in which\nyou are perpetuating suffering.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5962.74,5965.53"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2161","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And with that kind of wisdom\nyou may go back into the cave,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5965.53,5969.28"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2162","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"or to Naropa Institute,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5969.28,5970.81"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2163","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"or into another setting\nwhich gives you a new perception","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5970.81,5975.24"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2164","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"which brings you back\nin a new level,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5975.24,5976.89"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2165","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"which takes you back and forth\naround and around, in and out.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5976.89,5980.8"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2166","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And that process which seems\nsequential at first,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5980.8,5985.86"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2167","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and later becomes more\nand more synchronous,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5985.86,5988.92"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2168","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that process is all part of the\nrelieving of human suffering,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5988.92,5996.69"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2169","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"so that it's in a way,\nit's too narrow a view.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=5996.69,6001.22"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2170","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I mean I feel that the--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6001.22,6002.46"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2171","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I could answer very clearly\nwhen Rinpoche said,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6002.46,6005.17"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2172","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\"Should I have left my desk?\"","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6005.17,6006.55"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2173","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Yeah, damn right\nI should have left the desk,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6006.55,6008.19"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2174","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and it's okay to come\nback to the desk,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6008.19,6009.57"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2175","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and it's okay\nto leave the desk.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6009.57,6011.31"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2176","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And it's okay to trust my heart\nas to what I need,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6011.31,6013.75"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2177","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"whether I need to come to Naropa\nor stay at the desk,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6013.75,6016.42"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2178","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"because that's the way\nthe guru is guiding me,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6016.42,6019.32"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2179","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"so that ultimately I can be\na statement of the dharma","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6019.32,6022.54"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2180","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"for all beings.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6022.54,6024.47"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2181","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Is that dealing\nwith your question?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6024.47,6026.86"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2182","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\nWelcome to Naropa.\n[Laughter]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6026.86,6039.35"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2183","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER4: I'd like to address\nthis question to Rinpoche.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6039.35,6042.16"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2184","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Do you think that the practice\nof bhakti, devotional practice,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6042.16,6047.24"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2185","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"is one that can\nbring people in harmony","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6047.24,6050.5"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2186","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"with the teachings\nof the Buddha?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6050.5,6053.76"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2187","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\nThat's a discussion","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6055.19,6058.45"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2188","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that involves\nwith the approach of Buddha.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6058.45,6071.97"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2189","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I think basically that\nwe could say quite safely that","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6074.52,6080.16"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2190","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"since Buddhism is\na non-theistic tradition,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6080.16,6084.22"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2191","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that it is not possible.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6084.22,6087.37"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2192","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"When you trust somebody\nyou have a ground to trust it.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6087.37,6091.18"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2193","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Either that person came from\nthe lineage of distrustfulness,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6091.18,6095.56"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2194","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"therefore you can trust\nin somebody.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6095.56,6097.97"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2195","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Or else that the lineage\ncome from that ground,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6097.97,6101.84"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2196","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that person is being trusting\nall along all the time,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6101.84,6105.83"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2197","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"which according to Buddhism\nit's called \"frivolous\";","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6105.83,6110.6"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2198","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"one of the part\nof the fourth skandhas,\n[laughs]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6110.6,6117.475"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2199","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"categories actually,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6117.475,6119.28"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2200","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"according to\nthe techniques and traditions.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6119.28,6121.91"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2201","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"According to Buddhism, that you\ndon't even worship Buddha,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6121.91,6125.86"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2202","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"which a lot of people\nmisunderstand.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6125.86,6128.32"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2203","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"That we regard Buddha\nas example, the Enlightened One,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6128.32,6134.01"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2204","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"somebody who had achieved\nenlightenment in one lifetime.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6134.01,6138.62"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2205","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So I think the question\nof devotion","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6140.47,6144.55"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2206","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that exist in the tantric\nBuddhist tradition,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6144.55,6147.38"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2207","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"but it is a different\nkind of devotion","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6147.38,6149.48"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2208","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"rather than just purely trusting\nor expanding oneself","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6149.48,6157.01"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2209","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"to the level that you can\ncomplete dissolve yourself;","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6157.01,6160.68"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2210","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"everything's done for you,\nparticularly.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6160.68,6164.23"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2211","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"But we are talking about\nvery pragmatic development:","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6164.23,6167.04"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2212","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that if you want to trust you\ngot to be a son of your father,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6167.04,6173.2"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2213","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and you got to suck\nthe nipples of your mother,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6173.2,6177.45"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2214","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and you have to wear diapers,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6177.45,6180.47"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2215","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and you have to eat\nbaby food [laughs],","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6180.47,6183.24"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2216","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"you grow up,\nand you go to colleges.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6183.24,6186.16"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2217","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Then you graduate\nfrom your college,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6186.16,6189.67"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2218","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"you become proud person\nof son of your father.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6189.67,6195.47"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2219","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"It's something like that.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6195.47,6197.42"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2220","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"That's why Buddhism\nis referred as humanistic,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6197.42,6201.29"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2221","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that as we as Buddhists\nwe don't believe anything,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6201.29,6205.57"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2222","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"except what is happening\non the spot.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6205.57,6209.56"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2223","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So we could borrow\nthe traditional phrase","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6209.56,6212.93"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2224","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"by saying that","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6212.93,6214.33"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2225","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\"actions speaks loud\nthan word.\" [Applause]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6214.33,6225.17"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2226","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"DUNCAN CAMPBELL:\nWell there does seem to be","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6225.17,6226.51"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2227","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"a certain irony\nin the sense","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6226.51,6228.58"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2228","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that the Kagyu tradition\nin Tibetan Buddhism","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6228.58,6232.26"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2229","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"is known as the lineage\nof devotion.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6232.26,6234.76"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2230","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And what we're not\ntalking about it","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6234.76,6237.16"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2231","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"would seem a very polarized\nkind of distinction","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6237.16,6241.43"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2232","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"between intellect and heart,\nbut really trying to arrive","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6241.43,6244.72"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2233","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"at a proper understanding\nof devotion itself,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6244.72,6248.58"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2234","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and that there really\nis no polarity.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6248.58,6252.18"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2235","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: According to\nthe Kagyu tradition,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6252.18,6253.77"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2236","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"devotion is based on that\nof desolateness of your ego,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6253.77,6259.98"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2237","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"which invites enormous sense\nof a romantic notion","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6259.98,6263.8"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2238","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that you can make\nto your guru, your teacher.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6263.8,6269.1"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2239","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"That because of sense\neverything is *so* desolate,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6269.1,6273.94"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2240","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that there's nothing\nto hang on to.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6273.94,6276.71"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2241","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And the guru provide\nthat kind of mechanism already,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6276.71,6279.69"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2242","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"therefore you can make\nlove to your guru,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6279.69,6283.19"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2243","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and fall in love to him,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6283.19,6284.5"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2244","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and whatever he does,\nwhatever he said,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6284.5,6287.05"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2245","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"becomes very powerful message\nfor you.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6287.05,6290.02"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2246","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And that is a part\nof the devotional thing.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6290.02,6292.06"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2247","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Rather than devotion from sake","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6292.06,6294.14"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2248","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"of theistic traditions\nparticularly.\n[Laughter]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6294.14,6300.39"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2249","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"DUNCAN CAMPBELL:\nDo you want to add anything\nto that Ram Dass,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6300.39,6302.89"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2250","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"before we take\nthe next question?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6302.89,6304.78"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2251","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: He's doing fine\nuntil the last throwaway line,\nyou know.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6304.78,6309.45"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2252","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Because I think that's--\nthat out of the desolation comes\nthis making love to the guru,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6309.45,6315.42"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2253","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"or making love\nto the inner guru or God,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6315.42,6318.19"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2254","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"until the merging occurs\nin which case","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6318.19,6320.29"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2255","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"the whole thing\nbecomes irrelevant really.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6320.29,6323.66"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2256","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\nWell we're not talking about God\nat this point actually.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6323.66,6326.24"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2257","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS:\nWell god, guru, and self--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6326.24,6327.475"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2258","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\nBut we are talking about guru--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6327.475,6328.71"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2259","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: --are the same thing\nfrom where I'm standing.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6328.71,6330.17"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2260","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\nWell guru is very real,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6330.17,6332.39"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2261","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and God might be there\nsomewhere --","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6332.39,6336.61"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2262","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I don't know where.\nYou [INAUDIBLE]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6336.61,6338.89"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2263","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: You don't do\nany devotional practices","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6338.89,6340.69"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2264","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"with visualizations of--\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\nWell those act--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6340.69,6343.28"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2265","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: --buddhas of other\nperiods and so on?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6343.28,6345.48"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2266","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Yeah.\nRAM DASS: They're real.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6345.48,6346.87"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2267","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Expressions of\nyourself, you know.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6346.87,6348.66"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2268","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: Sure. Well so is\nthe guru and so is God.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6348.66,6351.64"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2269","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\nWell I think there is","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6351.64,6352.87"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2270","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"a very problematic situation,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6352.87,6354.71"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2271","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that I'm sure the true\ntheologians will disagree.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6354.71,6359.37"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2272","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: [Laughs]\nIf I meet one I'll ask him.\n[Laughs; laughter]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6359.37,6363.75"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2273","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Yeah.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6363.75,6365.15"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2274","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"DUNCAN CAMPBELL:\nIs there a true theologian","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6365.15,6366.48"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2275","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"in the audience\nto ask the next question?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6366.48,6370.3"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2276","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"JOHN BAKER: Uh...\nDUNCAN CAMPBELL: Go ahead.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6370.3,6375.21"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2277","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"JOHN BAKER:\nI think, you know,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6375.21,6376.53"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2278","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"we could be familiar\nwith the feeling of desolation","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6376.53,6380.59"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2279","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that breeds a great longing.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6380.59,6383.13"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2280","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And so that you can long for\nrelease from your desolation.\n[Laughs]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6383.13,6387.7"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2281","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Well...\nJOHN BAKER: [Laughs]\nIs this the kind--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6387.7,6389.925"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2282","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and then\nthat kind of longing","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6389.925,6392.09"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2283","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"can be kind of translated\ninto a longing for God,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6392.09,6396.35"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2284","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"or a longing for the guru or\na longing for whatever, yidam.\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Well--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6396.35,6401.48"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2285","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"JOHN BAKER: I mean that could\nbe taken as devotion.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6401.48,6403.67"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2286","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I-- if there's a difference\nbetween that","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6403.67,6405.57"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2287","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and what\nyou're speaking of,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6405.57,6407.08"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2288","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"the love affair\ncoming out of desolation,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6407.08,6410.29"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2289","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"could you make that clear?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6410.29,6411.53"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2290","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Well, the guru\nis a person you know already,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6411.53,6414.42"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2291","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"you talk to him,\nand on the earthly body.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6414.42,6418.15"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2292","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"That if you have somebody else,\nyou know,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6418.15,6422.47"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2293","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"herukas, dakinis, Jehovah,\nwhoever you have,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6422.47,6427.34"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2294","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"but those are purely expressions\nof a human vision","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6427.34,6434.2"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2295","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that is far gone,\nbeyond personal relationships.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6434.2,6439.6"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2296","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"That is why the traditional\ntantric point of view","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6439.6,6442.78"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2297","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"is that you don't prostrate\nto your herukas as gurus,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6442.78,6446.73"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2298","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"but you prostrate your guru","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6446.73,6448.5"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2299","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"who is in the form\nof dharmakaya;","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6448.5,6452.19"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2300","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"personally you prostrate.\nYou do 100,000 prostrations,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6452.19,6456.01"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2301","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"you take 100,000 recitations\nof refuge formula;","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6456.01,6459.65"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2302","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"you do that personally.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6459.65,6461.43"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2303","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So there is something\nvery real is taking place,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6461.43,6464.36"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2304","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"opposed to mentioning\nJoe Smith, or Dick Cavett.\n[Laughter]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6464.36,6480.41"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2305","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS:\nBut who you know--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6480.41,6481.69"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2306","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"who you think is out there","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6481.69,6482.94"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2307","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"as your \"real guru\"\nas you're saying,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6482.94,6484.8"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2308","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"it is only\nyour projection anyway,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6484.8,6486.2"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2309","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"so who you making\nlove to anyway?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6486.2,6488.3"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2310","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\nWell, your parents","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6488.3,6489.55"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2311","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"are also projection\nfrom that point of view.\nRAM DASS: Yes.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6489.55,6492.41"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2312","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\nAnd yourself included--\nRAM DASS: Yes.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6492.41,6493.77"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2313","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\n--but at *least*","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6493.77,6494.98"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2314","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"there is some reference\npoint that--\nRAM DASS: Oh, it's all so--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6494.98,6497.48"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2315","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\n--you know there *is* something.\nSome \"thing.\"","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6497.48,6500.32"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2316","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"That you don't have\nto make up name for them--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6500.32,6501.97"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2317","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS:\nYou don't make it all up--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6501.97,6503.19"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2318","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\n--for they or them or--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6503.19,6504.39"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2319","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS:\n--it's all as real as this is.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6504.39,6506.08"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2320","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: If you like,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6506.08,6507.36"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2321","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"but that back\nto square one in any case.\n[Laughs]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6507.36,6511.35"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2322","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"DUNCAN CAMPBELL:\nWell it seems to come back","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6511.35,6512.56"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2323","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"to that whole notion of,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6512.56,6513.79"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2324","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"you know, like there\nis obviously [laughter]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6513.79,6518.09"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2325","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"the guru principle\nwhich exists in the world.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6518.09,6520.06"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2326","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"But on the other hand","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6520.06,6521.39"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2327","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"if one prematurely gets into\na notion of guru principle","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6521.39,6524.4"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2328","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and detaches himself\nfrom the sheer reality","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6524.4,6527.83"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2329","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"of relating to another physical\nbeing with all that entails,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6527.83,6532.15"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2330","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"it could be very self-deceptive\nand very free","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6532.15,6536.38"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2331","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"for the ego to trip out,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6536.38,6538.2"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2332","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"on its own notions\nof what it really was honoring,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6538.2,6540.99"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2333","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"without having any feedback","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6540.99,6542.22"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2334","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"or any reference point\nto correct itself.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6542.22,6543.555"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2335","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Sure.\nRAM DASS:\nIf there were no feedback.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6543.555,6547.12"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2336","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"JOHN BAKER:\nWhat I'm trying to get at is:","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6547.12,6549.13"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2337","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"is there a difference in the\nquality of the love affair","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6549.13,6551.88"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2338","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"between the student and the guru\nthat comes out of desolation?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6551.88,6556.69"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2339","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Between that love affair,\nand that of a person","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6556.69,6559.95"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2340","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"who is longing for something\nwhich he doesn't have,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6559.95,6564.65"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2341","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"which he finds in his mind --\nin the experience of his mind --","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6564.65,6570.36"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2342","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"say the image of God\nor of whatever.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6570.36,6573.16"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2343","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Do you see what I mean?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6573.16,6574.86"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2344","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Between-- is there a difference\nin the love affair","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6574.86,6576.75"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2345","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"between the student\nand the real guru","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6576.75,6579.49"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2346","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and that of an imaginary guru.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6579.49,6580.81"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2347","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"What's the quality\nof the difference?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6580.81,6582.83"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2348","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\nThere is enormous.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6582.83,6584.53"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2349","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"One is imaginary, obviously;\nyou know that you made it up.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6584.53,6588.34"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2350","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Other one is that you have\nexperience already on earth.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6588.34,6593.01"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2351","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"It's--\nRAM DASS: Well--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6593.01,6595.54"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2352","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\n--seem to be very simple.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6595.54,6598.3"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2353","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Your parents can warn you about,\n\"You might get accident,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6598.3,6602.6"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2354","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"you should drive\nyour car properly.\"","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6602.6,6606.345"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2355","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And your parents could show\nslides of kinds of collision","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6606.345,6610.478"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2356","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that she or he have seen --\nthey have seen --","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6610.478,6614.913"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2357","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and indoctrinate you\nhow car driving is dangerous.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6614.913,6620.931"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2358","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"That's a concept.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6620.931,6623.143"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2359","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"But when person,\nchildren of such parents,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6623.143,6627.614"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2360","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"get into the accident, properly,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6627.614,6630.77"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2361","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and feels car collision\nactually taking place,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6630.77,6634.045"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2362","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"then you don't need\nparents' indoctrination,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6634.045,6637.624"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2363","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"but you *know it*,\nwhat's it's all about.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6637.624,6639.978"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2364","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"JOHN BAKER: So are you saying\nthat the love affair","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6639.978,6641.912"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2365","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"with the guru\nis like a car crash?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6641.912,6644.388"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2366","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Yeah.\n[Laughter; applause]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6644.388,6647.673"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2367","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: Last year my guru\nleft his body, Rinpoche.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6649.896,6652.528"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2368","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Would you then say that\nat that point he ceases\nto be functional as a guru?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6652.679,6658.092"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2369","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: He is a part\nof your subconscious mind,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6658.092,6661.361"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2370","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"as well as jnana state,\nwhatever, you know,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6661.361,6664.648"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2371","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"potentialities\nof wakening you up.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6664.648,6668.039"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2372","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And he only comes\nin the form of a dream,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6668.039,6673.216"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2373","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"subconscious mind,\nwhich he wakes you, constantly.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6673.216,6678.509"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2374","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"But on the other hand,\nthat if you want to go to India","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6678.509,6682.164"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2375","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and meet \"the\" guy,\nmeet the person,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6682.164,6685.801"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2376","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that you don't have room\nfor do that,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6685.801,6687.319"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2377","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"because he doesn't exist.\nRAM DASS: Hmm.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6687.319,6691.935"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2378","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\nMaybe you should go back\nand see,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6692.034,6694.249"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2379","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and in his empty room,\nhe might be there;","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6694.249,6697.707"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2380","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that's possibility.\nTalking about magic.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6697.767,6700.679"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2381","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And maybe that might be\nvery creative thing to do.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6700.679,6704.194"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2382","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RAM DASS: Hmm.\nI'll do it! I'll look,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6704.194,6706.36"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2383","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and I'll let you know.\n[Laughs; Trungpa Rinpoche\nlaughs]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6706.36,6708.466"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2384","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\nI think we should...","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6721.579,6725.386"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2385","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER5:\n[Singing to tune of\n\"Oh Lord Won't You Buy\nMe a Mercedes Benz\"]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6725.386,6727.42"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2386","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Oh Lord won't you make me\na mystic like them.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6727.42,6732.7"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2387","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I like doing mantra,\nI meditate each day.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6732.7,6738.13"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2388","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I pray for deliverance.\nI long to see your face.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6738.13,6743.44"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2389","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Oh Lord, won't you send me\nyour transcending grace.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6743.44,6748.84"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2390","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Oh lord, won't you make\nmy dharma my goal.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6748.84,6753.99"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2391","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Extinguish my ego,\nand clarify my soul.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6753.99,6759.94"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2392","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I search this whole lifetime,\nfor truth that is real.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6759.94,6765.46"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2393","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Oh Lord, help me realize\nmy bodhisattva ideal.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6765.46,6771.68"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2394","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"[Applause]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6771.68,6784.53"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2395","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And now folks,\na word from our sponsors.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6784.53,6788.5"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2396","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\nWe know what you've been doing!","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6788.5,6792.1"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2397","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"[Laughter]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6792.1,6801.445"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2398","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"DUNCAN CAMPBELL: You've been\nlistening to Open Secret","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6806.21,6808.47"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2399","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"[laughter; laughs],","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6808.47,6811.93"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2400","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"a series of discussions","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6811.93,6813.87"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2401","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"sponsored by Naropa Institute\nin Boulder, Colorado.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6813.87,6818.72"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2402","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I'd like to thank the people\nthat have been with us tonight:","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6818.72,6821.55"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2403","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Jim Green, John Baker, Ram Dass,\nand Chogyam Trungpa Rinpoche.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6821.55,6826.71"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2404","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"[Applause]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227#t=6826.71,6840.089"}]},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382","type":"AnnotationPage","label":{"en":["English [Transcript]"]},"items":[{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76078/file/167227/transcript/40382/annotation/2405","type":"Annotation","motivation":"subtitling","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"https://d9jk7wjtjpu5g.cloudfront.net/file_transcripts/associated_files/000/040/382/original/19740711VCTR1-Captions-ForVideo.vtt?1667062326","format":"text/vtt","language":"en"},"target":"https://d9jk7wjtjpu5g.cloudfront.net/file_transcripts/associated_files/000/040/382/original/19740711VCTR1-Captions-ForVideo.vtt?1667062326"}]}]}]}