{"@context":"http://iiif.io/api/presentation/3/context.json","id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/iiif/4m9183521h/manifest","type":"Manifest","label":{"en":["1978-08-11: Naropa Institute: Meditation and Poetics: Class Discussion"]},"logo":"https://d9jk7wjtjpu5g.cloudfront.net/organizations/logo_images/000/000/209/original/cti-library-logo-blue-text.png?1672724952","metadata":[{"label":{"en":["Date"]},"value":{"en":["1978-08-11"]}},{"label":{"en":["Format"]},"value":{"en":["Audio"]}},{"label":{"en":["Location"]},"value":{"en":["Boulder, Colorado, USA"]}},{"label":{"en":["Event Type"]},"value":{"en":["Course"]}},{"label":{"en":["Seminar or Series Title"]},"value":{"en":["\u003ca href=\"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/playlists/244/show\"\u003eNaropa Institute: Poetics\u003c/a\u003e"]}},{"label":{"en":["Talk Title"]},"value":{"en":["Meditation and Poetics: Class Discussion"]}},{"label":{"en":["Theme"]},"value":{"en":["Poetry and Poetics"]}},{"label":{"en":["Summary"]},"value":{"en":["\u003cp\u003eChogyam Trungpa visits Allen Ginsberg's poetry class, Meditation and Poetics, at Naropa Institute, where they have been exploring haiku. Trungpa Rinpoche introduces the threefold logic -- ground, path, and fruition -- and discusses with Ginsberg its application to haiku and the poetry writing process. Most of the class is a lively Q\u0026amp;A with both teachers, with subjects ranging from Tibetan poetry forms, the usefulness of meditation in composition, and classic Western poets. Also contributing to the discussion: Anne Waldman, Gregory Corso, and David Rome.\u003c/p\u003e"]}},{"label":{"en":["Publication"]},"value":{"en":["BOOK: Collected Works Vol 07","JOURNAL: Loka 2"]}},{"label":{"en":["Publication Details"]},"value":{"en":["\u003cp\u003eBOOK: COLLECTED WORKS VOL 7: Selected Writings: Poetics\u003cbr\u003e-- from \u003ca href=\"https://www.shambhala.com/the-collected-works-of-chogyam-trungpa-381.html\"\u003eShambhala Publications\u003c/a\u003e\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJOURNAL: LOKA 2: A JOURNAL FROM NAROPA INSTITUTE (out-of-print)\u003cbr\u003e-- from \u003ca href=\"https://www.amazon.com/LOKA-2-Journal-Naropa-Institute/dp/B0051H89NW/ref=sr_1_2\"\u003eAmazon\u003c/a\u003e\u003c/p\u003e"]}},{"label":{"en":["Transcription Credits"]},"value":{"en":["\u003cp\u003eMay 29 2021 to Sep 26 2022 Transcribing: Ella Milligan Checking: Leandra Ziegler Final Proof: Leandra Ziegler Terminology Review: Lynn Friedman Other Contributors: Warner Dick\u003c/p\u003e"]}},{"label":{"en":["Rights Statement"]},"value":{"en":["© Diana J. Mukpo - All rights reserved. Not to be Distributed or Reproduced."]}},{"label":{"en":["Year"]},"value":{"en":["1978"]}}],"summary":{"en":["\u003cp\u003eChogyam Trungpa visits Allen Ginsberg's poetry class, Meditation and Poetics, at Naropa Institute, where they have been exploring haiku. Trungpa Rinpoche introduces the threefold logic -- ground, path, and fruition -- and discusses with Ginsberg its application to haiku and the poetry writing process. Most of the class is a lively Q\u0026amp;A with both teachers, with subjects ranging from Tibetan poetry forms, the usefulness of meditation in composition, and classic Western poets. Also contributing to the discussion: Anne Waldman, Gregory Corso, and David Rome.\u003c/p\u003e"]},"requiredStatement":{"label":{"en":["Attribution"]},"value":{"en":["© Diana J. Mukpo - All rights reserved. Not to be Distributed or Reproduced."]}},"provider":[{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/aboutus","type":"Agent","label":{"en":["Chogyam Trungpa Digital Library"]},"homepage":[{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/","type":"Text","label":{"en":["Chogyam Trungpa Digital Library"]},"format":"text/html"}],"logo":[{"id":"https://d9jk7wjtjpu5g.cloudfront.net/organizations/logo_images/000/000/209/original/cti-library-logo-blue-text.png?1672724952","type":"Image"}]}],"thumbnail":[{"id":"https://d9jk7wjtjpu5g.cloudfront.net/collection_resource_files/thumbnails/000/168/932/small/Logo-Audio-Red.png?1666559919","type":"Image","format":"image/png"}],"items":[{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932","type":"Canvas","label":{"en":["Media File 1 of 1 - 19780811VCTR1-Audio-ProdEdit-CTIAutoRmstr-Access.mp3"]},"duration":3140.62367,"width":640,"height":360,"thumbnail":[{"id":"https://d9jk7wjtjpu5g.cloudfront.net/collection_resource_files/thumbnails/000/168/932/small/Logo-Audio-Red.png?1666559919","type":"Image","format":"image/png"}],"items":[{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/content/1","type":"AnnotationPage","items":[{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/content/1/annotation/1","type":"Annotation","motivation":"painting","body":{"id":"https://aviary-p-cti.s3.wasabisys.com/collection_resource_files/resource_files/000/168/932/original/19780811VCTR1-Audio-ProdEdit-CTIAutoRmstr-Access.mp3?1666559897","type":"Audio","format":"audio/mpeg","duration":3140.62367,"width":640,"height":360},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932","metadata":[]}]}],"annotations":[{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40614","type":"AnnotationPage","label":{"en":["19780811VCTR1-Transcript-Timed [Transcript]"]},"items":[{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40614/annotation/1","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"[19780811VCTR1 - Naropa Institute  - Boulder - Meditation and Poetics - Class Discussion]\r\n\r\n\r\n[Chogyam Trungpa Institute - Unedited Verbatim Transcript]\r\n\r\n\r\n[Copyright Diana J. Mukpo All Rights Reserved - Not to be Distributed or Reproduced]\r\n\r\n\r\nCTI SLATE: This is the Venerable Chogyam Trungpa Rinpoche, Naropa Institute, Meditation and Poetics Class Discussion with Allen Ginsberg and Chogyam Trungpa, recorded on August 11, 1978 in Boulder, Colorado. This is a CTI auto-remaster made October 2022.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=0.0,24.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40614/annotation/2","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"[BOOKMARK: OPENING REMARKS]\r\n\r\n\r\nALLEN GINSBERG: --poetry class. This is Bobby Myers, my teaching assistant. This is Chogyam Trungpa Rinpoche, Tibetan poet and meditation teacher. And David Rome, here.\r\n\r\n\r\nSo, we were-- we had been reading a haiku today, both Japanese -- talking about space in haiku. \"A wild sea, / And stretching across to the Isle of Sado, / The Milky Way.\" [Basho] And also some haiku in Kerouac.\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Mhmm.\r\n\r\n\r\nALLEN GINSBERG: Then we were reading some of [William] Blake, a long poem called \"Auguries of Innocence and Experience\" [sic: Auguries of Innocence], in which he says \"We are led--\" Well, in which he says, \"To be in a Passion you Good may Do / But no Good if the Passion is in you.\" That make sense? [Laughter] And we were comparing that with Jamgon Kongtrul’s DIRECT PATH TO ENLIGHTENMENT.\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Oh, my goodness! [Laughter]\r\n\r\n\r\nALLEN GINSBERG: And I have been talking about hinayana, sitting, and how that might lead to jumps of perception from one thought to another and the spaces in between--\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Yeah.\r\n\r\n\r\nALLEN GINSBERG: --which are like haikus.\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Mhmm.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=24.0,119.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40614/annotation/3","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"ALLEN GINSBERG: So we can take off from there. Do you have anything on your mind?\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Well, that's hard to say. We’ve been talking about the notion of threefold logic. Have you discussed that at all, in any sense?\r\n\r\n\r\nALLEN GINSBERG: No, I haven’t, so that would be good to--\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Threefold logic, yeah. Yeah. So that might be interesting actually. Can you hear me?\r\n\r\n\r\nSTUDENTS: No. You need to move your mic close.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=119.0,159.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40614/annotation/4","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Is this -- oh yes, this is. Can you hear me now? [Laughs]\r\n\r\n\r\nThe notion of what’s called \"threefold logic\", which applies to a general state of mind, how we experience our phenomenal world. And obviously poetry comes from expression of one’s phenomenal world, in the written form. It could be either prose or poetry in form. It’s not so much from Buddhist point of view is that you write good poetry, particularly, but how you-- your thought patterns become elegant. That you see phenomenal world as a process, stages, as a view from our state of mind. That first we have what’s known as the ground, which we perceive -- just general sense of idea how things work, like bright. And having seen the brightness, then we begin to have some idea of it is sunshine. And then, because of sense of brightness, then we experience sense of sunshine. And having experienced the second stage that way, then we have a conclusion, which is dispels darkness.\r\n\r\n\r\nSo those are the what's known as threefold logic, which actually does apply very much to the haiku approach. That there is an idea, and then there's a complementary remark with idea, and then a final ending -- sometimes which is punctuated by humor, or sometimes punctuated by opinion, or could be just an open ending. So that seem to be an interesting kind of training. And seeing that how one thinks when you look at your world; then just write that down. And by doing so, a person’s approach begin to become very methodical and nothing is jumpy, and everything is somewhat organized in your mind. And therefore it creates further chain reactions probably to the readers of poetry as well, those who read your work. Their thought patterns begin to have some systematic situation, rather than just things jumbled together. And in turn, the theory is that having such approach, you develop... you’re helping the world to destroy chaos, and you create order in the universe.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=159.0,338.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40614/annotation/5","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"[BOOKMARK: QUESTION 1]\r\n\r\n\r\nALLEN GINSBERG: Well, in your thought process, do you systematically check out what of previous thought was ground or was flash; what moment you made the transition to recognizing the conception of the flash, sun; and then what further development and comment is made? In other words, do you constantly examine your thought forms that way? Or is it that when you have a striking thought, then you try to analyze it in a-- or you analyze it in that form, or find its structure in that form?\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Well, it’s mostly the thought patterns are free form thought patterns, which usually involves the threefold process. And what you do is then -- actually analyzing is not so much analyzing.\r\n\r\n\r\nALLEN GINSBERG: As recognizing?\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: It’s just another afterthought of that thought process.\r\n\r\n\r\nALLEN GINSBERG: Mhmm.\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: So there's no scholarship involved, particularly. It's just--\r\n\r\n\r\nALLEN GINSBERG: Uh huh. Well, by analyzing I just mean checking out--\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Yeah.\r\n\r\n\r\nALLEN GINSBERG: --a further thought -- \"Oh that was the flash. That was the--\"\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: [INAUDIBLE] . That was it.\r\n\r\n\r\nALLEN GINSBERG: Yeah.\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Yeah.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=338.0,417.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40614/annotation/6","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"[BOOKMARK: QUESTION 2]\r\n\r\n\r\nALLEN GINSBERG: Do you ever compose haikus consciously, using that as a method?\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: You could, as training process.\r\n\r\n\r\nALLEN GINSBERG: Yeah.\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: And then slowly person begin to gain more confidence in themselves, so they can actually flow.\r\n\r\n\r\nALLEN GINSBERG: So it’d be like driving. First you have to figure out the gears.\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Yes. Mhmm, mhmm, mhmm.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=417.0,434.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40614/annotation/7","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"[BOOKMARK: QUESTION 3]\r\n\r\n\r\nALLEN GINSBERG: Do you actually train yourself in checking out the triple-- the triad?And--did you?\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: In some sense, yes, I think you do. You always do that. And also connected with the study of, like, madhyamaka or Buddhist philosophy. You have a case, and you have a case-- a reference coming out of that case, and then you have a final conclusion, you know. It’s always a threefold process.\r\n\r\n\r\nALLEN GINSBERG: Can you give an example of that -- case, reference, and conclusion?\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Well, same thing as what we been saying, like... We could say that the mind is empty, free from conceptions -- it is enlightenment.\r\n\r\n\r\nALLEN GINSBERG: Okay. How would you make a haiku of that? In other words-- no, I mean, what situation would give rise to something substantial [UNCLEAR: over that?] rather than the abstraction?\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Haiku?\r\n\r\n\r\nALLEN GINSBERG: Yeah.\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Well, you could have--\r\n\r\n\r\nALLEN GINSBERG: That that would come automatically, but what--\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Which one?\r\n\r\n\r\nALLEN GINSBERG: A situation where you recognize your mind was empty, free from distraction--\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Concept, yeah.\r\n\r\n\r\nALLEN GINSBERG: Concept. That’s enlightenment.\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: That's--\r\n\r\n\r\nALLEN GINSBERG: So that would be, say, the... that would be the basic structure of almost all noticings.\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Mhmm. That’s what we’re trying to say, yeah.\r\n\r\n\r\nALLEN GINSBERG: Yeah.\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: That’s how whole thing should work. There could have some discipline goes with that, and--\r\n\r\n\r\nALLEN GINSBERG: Yeah, well that-- so that--\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: --training people.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=434.0,537.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40614/annotation/8","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"[BOOKMARK: QUESTION 4]\r\n\r\n\r\nALLEN GINSBERG: Well, would that be-- would that involve simple shamatha sitting, or a further application of it, or a special case?\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: I think shamatha sitting, as well as some sort of awareness, mindfulness of daily life. You know, that brings things into a cohesive situation.\r\n\r\n\r\nALLEN GINSBERG: Well, what you’re describing is also a byproduct of shamatha, isn’t it?\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: You could say that too, yeah.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=537.0,563.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40614/annotation/9","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"[BOOKMARK: QUESTION 5]\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: [To David Rome] What you say? Do you have anything to say?\r\n\r\n\r\nDAVID ROME: About shamatha?\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: No, the whole thing. [Laughs]\r\n\r\n\r\nDAVID ROME: Well, that kind of threefold process is-- it's not a gimmick. It’s a very basic pattern by which perception occurs and also where the creation occurs. So your finished poem might actually show those three levels, or it might not all that specifically. But nevertheless the process which you went through to create a poem must-- it does anyhow follow that kind of process. But the extent to which you’re somewhat clear in following it will affect the elegance or accuracy of the poem.\r\n\r\n\r\nSo you have some kind of first impulse to express something. And that impulse carries with it some sense of the texture of what you want to express. In some cases, it’s the texture of a certain emotion. In some cases, particularly for poets I imagine, it’s one detail that has struck you. And you feel that there's something further that could be made of that, or presented from that, or even just trying to present that one detail involves some further process. So then you begin fleshing it out, so to speak, which is finding the further reference to that detail or that basic texture. And that process contains openness as well as narrowing, which I think is what becomes very important about these three steps. They’re how to do something without having it all figured out to begin with. But on the other hand, not going off in every direction so that you end up purely with chaos, a jungle. So your middle stage is feeling that texture further or drawing that detail out further, making new discoveries; but also beginning to focus it down towards some kind of single statement, single message. And that becomes the third level, which could be contained in a great last line, or it might even be contained in the kind of space that’s left after the poem is over. And that there’s some unified event which has actually taken place.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=563.0,714.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40614/annotation/10","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"[BOOKMARK: QUESTION 6]\r\n\r\n\r\nALLEN GINSBERG: I wonder how that would apply to the last haiku? But we don’t have-- we’re doing this in English translation, and it may be reversing the order of the perceptions; but it was \"A wild sea, / And stretching across to the isle of Sado, / The Milky Way.\"\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: I think that hangs together still--\r\n\r\n\r\nALLEN GINSBERG: Yeah.\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: --very much so.\r\n\r\n\r\nALLEN GINSBERG: In relation to that structure somewhat, actually.\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Yeah.\r\n\r\n\r\nALLEN GINSBERG: The \"wild sea\" is the first flash.\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Mhmm.\r\n\r\n\r\nALLEN GINSBERG: Well actually you’d have the sea and then the heaven.[Laughs]\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Yeah.\r\n\r\n\r\nALLEN GINSBERG: Reversed, maybe? [Laughs]\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Well, you have--\r\n\r\n\r\nALLEN GINSBERG: Is it?\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: --a sense of waterness. And then--\r\n\r\n\r\nALLEN GINSBERG: Yeah, the engulfing water.\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Yeah, and then sense of nostalgia, the island--\r\n\r\n\r\nALLEN GINSBERG: Yeah.\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: --and sort of dwelling place. And then finally, so what? You know, Milky Way.\r\n\r\n\r\nALLEN GINSBERG: Well, it is actually \"And stretching across to the isle of Sado,\" so you get enormous space all of a sudden.\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Yeah, sure, yeah.\r\n\r\n\r\nALLEN GINSBERG: Whether Sado is visible, we don’t know, but \"Stretching to the isle of Sado, / The Milky Way.\" Then he recognizes it in a comment or conception with a name.\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Something slightly moved from the water on the island.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=714.0,790.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40614/annotation/11","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"[BOOKMARK: QUESTION 7]\r\n\r\n\r\nALLEN GINSBERG: Do you know that book of haikus by R. H. Blyth [Reginald Horace Blyth] at all?\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Very much so, yeah.\r\n\r\n\r\nALLEN GINSBERG: Yeah. Do you have any favorites from that?\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Well a lot of them, actually -- [laughing] in fact, all of them.\r\n\r\n\r\nALLEN GINSBERG: Yeah. We were-- I read about a hundred of them the other day, here, must have been. There were a couple that I liked that was... \"Not a single stone / To throw at the dog, / The wintry moon.\" [Author Sumi Taigi]\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Mhmm.\r\n\r\n\r\nALLEN GINSBERG: Which was actually-- first flash there was anger, want-- you know, wanting to grab a stone to throw at the dog. And then frustration at that because of the frozen grounds. And then, at recognizing the frozen situation, seeing the moon, which was irrelevant in a sense but related to the cold frozenness. The moon being a comment on his anger, or a sudden opening up--\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Yeah, sense of cooling.\r\n\r\n\r\nALLEN GINSBERG: --or distraction from it.\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Yeah, yeah.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=790.0,851.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40614/annotation/12","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"[BOOKMARK: QUESTION 8]\r\n\r\n\r\nALLEN GINSBERG: Shall we open it up to--\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Sure, yes.\r\n\r\n\r\nALLEN GINSBERG: Anybody got any questions on the nature of perception and conception?\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Big subject, hmm? [Laughs]\r\n\r\n\r\nALLEN GINSBERG: Actually, we got into a big -- go on.\r\n\r\n\r\nSPEAKER1: I have a question--\r\n\r\n\r\nSPEAKER2: Please use the mic.\r\n\r\n\r\nSPEAKER1: Oh, yeah. My question is, if the mind-- [unknown gesture or incident] [Laughter]\r\n\r\n\r\nALLEN GINSBERG: You’re blocking his view from the camera.\r\n\r\n\r\nSPEAKER1: If the mind desires to work on a poem, or if the mind desires to think about a poem or think about something which you have done that day or that you will want to do, why in meditation will you interrupt your thought patterns, stopping the mind from doing what the mind wants to do? So the question is-- in other words, what’s the purpose of meditation? Why not let the mind do what the mind wants to do, what the mind is inclined to do?\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Well, you could have all sorts of possibilities there, the mind wanted to do all sorts of things. But in lot of cases, you don’t achieve them, so mind becomes frustrated. And once you begin to feel that you have freedom to think whatever you want to think and do whatever you want to do, but then you realize that you can’t do it, so you end up in square one once more. So therefore, meditation practice is to realize that such ambition cannot be achieved. So that you have some kind of perspective and some sense of relaxation. So that the meditation practice cuts through the speed of it, or the tremendous ambition of it, which is self-destructive generally. So the meditation sort of calms down and provides some perspective.\r\n\r\n\r\nSPEAKER1: Thanks.\r\n\r\n\r\nALLEN GINSBERG: I had a sort of chauvinistic answer to that, which was that for the purposes of poetry, if by returning to the breath you interrupt the speed of thought, you also get by hindsight a profile of the thought that just disappeared.\r\n\r\n\r\nSPEAKER1: Yeah, but you also stop the thought from-- before it develops. I mean, like, you might begin with a vague idea and you say \"that’s just a thought.\" And when you say that, some other thought will rise, rather than that original thought progressing and developing and working it out to some conclusion which is of value and which you can remember, you know.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=851.0,1016.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40614/annotation/13","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"ALLEN GINSBERG: I’ve always found that I couldn’t remember a chain of fifty thoughts; [laughs] I can only remember the last three. Which is why it’s useful to stop -- like waking from a dream, literally waking up from a dream. If you continue sleeping and dreaming, you’ll lose the last dreams -- if you were wanting to capture dreams, if you wanted to use them. So, like, waking up from a dream, you can remember it. But if you continue dreaming, it gets lost in the womb of dreams -- they disappear. Just from a chauvinistic point of view, poet-chauvinistic point of view, there's some advantage to waking up from daydreams. Does that make sense?\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: I think so.\r\n\r\n\r\nALLEN GINSBERG: If you’re looking for advantage.\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: [Laughs]\r\n\r\n\r\nSPEAKER1: I’m not sure.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1016.0,1065.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40614/annotation/14","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"[BOOKMARK: QUESTION 9]\r\n\r\n\r\nALLEN GINSBERG: I think Kirpal had his hand up first.\r\n\r\n\r\nSPEAKER2: Allen, you described Blake as a vajrayana poet. I can imagine, here at Christmas time, Santa Claus over here, and that he’s a wino, an alcoholic. And a father and a son are walking towards him, and the son sees a nice old man who gives presents, and the father recognizes immediately that it’s an old wino who's picking up a little seasonal work. And... now you have two perceptions here. And in Blake’s system, one is the perception of innocence and the other is the perception of experience. Now in these sequences of perceptions that the poet sees all at once -- that is, the poet Blake -- there's a revolutionary condition arises out of this. Now, how would vajrayana poetics deal with this problem in terms of actual Blake who would immediately perceive a revolutionary situation here? That is, he would see the man and what was laid on him and how he became a wino. The father would also see back through the man to his son as perhaps becoming a wino. That is, the end of the son’s journey could also be this old Christmastime wino.\r\n\r\n\r\nALLEN GINSBERG: Well, Blake has the answer here: \"The Childs Toys and the Old Mans Reasons / Are the Fruits of (the) Two seasons.\" [\"Auguries of Innocence\"] [Trungpa Rinpoche laughs]\r\n\r\n\r\nSPEAKER2: Okay.\r\n\r\n\r\nALLEN GINSBERG: It’s built into the poem. I mean, he says-- he treated that particular problem directly there, I thought. Or it’s same thing as \"One for-- One Law for the Lion and Ox is Oppression.\" [\"Marriage of Heaven and Hell\"] That is, they are simply different-- completely themselves but completely different, so to speak, unborn beings, [UNCLEAR: but?] completely there.\r\n\r\n\r\nSPEAKER2: But Blake would also con-- he would also manipulate the whole process of perceptions as a sequence of perceptions. I mean, he doesn’t only work with these little auguries, with these little aphoristic structures. He works with whole paragraph structures, which give you sequences of perceptions. And then it would seem to me that, exactly in the sense of his [SPEAKER1's] question, that the process of thought could be broken then by meditation.\r\n\r\n\r\nALLEN GINSBERG: It'll arise again. [Laughs] I don’t think you have to worry about it.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1065.0,1226.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40614/annotation/15","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"[BOOKMARK: QUESTION 10]\r\n\r\n\r\nALLEN GINSBERG: I think Kirpal had his hand up first.\r\n\r\n\r\nKIRPAL GORDON: I don’t know your name?\r\n\r\n\r\nALLEN GINSBERG: David Rome.\r\n\r\n\r\nKIRPAL GORDON: David--\r\n\r\n\r\nALLEN GINSBERG: Kirpal Singh Gordon.\r\n\r\n\r\nKIRPAL GORDON: I couldn’t-- I followed what you were saying. I couldn’t follow your description of the process well; but if you were fleshing out what Trungpa said, well then I got it. And as you described that process -- I don’t know if this is going on or not -- but if-- as you described the process, that sounds like what most of the good poets do that I know. And most of the good poets I know don’t have anything to do with meditation in any formal sense. So, could you address what you said in terms of how it might relate to a practice?\r\n\r\n\r\nDAVID ROME: [INAUDIBLE] [UNCLEAR: is this supposed to be?] ?\r\n\r\n\r\nKIRPAL GORDON: It's supposed to have a connection between those. So how does meditation-- what does meditation do in terms of that? I mean, if that’s already a natural process for an artist?\r\n\r\n\r\nDAVID ROME: Well meditation is... basically-- [laughter] It's basically to clean up your mind, which is the same thing that we’ve all been talking about, that-- in terms of that other question. If just letting the mind do what it wants to do was in itself a perfect [INAUDIBLE] , then everyone would be a perfectly great poet -- which I suppose, some people would say that, but that's not really the point. In fact, there's very few-- it's kind of like the Buddha, I suppose, he was the only one who got enlightened without having a teacher.\r\n\r\n\r\nKIRPAL GORDON: So then the artistic discipline is the same as the spiritual discipline?\r\n\r\n\r\nDAVID ROME: That’s just basic human-ness. It's basic discipline. Then out of that, you can be an artist, you can be a businessman, you could be whatever you might be. The purpose of meditation is not to produce good poets.\r\n\r\n\r\nALLEN GINSBERG: The corollary is to produce lucidity or clarity.\r\n\r\n\r\nDAVID ROME: Sure.\r\n\r\n\r\nALLEN GINSBERG: Which could be applied to business or poetry -- or any gesture. Though I’d say since poetry deals with mind-stuff, language-- language mind-stuff, that the constant observation, and constant mindfulness of mind-stuff would be directly-- in meditation would directly relate very fast to poetry -- maybe to business but I haven’t had that much experience, but it would relate to business intuition probably.\r\n\r\n\r\nKIRPAL GORDON: Yeah, but as I understand that process, that is ongoing. Whatever is-- whatever we're calling meditation is part of the process of doing art. If you enter into an artistic discipline, then you’re already involved in a meditation of sorts.\r\n\r\n\r\nALLEN GINSBERG: To the extent that it involves awareness of what’s going on in your mind, and looking at it from the outside rather than being caught in it all the time. But some art doesn’t do that. Some art, it takes-- does not draw back and see. That’s why they had the Objectivist school in the twentieth century that had to point out that what was going on in the mind was furniture, was a thing or things, just like external objects. Before that, people thought that-- were more attached to their thoughts, and wrote poems *just* out of thoughts, without realizing that thoughts were just things like tables and chairs, as per the exposition-- or explanation of Objectivism in American poetry in the twenties that I was talking about a couple of weeks ago.\r\n\r\n\r\nThere was a school of American poets in the twenties called Objectivists -- followers of [William Carlos] Williams, friends of Williams who was well-grounded -- who pointed out that their thoughts were objects, and if treated as objects, could be included in the poems. As distinct from Williams and [Ezra] Pound who originally tried to banish internal thoughts as just being subjective rambling. That make sense?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1226.0,1517.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40614/annotation/16","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"[BOOKMARK: QUESTION 11]\r\n\r\n\r\nSPEAKER3: If not meditation, what was the process that Williams used to get where he got, or to get the kind of haiku-ishness that he got? I mean, he didn’t do sitting meditation, I don’t think.\r\n\r\n\r\nALLEN GINSBERG: I think he did--\r\n\r\n\r\nSPEAKER3: Well, I've never read that he did it literally anyway, or any particular method.\r\n\r\n\r\nALLEN GINSBERG: He set himself to paying very close, careful attention to what was around him. That was his whole point -- to start listening to the language he heard around him, and observing things that his eye saw and looking very carefully, and sort as if he, by a sort of an... attentiveness or mindfulness to the actual world around. That’s why he arrived at a point of saying, \"I have had my dreams -- like other men\" -- probably suffering brought it.\r\n\r\n\r\n\"I have had my dreams -- like other men -- / But it has come to nothing, so that / I-- now I stand here with my feet on the ground, / Looking up at the sky -- / Feeling the weight of my body and my shoes, / Clothes hanging on my-- coat hanging on my shoulder, / Brim of the hat before me, breath passing in and out / At my nose-- or, air passing in and out / Of my nose -- and resolve to dream no more.\" [\"Thursday\" by William Carlos Williams]\r\n\r\n\r\nSort of a small case of a self-born Buddha, in a sense of that kind of waking up. But his discipline was close attentiveness -- so a kind of meditation in action. Does that make sense? You know that poem?\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: No.\r\n\r\n\r\nALLEN GINSBERG: [INAUDIBLE] Did you hear it? Yeah, I thought-- I use that-- I’ve been using that as sort of the intersection point between American poetry and meditative practice -- 1923.\r\n\r\n\r\nGet the-- [UNCLEAR: Kensay?] , can you bring the microphone over?\r\n\r\n\r\n[GAP IN AUDIO]\r\n\r\n\r\nSPEAKER4: In PATERSON, he says, \"Why talk about the 'I', which interests me / not at all?\" And he goes on to describe other things. He wasn't interested in describing himself as in a personal history. So in that sense, he wasn't-- there wasn't that sort of obsession locked inside; he was always pushing it out.\r\n\r\n\r\nALLEN GINSBERG: The flower turning to the outside to look.\r\n\r\n\r\nSPEAKER4: Yeah.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1517.0,1664.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40614/annotation/17","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"[BOOKMARK: QUESTION 12]\r\n\r\n\r\nALLEN GINSBERG: You had a-- Richard Roth.\r\n\r\n\r\nRICHARD ROTH: I’d like to ask Rinpoche a question. Allen’s been dividing poetics up into hinayana, mahayana, and vajrayana. The first two are a little easier to understand than the last one. I was wondering if you could say something about what vajrayana poetics would be, or is?\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Well, we have a lot of examples of that, such as like THE HUNDRED THOUSAND SONGS OF MILAREPA. Have you read them? That’s it. And THE ROYAL SONG OF SARAHA. And as far as mahayana poetics concerned, such as like the BODHICHARYAVATARA; the translation is called ENTERING THE PATH OF ENLIGHTENMENT.\r\n\r\n\r\nI think the general qualities of vajrayana poetics, you have two types of situations. One is proclamation of personal experiences; and the second one is inspiration and devotional level. So we could say that the first phase is the devotional level of like Milarepa’s songs yearning for his teacher, and towards the end of his life. And also some of the writings of Padmasambhava, you find they are just proclamation. And in fact, the idea of vajrayana poetics is once you heard, once you read, it’s supposed to have a direct effect on your state of mind so that your conceptual patterns of mind could be cut through. It’s sort of like mantra in some sense.\r\n\r\n\r\nALLEN GINSBERG: Can you give an example of a line like that, of that quality, that cuts through instantly?\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Well, I don’t remember any translations.\r\n\r\n\r\nALLEN GINSBERG: Well, what’s the one that most ever struck you?\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: I think all of them, actually.\r\n\r\n\r\nALLEN GINSBERG: What was the first?\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Well, [laughter; laughs] I think all of them. [UNCLEAR: Who was the? Most?] first?\r\n\r\n\r\nALLEN GINSBERG: Temporally.\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Umm... It’s like... how does it go? \"Mikyo Dorje fills the whole of space.\" Do you remember that, in English translation?\r\n\r\n\r\nDAVID ROME: \"AH! Mikyo Dorje fills the whole of space.\"\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Can you say it?\r\n\r\n\r\nDAVID ROME: Well, I don't remember it.\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: You remember it?\r\n\r\n\r\nDAVID ROME: \"AH!--\r\n\r\n\r\nALLEN GINSBERG: \"Mikyo Dorje fills the whole of space.\"\r\n\r\n\r\nDAVID ROME: \"Mikyo Dorje fills the whole of space.\"\r\n\r\n\r\nSPEAKER5: Is that from the Sadhana [of Mahamudra]?\r\n\r\n\r\nALLEN GINSBERG: \"Mik-yo Dor-je fills the whole of space.\"\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: And...\r\n\r\n\r\nALLEN GINSBERG: Some equivalent line of Blake would be \"One thought fills immensity.\" [\"Marriage of Heaven and Hell\"]\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Mhmm. I suppose we could say that any kind of sadhana reading would be connected to that situation, too.\r\n\r\n\r\nALLEN GINSBERG: Mhmm.\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Yeah.\r\n\r\n\r\nALLEN GINSBERG: The sadhana? Can you explain that, David, for those who are not experienced practitioners?\r\n\r\n\r\nDAVID ROME: Sadhana is a vajrayana liturgy, which is actually a... the liturgy itself is literature, is a guideline for going through different stages of perception and identification with energies and aspects of reality. Which is, I suppose, what the vajrayana poem would be as well in any case.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1664.0,1896.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40614/annotation/18","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"[BOOKMARK: QUESTION 13]\r\n\r\n\r\nALLEN GINSBERG: I’ve been talking a lot about the space between thoughts in haiku or in poetry. What role does that kind of a jump between thoughts, or gap between thoughts, play in meditation, and what does it play in poetry? As you know-- see, we don’t know Milarepa in En-- in original. And in English it’s flat. The swiftness of mind is-- it isn’t as-- the language isn’t swift. So I was just wondering what -- do you remember any lines of Milarepa that have that kind of jump that a haiku has?\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Well, I think Milarepa’s songs very folksy. It’s not supposed to be a work of scholar, particularly, scholar-poet. So therefore it is, in fact, almost a conversation in verse, and a lot of little humors and directness. Like when he was talking to the logicians, he said, \"I never had a stew of logic.\" In Tibetan, it’s a play on the word. \"Tsema\" is \"logic\", \"tsoma\" is \"stew.\" So, \"I never had tsoma of tsema.\" So things like that, I think missed in English translation, but there is--\r\n\r\n\r\nALLEN GINSBERG: Do you have a lot of that in Tibetan? The pun?\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Quite a lot.\r\n\r\n\r\nALLEN GINSBERG: Or near puns?\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Think so.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1896.0,2003.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40614/annotation/19","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"[BOOKMARK: QUESTION 14]\r\n\r\n\r\nALLEN GINSBERG: A couple of hands there.\r\n\r\n\r\nSPEAKER6: Well recently, researching something, I found out that the Tibetan word for \"writer\" is, I think, \"shinggi sibu\".\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: What?\r\n\r\n\r\nSPEAKER6: The Tibetan word for \"writer\", I found in a dictionary, was \"shinggi sibu\".. And it said that the same word also meant \"wood-eating moth or worm\". Could either of you elaborate on that? [Laughter]\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Well, what dictionary is that? [Laughter]\r\n\r\n\r\nSPEAKER6: In the Naropa library.\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Oh yeah? Do you remember the author of the dictionary?\r\n\r\n\r\nSPEAKER6: No.\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: I’m sorry, I can’t understand your Tibetan. [Laughter; laughs] A \"rider\" is [UNCLEAR TIBETAN: chibs pa?] or sometimes \"ta-pa,\" which means a \"horseman\", \"rider\".\r\n\r\n\r\nSPEAKER6: No, writer as in poet, or--\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Writer.\r\n\r\n\r\nSPEAKER6: Mhmm. The \"shinggi sibu\".\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Oh. [Laughter; laughs] Well... [Laughter]\r\n\r\n\r\nALLEN GINSBERG: Blank.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2003.0,2082.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40614/annotation/20","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"[BOOKMARK: QUESTION 15]\r\n\r\n\r\nALLEN GINSBERG: Gregory, you got any questions?\r\n\r\n\r\nGREGORY CORSO: Nope, no questions. Oh yeah, one, one. Last night--\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: I wasn't there last night. [Laughs]\r\n\r\n\r\nGREGORY CORSO: Last night he [the Vajra Regent Osel Tendzin] was vajrayana.\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Oh yeah?\r\n\r\n\r\nGREGORY CORSO: Oh, it was a big crowd there, and I don't think much of the crowd thought he was in vajrayana. Was this crazy wisdom, right? Was he crazy wisdom, Allen? Don't look at him, look at me--\r\n\r\n\r\nALLEN GINSBERG: Yeah, I would say so.\r\n\r\n\r\nGREGORY CORSO: He was crazy wisdom, right. [Laughter] So, he was a little smashed and a little drunk. And ones who could not understand it when he told somebody to shut the fuck up and all that; you might have thought, \"Wow, how crude\" or something. [Laughter] It was a real funny, awkward evening last night. He held on to one guy who he told to get out, [INAUDIBLE] himself, all that, to get out, but then took him back again. This guy didn't know what was going on. But he had already told it-- Osel already told it in his lecture. This only happened in the question period, where he let himself go. The whole lecture, very straight, but the question period, a big tumbling act. Did you know about that?\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Now I know.\r\n\r\n\r\nGREGORY CORSO: How do you think he handled it even though you weren't there? Did you hear about it?\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: I don't know.\r\n\r\n\r\nGREGORY CORSO: Is that his first shot at vajrayana teaching? [Laughter]\r\n\r\n\r\nALLEN GINSBERG: No, [INAUDIBLE].\r\n\r\n\r\nGREGORY CORSO: It was the first time I saw him like that.\r\n\r\n\r\nALLEN GINSBERG: No, he's taught vajrayana before. He's experienced.\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: [Laughs]\r\n\r\n\r\nGREGORY CORSO: That's [UNCLEAR: my smart ass?].","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2082.0,2178.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40614/annotation/21","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"[BOOKMARK: QUESTION 16]\r\n\r\n\r\nALLEN GINSBERG: Anne, you got anything on your mind?\r\n\r\n\r\nANNE WALDMAN: I thought maybe Rinpoche would say something about the eleven-- I think it's eleven syllable lines in Tibetan poetics.\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Eighteen, yeah.\r\n\r\n\r\nANNE WALDMAN: Just something about the forms, some of the forms of Tibetan poetics, just for general interest. Or maybe you could read. Maybe you could recite some lines so we could hear how it sounds in Tibetan, some formal lines that have this structure, syllabic structure.\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Well, actually, each single line of that type has the precisely same thing we've been discussing about the threefold logic.\r\n\r\n\r\nALLEN GINSBERG: Each line is supposed to have?\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Yeah, each line has...\r\n\r\n\r\nANNE WALDMAN: So it has three things happening in each line?\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Yes. Usually three, three situations.\r\n\r\n\r\nANNE WALDMAN: It's almost like a braiding technique. You know, making a braid [INAUDIBLE] .\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Yes, well--\r\n\r\n\r\nALLEN GINSBERG: Braiding.\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: --if you have the whole poetry, you might have twenty of them, twenty eighteen-syllable lines. And the first one is three-- the very first one is three, obviously, and which is preparing the ground for the rest of it. And so in the middle it's sort of middle but still having threefold logics. And then at the end also still continuing same imagery -- there are lot of images. And finish, the final conclusion is also threefold logic style which concludes the line.\r\n\r\n\r\nANNE WALDMAN: Is twenty lines take the form--\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Yes.\r\n\r\n\r\nANNE WALDMAN: --as the first line?\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Sometimes, yes. Or thirty. On each line begins with a letter of the alphabet.\r\n\r\n\r\nANNE WALDMAN: Oh.\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Could be, yeah.\r\n\r\n\r\nALLEN GINSBERG: You've written like that?\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Hmm?\r\n\r\n\r\nALLEN GINSBERG: Have you written like that?\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Many of them.\r\n\r\n\r\nALLEN GINSBERG: Yeah.\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: [Laughs] Yeah.\r\n\r\n\r\nALLEN GINSBERG: What's the--\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Sorry, we don't have any translation of it.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2178.0,2306.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40614/annotation/22","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"ALLEN GINSBERG: Yeah. But there's the long, long line. What is it? Twenty-eight syllables? Is that the longest? I've forgotten now.\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: That's very long. That's usually actually translation from the Sanskrit poetries same time.\r\n\r\n\r\nALLEN GINSBERG: What's the longest line natural in Tibetan? For instance--\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Naturally seven or eight--\r\n\r\n\r\nALLEN GINSBERG: Seven is the standard.\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: --nine. Yeah. Da da, da da, da da, da da, da.\r\n\r\n\r\nALLEN GINSBERG: Da da, da da, da da, da da, da?\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Yeah.\r\n\r\n\r\nALLEN GINSBERG: So you got that one extra for an emphasis at the end?\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Yeah. Obviously, yeah.\r\n\r\n\r\nALLEN GINSBERG: Is there a rise in voice -- are there tones? Tones--\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: You make a refer-- you make emphasis on the last.\r\n\r\n\r\nALLEN GINSBERG: Yeah.\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Or sometimes seven.\r\n\r\n\r\nALLEN GINSBERG: Mhmm. So there would be an upbeat.\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: da, da da, da da, *da*. Yeah.\r\n\r\n\r\nALLEN GINSBERG: Yeah. Are there also different pitches as in Chinese and Greek?\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Sort of. It's very hard--\r\n\r\n\r\nALLEN GINSBERG: It's not schematic?\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Yeah, not as much as Chinese, no.\r\n\r\n\r\nALLEN GINSBERG: Yeah.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2306.0,2364.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40614/annotation/23","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"[BOOKMARK: QUESTION 18]\r\n\r\n\r\nANNE WALDMAN: Also, I was going to ask about the puns. Are they sort of ordinary folk speech words, and then also dharma words? Is that the...\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Sometimes we have what's known as synonyms, which is comes from the Mahabharat text, and the Indian poetry that... Like sun, for instance, had something like twenty synonyms for sun. So poets use those synonyms instead of saying the real thing. Then you could develop puns out of those too, by using two synonyms together. One word for maybe for sun [INAUDIBLE] , another for moon. And using those as synonyms and also develops puns. And there is a particular type of poetry which is based on kind of... sort of -- what's the word for it? Sarcastic...\r\n\r\n\r\nALLEN GINSBERG: Satire.\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Satire, yeah. Which actually use more puns, because puns are more effective that way. And sometimes also encouragement, like encouragement of renunciation, devotion. You have another set of different kind of puns which are gentle and which makes you smile and so that it inspires you further. That the message doesn't become too heavy.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2364.0,2459.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40614/annotation/24","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"[BOOKMARK: QUESTION 19]\r\n\r\n\r\nALLEN GINSBERG: Tom Veitch is teaching. You got anything on your mind? Or Bobbie Louise [Hawkins] ?\r\n\r\n\r\nSPEAKER7: I was wondering, in Tibet if most of the poetry is--\r\n\r\n\r\nALLEN GINSBERG: Somebody take the microphone over, please.\r\n\r\n\r\nAUDIENCE: It's over there.\r\n\r\n\r\nALLEN GINSBERG: Oh.\r\n\r\n\r\nSPEAKER7: If in Tibet most of the poetry is accessible to everybody, or if it's written by upper class people for upper class people, or if it's all of the above. Is it written for the common man? Can everybody understand the poetry there?\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Well, anybody who can read.\r\n\r\n\r\nSPEAKER7: Who can read.\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Who can read, yes. Well we have problems with the peasant people who had never taught reading or writing at all. So sometimes they have proverbs that be handed down, which they use in their speech. Like if a peasant person comes to court case, and you have to learn a special language which is successive quotations, maybe every other sentence, you have images put together which is an art in itself. But at the written poetry, well it's just written for anybody who can read. There's no class of literature particularly. Once you have literature developed, it is just for anybody who can read.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2459.0,2553.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40614/annotation/25","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"[BOOKMARK: QUESTION 20]\r\n\r\n\r\nSPEAKER8: Hello. Do you complete your poetry in your mind before you write it or paint it, or do you... paint spontaneously?\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Well usually what happens is -- this also traditional one as well -- is that you have the very vivid sound ringing in your ear almost, in your mind of the first line is very vivid. That's the opener. And once you write down that then everything becomes unfolding from that. And I usually work that way.\r\n\r\n\r\nALLEN GINSBERG: That's pretty common, in American poetry too. The one line arrives--\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Yeah. One first line is very vivid, so that carries the whole thing. Although the topic might change in halfway through, but still some kind of energy is carried out.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2553.0,2601.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40614/annotation/26","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"[BOOKMARK: QUESTION 21]\r\n\r\n\r\nALLEN GINSBERG: Behind you.\r\n\r\n\r\nSPEAKER9: It occurred to me that the sadhana that you wrote and is recited at Karma Dzong [the Sadhana of Mahamudra] is a very good example of what we've been discussing of the form. And I wondered if that was accurate?\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: I think so. Well, we don't call it poetry because this is different class of literature altogether. But it could be regarded as that style. And when I wrote, it took about two days to finish the whole thing. And I wrote extremely fast and didn't get chance to think about it very much. And it's very spontaneous.\r\n\r\n\r\nSPEAKER9: And on the spot. This-- you wrote it in the Himalayas? Is that--\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: In Bhutan, yes.\r\n\r\n\r\nSPEAKER9: Wasn't in English. [Laughs]\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Tibetan. [Laughs]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2601.0,2667.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40614/annotation/27","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"[BOOKMARK: QUESTION 22]\r\n\r\n\r\nSPEAKER10: I'm still kind of unclear as the distinction you're making between vajrayana and mahayana poetry. Could you elaborate a little further please?\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Well, mahayana poetry is generally more connected with performance of one's deed according to the various bodhisattva paths and vow and commitment of that kind inspired by notion of compassion and development of loving kindness to oneself, and that kind of approach. In the vajrayana, it is much more immediate. A lot of the poetry in vajrayana poetry is written dedicated to their vajra master, and longing for the vajra master, and devotion to the vajra master. And also beyond that, personal experience of how that particular person had actually able to see the glimpse of enlightenment clearly, vividly. So poetry is that style.\r\n\r\n\r\nALLEN GINSBERG: And--\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Which is much more expressing the sense of magic exist in it, rather than just general conduct level which is mahayana approach.\r\n\r\n\r\nSPEAKER10: Mahayana is more for conduct than magic?\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Yes, it's almost similar to Christian hymns in some sense, you know, that kind of approach.\r\n\r\n\r\nALLEN GINSBERG: And the proclamation part is a-- is that--\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: A realization, yeah. Realization.\r\n\r\n\r\nALLEN GINSBERG: A realization. And the example is a realization.\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Yes, mhmm.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2667.0,2783.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40614/annotation/28","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"[BOOKMARK: QUESTION 23]\r\n\r\n\r\nALLEN GINSBERG: There's a hand there and a hand there. So will somebody pick up the microphone, please? Pass it on.\r\n\r\n\r\nSPEAKER11: In this class, Allen has been trying to make a connection with different styles of American and Western poetry in different stages on the Buddhist path, hinayana, mahayana, vajrayana, in different -- we've been dealing with different poets, American poets, from one of those points of view. I'd like to ask you if you think that there is a vajrayana American poetry; and if so, who might be doing it?\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Well it's very hard to say. Maybe Allen himself [laughs] is the closest one I suppose.\r\n\r\n\r\nALLEN GINSBERG: Yeah, to the extent that I've occasionally tried to express some experience of change or opening of mind in a poem, and trying to find a form which is clear enough for other people to understand. It would fit into the description given, [UNCLEAR: who were?] aware of it.\r\n\r\n\r\nSPEAKER11: Okay, what about the people that you're using, you're teaching, you're using as examples of vajrayana poetry? How do they fit into that?\r\n\r\n\r\nALLEN GINSBERG: Well at the seminary where I taught, where there were a lot of experienced sitters, as examples of vajrayana, there was some Blake, I used some of Rinpoche's poetry. And I also used Gregory Corso's \"Bomb\" from the point of view that in vajrayana there, as I understood it, there was a sort of alchemical transformation, or a transformation of poison to nectar of anxiety and fear to liberation and humor.\r\n\r\n\r\nSPEAKER11: Do you know that poem, Rinpoche? Excuse me.\r\n\r\n\r\nALLEN GINSBERG: And so I feel -- if you'll let me finish. I used the-- SPEAKER11: Do you know the poem?\r\n\r\n\r\nALLEN GINSBERG: Wait a minute! So I used the poem \"Bomb\" in -- do you know that? By Gregory [Corso]? There's a poem \"Bomb\" which says, \"Let me in Bomb rise from the pregnant-rat corner / of the world / O Bomb I love you / I want to kiss your clank eat your boom / You are an acme of scream / a lyric hat of Mister Thunder\" And I thought those lines were, at least, vajrayana style. Does that make sense?\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Style. [Laughter; laughs]\r\n\r\n\r\nALLEN GINSBERG: Actually to the extent that it took the impacted anxiety and moralistic psychology prevalent of the time and switched it around and opened it up. I thought actually-- if that's what vajrayana is, it did that job. And penetrated right through. See, Gregory and I went to Oxford, and he read the poem. And Bertrand Russell's group were very moralistic about the Bomb. Threw a shoe at him, thinking that he was a prick, thinking that--\r\n\r\n\r\nGREGORY CORSO: [INAUDIBLE WORDS] the shoe! [Laughter]\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: [Laughs]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2783.0,2980.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40614/annotation/29","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"[BOOKMARK: QUESTION 24]\r\n\r\n\r\nGREGORY CORSO: What comes after vajrayana?\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: What?\r\n\r\n\r\nALLEN GINSBERG: What comes after vajrayana?\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: [Laughs] Nothing.\r\n\r\n\r\nGREGORY CORSO: Nothing. [Laughter]\r\n\r\n\r\nALLEN GINSBERG: Could we pass the mic?\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: [Whispering] What time should we stop it?\r\n\r\n\r\nALLEN GINSBERG: [Whispering] Oh, my class was over half an hour ago.\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Mhmm.\r\n\r\n\r\nALLEN GINSBERG: The time, formal time. Okay. Sure, last question then.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2980.0,3013.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40614/annotation/30","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"[BOOKMARK: QUESTION 25]\r\n\r\n\r\nSPEAKER12: Rinpoche, could you explain the connection between poetry and right speech? Since right speech is one of the paths on the noble eightfold path?\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Well, I'm sure there are lot of connections. In fact, as we hear the stories of Buddha, when he gave a sermon to people, he was presented in such way that even though people had their psychological blockages, but they cannot help not listening to him. And once they begin to listen to him, begin to make sense to him--to them. And when it made sense to them, not helping liberating them. So I think this is our goal, in some sense, of poetics is to develop that kind of larger version of there has to have some kind of motivation as to how we going to at least to create order in the universe by means of speech, poetry. That seem to be our objectives, actually, altogether.\r\n\r\n\r\nALLEN GINSBERG: The American interpretation of that was precision in speech.\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Mhmm.\r\n\r\n\r\nALLEN GINSBERG: Being-- accuracy and precision. That if you are accurate to direct treatment of the object and accurate to your own frank mind, natural mind, then that would lead to some opening of awareness. So \"precision\" and \"accuracy\" are words you use in relation to perception.\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Mhmm, mhmm.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=3013.0,3118.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40614/annotation/31","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"[BOOKMARK: CLOSING REMARKS]\r\n\r\n\r\nALLEN GINSBERG: Well, thank you for coming.\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Well, thank you very much.\r\n\r\n\r\nALLEN GINSBERG: It was nice and calm.\r\n\r\n\r\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Well, I hope you can work, write. Better write good ones. [Laughter] Thank you.\r\n\r\n\r\nALLEN GINSBERG: Thank you.\r\n\r\n\r\n[Chogyam Trungpa Institute - Unedited Verbatim Transcript]\r\n\r\n\r\n[Copyright Diana J. Mukpo All Rights Reserved - Not to be Distributed or Reproduced]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=3118.0,3140.62367"}]},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615","type":"AnnotationPage","label":{"en":["19780811VCTR1-Captions [Transcript]"]},"items":[{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/32","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"CTI SLATE: This is the Venerable\nChogyam Trungpa Rinpoche,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=0.29,3.36"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/33","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Naropa Institute, Meditation\nand Poetics Class Discussion","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=3.36,8.89"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/34","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"with Allen Ginsberg\nand Chogyam Trungpa,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=8.89,13.05"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/35","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"recorded on August 11,\n1978 in Boulder, Colorado.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=13.05,17.67"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/36","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"This is a CTI auto-remaster\nmade October 2022.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=17.67,24.07"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/37","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"ALLEN GINSBERG:\n--poetry class.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=24.07,25.28"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/38","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"This is Bobby Myers,\nmy teaching assistant.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=25.28,28.06"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/39","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"This is Chogyam\nTrungpa Rinpoche,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=28.06,31.36"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/40","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Tibetan poet\nand meditation teacher.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=31.36,35.06"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/41","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And David Rome, here.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=36.85,39.95"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/42","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So, we were-- we had been\nreading a haiku today,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=40.86,46.61"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/43","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"both Japanese --\ntalking about space in haiku.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=46.61,52.04"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/44","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\"A wild sea, /","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=52.04,53.77"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/45","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And stretching across\nto the Isle of Sado, /","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=53.77,57.38"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/46","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"The Milky Way.\" [Basho]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=57.38,59.195"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/47","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And also some haiku in Kerouac.\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Mhmm.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=59.195,62.33"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/48","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"ALLEN GINSBERG: Then we\nwere reading some of\n[William] Blake,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=62.33,66.005"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/49","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"a long poem called\n\"Auguries of Innocence and","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=66.005,68.19"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/50","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Experience\"\n[sic: Auguries of Innocence],","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=68.19,70.51"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/51","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"in which he says\n\"We are led--\"","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=70.51,73.26"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/52","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Well, in which he says,\n\"To be in a Passion","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=73.26,76.73"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/53","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"you Good may Do /","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=76.73,78.6"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/54","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"But no Good if the Passion\nis in you.\"","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=78.6,83.07"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/55","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"That make sense?\n[Laughter]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=83.07,86.72"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/56","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And we were comparing that\nwith Jamgon Kongtrul’s\nDIRECT PATH TO ENLIGHTENMENT.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=86.72,91.42"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/57","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\nOh, my goodness!\n[Laughter]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=91.42,94.83"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/58","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"ALLEN GINSBERG: And I have been\ntalking about","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=94.83,100.54"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/59","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"hinayana, sitting,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=100.54,106.25"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/60","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and how that might lead\nto jumps of perception","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=106.25,111.17"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/61","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"from one thought to another\nand the spaces in between--\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Yeah.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=111.17,115.13"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/62","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"ALLEN GINSBERG:\n--which are like haikus.\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Mhmm.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=115.13,118.63"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/63","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"ALLEN GINSBERG:\nSo we can take off from there.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=119.6,122.13"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/64","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Do you have anything\non your mind?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=122.13,126.48"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/65","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\nWell, that's hard to say.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=126.48,130.86"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/66","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"We’ve been talking about\nthe notion of threefold logic.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=136.56,142.58"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/67","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Have you discussed that at all,\nin any sense?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=142.58,144.44"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/68","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"ALLEN GINSBERG: No, I haven’t,\nso that would be good to--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=144.44,146.02"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/69","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\nThreefold logic, yeah. Yeah.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=146.02,147.29"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/70","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So that might be interesting\nactually. Can you hear me?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=147.29,150.21"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/71","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"STUDENTS: No.\nYou need to move your mic close.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=150.21,152.94"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/72","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\nIs this -- oh yes, this is.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=152.94,155.16"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/73","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Can you hear me now?\n[Laughs]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=155.16,159.57"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/74","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"The notion of what’s called\n\"threefold logic\",","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=159.57,165.07"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/75","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"which applies\nto a general state of mind,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=165.07,169.21"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/76","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"how we experience\nour phenomenal world.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=169.21,174.14"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/77","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And obviously poetry\ncomes from expression","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=174.14,177.07"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/78","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"of one’s phenomenal world,\nin the written form.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=177.07,180.61"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/79","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"It could be either prose\nor poetry in form.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=180.61,186.31"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/80","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"It’s not so much\nfrom Buddhist point of view","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=186.91,189.25"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/81","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"is that you write good poetry,\nparticularly, but how you--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=189.25,194.6"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/82","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"your thought patterns\nbecome elegant.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=194.6,199.57"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/83","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"That you see phenomenal world\nas a process, stages,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=200.09,206.16"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/84","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"as a view\nfrom our state of mind.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=206.16,211.59"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/85","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"That first we have what’s known\nas the ground,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=211.59,217.58"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/86","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"which we perceive --","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=217.58,218.83"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/87","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"just general sense of idea\nhow things work, like bright.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=218.83,225.47"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/88","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And having seen the brightness,\nthen we","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=226.94,230.455"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/89","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"begin to have\nsome idea of it is sunshine.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=230.455,232.72"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/90","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And then, because\nof sense of brightness,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=232.72,235.43"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/91","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"then we experience\nsense of sunshine.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=235.43,239.46"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/92","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And having experienced\nthe second stage that way,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=239.46,242.37"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/93","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"then we have a conclusion,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=242.37,246.785"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/94","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"which is dispels darkness.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=246.785,251.2"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/95","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So those are the what's known\nas threefold logic,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=251.2,253.26"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/96","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"which actually does apply\nvery much to the haiku approach.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=253.26,258.33"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/97","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"That there is an idea,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=258.33,259.85"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/98","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and then there's a\ncomplementary remark with idea,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=259.85,266.39"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/99","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and then a final ending --","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=266.39,268.86"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/100","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"sometimes\nwhich is punctuated by humor,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=268.86,272.1"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/101","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"or sometimes\npunctuated by opinion,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=272.1,275.4"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/102","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"or could be just an open ending.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=275.4,279.71"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/103","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So that seem to be\nan interesting kind of training.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=279.71,283.39"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/104","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And seeing that how one thinks\nwhen you look at your world;","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=283.39,287.79"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/105","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"then just write that down.\nAnd by doing so,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=287.79,290.81"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/106","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"a person’s approach begin\nto become very methodical","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=290.81,293.87"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/107","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and nothing is jumpy,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=293.87,297.5"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/108","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and everything is somewhat\norganized in your mind.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=297.5,301.35"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/109","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And therefore it creates\nfurther chain reactions","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=301.35,304.26"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/110","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"probably to the readers\nof poetry as well,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=304.26,307.76"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/111","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"those who read your work.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=307.76,310.35"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/112","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Their thought patterns begin to\nhave some systematic situation,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=310.35,314.03"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/113","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"rather than just things\njumbled together.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=314.03,317.16"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/114","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And in turn, the theory is that\nhaving such approach,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=317.16,324.1"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/115","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"you develop...","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=324.1,326.74"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/116","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"you’re helping the world\nto destroy chaos,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=326.74,334.73"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/117","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and you create order\nin the universe.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=334.73,338.32"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/118","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"ALLEN GINSBERG:\nWell, in your thought process,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=338.32,347.53"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/119","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"do you systematically check out","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=347.53,351.74"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/120","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"what of previous thought\nwas ground or was flash;","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=351.74,357.83"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/121","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"what moment you made\nthe transition","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=357.83,360.48"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/122","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"to recognizing the conception\nof the flash, sun;","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=360.48,366.25"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/123","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and then what further\ndevelopment and comment is made?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=366.25,371.28"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/124","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"In other words,\ndo you constantly examine","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=371.28,372.91"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/125","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"your thought forms that way?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=372.91,374.4"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/126","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Or is it that when you have\na striking thought,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=374.4,376.19"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/127","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"then you try to analyze it\nin a--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=376.19,378.49"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/128","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"or you analyze it\nin that form,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=378.49,379.7"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/129","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"or find its structure\nin that form?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=379.7,381.89"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/130","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\nWell, it’s mostly","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=381.89,384.03"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/131","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"the thought patterns\nare free form thought patterns,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=384.03,387.17"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/132","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"which usually involves\nthe threefold process.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=387.17,391.05"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/133","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And what you do is then --","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=391.05,392.91"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/134","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"actually analyzing\nis not so much analyzing.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=392.91,395.4"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/135","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"ALLEN GINSBERG: As recognizing?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=395.4,396.62"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/136","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\nIt’s just another afterthought","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=396.62,398.37"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/137","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"of that thought process.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=398.37,401.56"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/138","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"ALLEN GINSBERG: Mhmm.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=401.56,403.93"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/139","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: So there's no\nscholarship involved,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=404.99,405.995"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/140","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"particularly. It's just--\nALLEN GINSBERG: Uh huh.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=405.995,408.82"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/141","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Well, by analyzing\nI just mean checking out--\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Yeah.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=408.82,410.42"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/142","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"ALLEN GINSBERG:\n--a further thought --","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=410.42,411.62"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/143","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\"Oh that was the flash.\nThat was the--\"","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=411.62,413.28"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/144","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\n[INAUDIBLE] . That was it.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=413.28,414.51"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/145","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"ALLEN GINSBERG: Yeah.\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Yeah.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=414.51,417.04"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/146","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"ALLEN GINSBERG: Do you ever\ncompose haikus consciously,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=417.04,419.06"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/147","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"using that as a method?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=419.06,420.41"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/148","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\nYou could, as training process.\nALLEN GINSBERG: Yeah.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=420.41,423.25"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/149","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\nAnd then slowly person","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=423.25,424.59"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/150","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"begin to gain more confidence\nin themselves,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=424.59,426.31"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/151","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"so they can actually flow.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=426.31,429.94"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/152","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"ALLEN GINSBERG:\nSo it’d be like driving.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=429.94,431.19"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/153","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"First you have to\nfigure out the gears.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=431.19,432.82"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/154","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\nYes. Mhmm, mhmm, mhmm.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=432.82,434.05"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/155","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"ALLEN GINSBERG: Do you actually\ntrain yourself","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=434.05,436.29"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/156","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"in checking out the triple--\nthe triad?And--did you?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=436.29,441.16"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/157","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\nIn some sense, yes,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=441.16,443.48"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/158","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I think you do.\nYou always do that.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=443.48,444.51"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/159","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And also connected\nwith the study of, like,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=444.51,449.39"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/160","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"madhyamaka\nor Buddhist philosophy.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=449.39,452.01"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/161","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"You have a case,\nand you have a case--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=452.01,454.9"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/162","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"a reference\ncoming out of that case,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=454.9,456.32"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/163","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and then you have\na final conclusion, you know.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=456.32,459.5"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/164","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"It’s always\na threefold process.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=459.5,462.43"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/165","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"ALLEN GINSBERG: Can you give\nan example of that --","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=462.43,464.6"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/166","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"case, reference,\nand conclusion?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=464.6,466.99"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/167","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\nWell, same thing as what\nwe been saying, like...","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=466.99,470.57"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/168","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"We could say\nthat the mind is empty,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=470.57,476.91"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/169","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"free from conceptions --","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=478.32,481.705"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/170","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"it is enlightenment.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=481.705,485.09"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/171","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"ALLEN GINSBERG:\nOkay.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=485.09,487.34"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/172","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"How would you\nmake a haiku of that?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=491.6,493.86"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/173","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"In other words-- no, I mean,\nwhat situation would give rise","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=493.86,496.71"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/174","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"to something substantial\n[UNCLEAR: over that?]\nrather than the abstraction?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=496.71,498.83"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/175","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Haiku?\nALLEN GINSBERG: Yeah.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=498.83,500.09"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/176","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\nWell, you could have--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=500.09,503.24"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/177","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"ALLEN GINSBERG: That that would\ncome automatically,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=503.24,504.7"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/178","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"but what--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=504.7,506.06"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/179","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Which one?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=506.06,507.44"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/180","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"ALLEN GINSBERG: A situation\nwhere you recognize your mind","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=507.44,509.67"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/181","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"was empty,\nfree from distraction--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=509.67,512.44"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/182","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Concept, yeah.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=512.44,513.72"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/183","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"ALLEN GINSBERG: Concept.\nThat’s enlightenment.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=513.72,516.1"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/184","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: That's--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=516.1,517.36"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/185","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"ALLEN GINSBERG:\nSo that would be, say, the...","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=517.36,520.55"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/186","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that would be\nthe basic structure","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=520.55,522.97"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/187","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"of almost all noticings.\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\nMhmm.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=522.97,526.17"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/188","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"That’s what we’re trying\nto say, yeah.\nALLEN GINSBERG: Yeah.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=526.17,528.71"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/189","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: That’s how\nwhole thing should work.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=528.71,531.78"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/190","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"There could have some discipline\ngoes with that, and--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=531.78,533.76"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/191","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"ALLEN GINSBERG:\nYeah, well that-- so that--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=533.76,535.57"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/192","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\n--training people.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=535.57,537.15"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/193","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"ALLEN GINSBERG:\nWell, would that be--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=537.15,538.73"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/194","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"would that involve\nsimple shamatha sitting,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=538.73,541.34"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/195","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"or a further application of it,\nor a special case?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=541.34,544.94"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/196","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\nI think shamatha sitting,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=544.94,546.26"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/197","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"as well as some sort\nof awareness,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=546.26,548.17"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/198","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"mindfulness of daily life.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=548.17,551.679"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/199","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"You know, that brings things\ninto a cohesive situation.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=551.679,557.36"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/200","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"ALLEN GINSBERG:\nWell, what you’re describing","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=557.36,558.65"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/201","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"is also a byproduct\nof shamatha, isn’t it?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=558.65,561.55"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/202","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\nYou could say that too, yeah.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=561.55,563.31"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/203","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\n[To David Rome]\nWhat you say?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=563.31,566.395"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/204","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Do you have anything to say?\nDAVID ROME: About shamatha?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=566.395,569.19"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/205","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\nNo, the whole thing.\n[Laughs]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=569.19,571.76"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/206","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"DAVID ROME: Well, that kind of\nthreefold process is--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=571.76,581.74"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/207","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"it's not a gimmick.\nIt’s a very basic pattern","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=581.74,587.7"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/208","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"by which perception occurs","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=587.7,590.98"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/209","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and also where\nthe creation occurs.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=590.98,593.02"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/210","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So your finished poem","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=593.02,595.32"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/211","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"might actually show\nthose three levels,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=595.32,599.17"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/212","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"or it might not\nall that specifically.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=599.17,601.66"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/213","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"But nevertheless the process\nwhich you went through","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=601.66,603.66"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/214","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"to create a poem must--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=603.66,607.58"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/215","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"it does anyhow follow\nthat kind of process.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=608.81,611.12"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/216","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"But the extent to which you’re\nsomewhat clear in following it","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=611.12,614.34"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/217","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"will affect the elegance\nor accuracy of the poem.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=614.34,618.83"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/218","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So you have some kind of first\nimpulse to express something.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=618.83,624.57"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/219","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And that impulse carries with it","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=624.57,626.07"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/220","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"some sense of the texture\nof what you want to express.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=626.07,630.27"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/221","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"In some cases, it’s the texture\nof a certain emotion.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=630.27,632.92"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/222","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"In some cases, particularly\nfor poets I imagine,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=632.92,636.06"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/223","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"it’s one detail\nthat has struck you.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=636.06,638.78"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/224","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And you feel that\nthere's something further","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=638.78,641.91"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/225","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that could be made of that,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=641.91,645.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/226","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"or presented from that,\nor even just trying to present","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=645.0,647.71"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/227","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that one detail involves\nsome further process.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=647.71,650.89"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/228","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So then you begin\nfleshing it out,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=650.89,652.84"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/229","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"so to speak, which is finding\nthe further reference","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=652.84,658.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/230","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"to that detail\nor that basic texture.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=658.0,661.57"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/231","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And that process contains\nopenness as well as narrowing,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=661.57,667.28"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/232","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"which I think is\nwhat becomes very important","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=667.28,669.95"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/233","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"about these three steps.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=669.95,671.71"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/234","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"They’re how to do something\nwithout having it","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=671.71,675.34"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/235","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"all figured out to begin with.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=675.34,677.35"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/236","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"But on the other hand,\nnot going off in every direction","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=677.35,679.83"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/237","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"so that you end up\npurely with chaos, a jungle.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=679.83,682.58"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/238","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So your middle stage is feeling\nthat texture further or drawing","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=682.58,685.93"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/239","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that detail out further,\nmaking new discoveries;","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=685.93,688.7"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/240","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"but also beginning\nto focus it down","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=688.7,690.62"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/241","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"towards some kind of single\nstatement, single message.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=690.62,695.34"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/242","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And that becomes\nthe third level,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=695.34,699.2"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/243","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"which could be contained\nin a great last line,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=699.2,703.2"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/244","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"or it might even be contained\nin the kind of space","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=703.2,705.11"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/245","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that’s left\nafter the poem is over.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=705.11,708.93"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/246","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And that there’s\nsome unified event","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=708.93,712.36"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/247","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"which has actually taken place.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=712.36,714.85"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/248","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"ALLEN GINSBERG:\nI wonder how that\nwould apply to the last haiku?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=714.85,718.285"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/249","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"But we don’t have--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=718.285,720.1"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/250","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"we’re doing this\nin English translation,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=720.1,721.86"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/251","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and it may be reversing\nthe order of the perceptions;","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=721.86,724.82"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/252","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"but it was \"A wild sea, /","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=724.82,727.605"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/253","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And stretching across\nto the isle of Sado, /","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=727.605,732.555"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/254","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"The Milky Way.\"","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=732.555,734.72"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/255","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: I think that\nhangs together still--\nALLEN GINSBERG: Yeah.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=734.72,737.3"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/256","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\n--very much so.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=737.3,738.5"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/257","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"ALLEN GINSBERG:\nIn relation to that structure","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=738.5,739.73"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/258","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"somewhat, actually.\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Yeah.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=739.73,740.95"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/259","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"ALLEN GINSBERG: The \"wild sea\"\nis the first flash.\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Mhmm.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=740.95,744.55"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/260","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"ALLEN GINSBERG:\nWell actually you’d have the sea","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=746.01,747.33"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/261","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and then the heaven.[Laughs]\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Yeah.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=747.33,751.31"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/262","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"ALLEN GINSBERG: Reversed, maybe?\n[Laughs]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=751.31,752.54"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/263","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\nWell, you have--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=752.54,753.75"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/264","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"ALLEN GINSBERG: Is it?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=753.75,755.2"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/265","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\n--a sense of waterness.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=755.2,756.42"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/266","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And then--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=756.42,758.34"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/267","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"ALLEN GINSBERG:\nYeah, the engulfing water.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=758.34,759.69"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/268","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\nYeah, and then sense","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=759.69,760.93"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/269","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"of nostalgia,\nthe island--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=760.93,763.48"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/270","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"ALLEN GINSBERG: Yeah.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=763.48,764.81"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/271","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\n--and sort of dwelling place.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=764.81,766.24"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/272","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And then finally, so what?\nYou know, Milky Way.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=766.24,769.45"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/273","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"ALLEN GINSBERG:\nWell, it is actually","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=769.45,770.65"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/274","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\"And stretching across\nto the isle of Sado,\"","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=770.65,772.88"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/275","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"so you get enormous space\nall of a sudden.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=772.88,776.04"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/276","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\nYeah, sure, yeah.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=776.04,777.24"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/277","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"ALLEN GINSBERG: Whether Sado\nis visible, we don’t know,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=777.24,778.78"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/278","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"but \"Stretching to the isle\nof Sado, / The Milky Way.\"","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=778.78,781.86"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/279","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Then he recognizes it\nin a comment","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=781.86,784.09"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/280","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"or conception with a name.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=784.09,786.12"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/281","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\nSomething slightly moved","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=786.12,788.84"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/282","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"from the water on the island.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=788.84,791.82"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/283","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"ALLEN GINSBERG: Do you know\nthat book of haikus by","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=791.82,792.54"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/284","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"R. H. Blyth\n[Reginald Horace Blyth] at all?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=792.54,794.46"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/285","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\nVery much so, yeah.\nALLEN GINSBERG: Yeah.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=794.46,796.97"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/286","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Do you have\nany favorites from that?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=796.97,798.29"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/287","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\nWell a lot of them, actually --","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=798.29,799.69"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/288","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"[laughing]\nin fact, all of them.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=799.69,801.22"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/289","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"ALLEN GINSBERG:\nYeah. We were--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=801.22,802.43"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/290","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I read about a hundred of them\nthe other day,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=802.43,804.77"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/291","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"here,\nmust have been.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=804.77,806.83"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/292","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"There were a couple\nthat I liked that was...","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=806.83,810.43"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/293","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\"Not a single stone /\nTo throw at the dog, /","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=812.21,814.96"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/294","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"The wintry moon.\"\n[Author Sumi Taigi]\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Mhmm.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=814.96,818.71"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/295","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"ALLEN GINSBERG:\nWhich was actually--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=818.71,820.55"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/296","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"first flash\nthere was anger, want--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=820.55,822.85"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/297","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"you know, wanting to grab\na stone to throw at the dog.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=822.85,825.7"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/298","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And then frustration at that\nbecause of the frozen grounds.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=825.7,829.29"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/299","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And then, at recognizing\nthe frozen situation,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=829.29,833.88"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/300","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"seeing the moon,\nwhich was irrelevant in a sense","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=833.88,836.15"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/301","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"but related\nto the cold frozenness.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=836.15,840.52"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/302","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"The moon being a comment\non his anger,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=840.52,842.3"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/303","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"or a sudden opening up--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=842.3,843.52"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/304","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\nYeah, sense of cooling.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=843.52,844.72"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/305","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"ALLEN GINSBERG:\n--or distraction from it.\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Yeah, yeah.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=844.72,851.26"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/306","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"ALLEN GINSBERG:\nShall we open it up to--\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Sure, yes.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=851.26,854.25"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/307","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"ALLEN GINSBERG:\nAnybody got any questions","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=854.25,855.87"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/308","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"on the nature\nof perception and conception?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=855.87,859.05"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/309","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\nBig subject, hmm?\n[Laughs]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=859.05,861.83"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/310","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"ALLEN GINSBERG: Actually,\nwe got into a big -- go on.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=861.83,863.3"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/311","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER1: I have a question--\nSPEAKER2: Please use the mic.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=863.3,866.11"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/312","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER1:\nOh, yeah.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=866.11,869.62"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/313","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"My question is,\nif the mind--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=869.62,873.65"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/314","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"[unknown gesture or incident]\n[Laughter]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=873.65,875.62"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/315","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"ALLEN GINSBERG: You’re blocking\nhis view from the camera.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=875.62,877.87"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/316","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER1: If the mind desires\nto work on a poem,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=877.87,881.08"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/317","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"or if the mind desires\nto think about a poem","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=881.08,883.26"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/318","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"or think about something\nwhich you have done that day","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=883.26,886.25"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/319","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"or that you will want to do,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=886.25,888.78"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/320","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"why in meditation will you\ninterrupt your thought patterns,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=888.78,893.39"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/321","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"stopping the mind from doing\nwhat the mind wants to do?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=893.39,897.08"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/322","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So the question is--\nin other words,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=897.08,901.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/323","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"what’s the purpose\nof meditation?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=901.0,903.04"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/324","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Why not let the mind\ndo what the mind wants to do,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=903.04,905.99"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/325","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"what the mind\nis inclined to do?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=905.99,910.13"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/326","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\nWell, you could have","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=913.64,916.27"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/327","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"all sorts\nof possibilities there,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=916.27,920.18"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/328","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"the mind wanted to do\nall sorts of things.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=920.18,923.43"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/329","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"But in lot of cases,\nyou don’t achieve them,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=923.43,927.21"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/330","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"so mind becomes frustrated.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=927.21,930.44"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/331","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And once you begin to feel\nthat you have freedom to think","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=930.44,933.61"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/332","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"whatever you want to think\nand do whatever you want to do,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=933.61,936.9"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/333","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"but then you realize\nthat you can’t do it,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=936.9,938.44"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/334","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"so you end up\nin square one once more.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=938.44,941.51"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/335","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So therefore, meditation\npractice is to realize","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=941.51,944.74"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/336","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that such ambition\ncannot be achieved.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=944.74,950.18"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/337","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So that you have\nsome kind of perspective","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=950.18,955.17"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/338","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and some sense of relaxation.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=955.17,958.29"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/339","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So that the meditation practice\ncuts through the speed of it,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=958.29,962.26"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/340","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"or the tremendous\nambition of it,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=962.26,964.31"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/341","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"which is self-destructive\ngenerally.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=964.31,968.73"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/342","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So the meditation\nsort of calms down","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=968.73,971.17"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/343","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and provides some perspective.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=971.17,974.47"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/344","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER1: Thanks.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=975.41,977.2"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/345","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"ALLEN GINSBERG: I had a sort of\nchauvinistic answer to that,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=977.2,979.36"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/346","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"which was that for\nthe purposes of poetry,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=979.36,982.72"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/347","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"if by returning to the breath","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=982.72,985.27"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/348","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"you interrupt\nthe speed of thought,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=985.27,988.03"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/349","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"you also get by hindsight\na profile of the thought","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=988.03,990.94"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/350","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that just disappeared.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=990.94,994.63"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/351","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER1: Yeah, but you also\nstop the thought from--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=994.63,996.94"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/352","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"before it develops.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=996.94,998.23"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/353","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I mean, like, you might\nbegin with a vague idea","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=998.23,1000.8"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/354","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and you say\n\"that’s just a thought.\"","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1000.8,1002.35"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/355","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And when you say that,\nsome other thought will rise,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1002.35,1005.17"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/356","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"rather than that original\nthought progressing","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1005.17,1008.12"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/357","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and developing","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1008.12,1009.43"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/358","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and working it out to some\nconclusion which is of value","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1009.43,1014.15"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/359","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and which you can remember,\nyou know.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1014.15,1016.5"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/360","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"ALLEN GINSBERG:\nI’ve always found\nthat I couldn’t remember","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1016.5,1019.15"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/361","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"a chain of fifty thoughts;\n[laughs]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1019.15,1021.79"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/362","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I can only remember\nthe last three.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1021.79,1024.84"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/363","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Which is why it’s useful\nto stop --","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1025.91,1027.22"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/364","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"like waking from a dream,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1027.22,1028.93"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/365","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"literally waking up\nfrom a dream.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1028.93,1030.44"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/366","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"If you continue sleeping\nand dreaming,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1030.44,1032.6"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/367","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"you’ll lose the last dreams --","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1032.6,1034.4"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/368","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"if you were wanting\nto capture dreams,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1034.4,1036.31"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/369","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"if you wanted to use them.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1036.31,1038.4"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/370","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So, like, waking up from a\ndream, you can remember it.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1038.4,1041.1"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/371","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"But if you continue dreaming,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1041.1,1042.43"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/372","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"it gets lost in the womb\nof dreams -- they disappear.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1042.43,1050.1"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/373","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Just from a chauvinistic\npoint of view,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1051.81,1053.76"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/374","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"poet-chauvinistic point of view,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1053.76,1055.14"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/375","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"there's some advantage\nto waking up from daydreams.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1055.14,1058.02"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/376","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Does that make sense?\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: I think so.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1058.02,1060.53"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/377","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"ALLEN GINSBERG:\nIf you’re looking for advantage.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1060.53,1061.79"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/378","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: [Laughs]\nSPEAKER1: I’m not sure.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1061.79,1069.8"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/379","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"ALLEN GINSBERG: I think Kirpal\nhad his hand up first.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1069.8,1073.04"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/380","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"[note, it is not Kirpal Gordon\nwho speaks next]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1073.04,1079.29"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/381","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER2:\nAllen, you described Blake","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1079.29,1081.12"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/382","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"as a vajrayana poet.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1081.12,1082.95"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/383","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I can imagine, here at Christmas\ntime, Santa Claus over here,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1082.95,1088.37"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/384","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and that he’s a wino,\nan alcoholic.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1088.37,1091.25"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/385","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And a father and a son\nare walking towards him,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1091.25,1094.15"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/386","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and the son sees a nice old man\nwho gives presents,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1094.15,1097.23"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/387","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and the father recognizes\nimmediately that","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1097.23,1099.31"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/388","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"it’s an old wino who's picking\nup a little seasonal work.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1099.31,1103.11"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/389","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And... now you have\ntwo perceptions here.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1103.11,1106.26"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/390","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And in Blake’s system, one is\nthe perception of innocence","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1106.26,1109.1"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/391","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and the other is\nthe perception of experience.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1109.1,1114.94"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/392","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Now in these sequences\nof perceptions","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1114.94,1117.94"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/393","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that the poet sees\nall at once --","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1117.94,1119.72"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/394","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that is, the poet Blake --","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1119.72,1121.22"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/395","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"there's a revolutionary\ncondition arises out of this.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1121.22,1124.6"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/396","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Now, how would vajrayana poetics\ndeal with this problem","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1124.6,1128.81"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/397","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"in terms of actual Blake","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1128.81,1130.67"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/398","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"who would immediately perceive\na revolutionary situation here?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1130.67,1133.26"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/399","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"That is, he would see the man\nand what was laid on him","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1133.26,1136.49"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/400","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and how he became a wino.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1136.49,1137.91"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/401","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"The father would also see back\nthrough the man to his son","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1137.91,1142.44"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/402","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"as perhaps becoming a wino.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1142.44,1144.27"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/403","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"That is, the end\nof the son’s journey","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1144.27,1146.47"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/404","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"could also be this old\nChristmastime wino.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1146.47,1150.86"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/405","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"ALLEN GINSBERG:\nWell, Blake has the answer here:","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1150.86,1153.07"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/406","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\"The Childs Toys and the\nOld Mans Reasons /","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1153.07,1156.015"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/407","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Are the Fruits of\n(the) Two seasons.\"\n[\"Auguries of Innocence\"]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1156.015,1159.9"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/408","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"[Trungpa Rinpoche laughs]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1159.9,1161.93"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/409","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER2: Okay.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1161.93,1163.25"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/410","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"ALLEN GINSBERG:\nIt’s built into the poem.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1163.25,1166.76"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/411","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I mean, he says--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1166.76,1170.52"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/412","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"he treated\nthat particular problem","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1170.52,1173.12"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/413","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"directly there, I thought.\nOr it’s same thing as \"One for--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1173.12,1179.07"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/414","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"One Law for the Lion\nand Ox is Oppression.\"\n[\"Marriage of Heaven and Hell\"]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1179.07,1184.17"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/415","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"That is, they are\nsimply different--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1184.17,1185.97"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/416","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"completely themselves\nbut completely different,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1185.97,1189.25"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/417","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"so to speak,\nunborn beings,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1189.25,1191.78"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/418","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"[UNCLEAR: but?]\ncompletely there.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1191.78,1194.7"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/419","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER2:\nBut Blake would also con--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1194.7,1196.08"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/420","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"he would also manipulate\nthe whole process of perceptions","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1196.08,1199.32"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/421","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"as a sequence\nof perceptions.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1199.32,1201.17"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/422","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I mean, he doesn’t only work\nwith these little auguries,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1201.17,1205.38"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/423","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"with these little\naphoristic structures.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1205.38,1207.55"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/424","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"He works with whole\nparagraph structures,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1207.55,1209.55"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/425","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"which give you\nsequences of perceptions.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1209.55,1212.17"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/426","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And then it would\nseem to me that,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1212.17,1214.38"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/427","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"exactly in the sense\nof his [SPEAKER1's]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1214.38,1215.83"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/428","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"question, that the process\nof thought","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1215.83,1218.67"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/429","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"could be broken\nthen by meditation.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1218.67,1222.02"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/430","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"ALLEN GINSBERG:\nIt'll arise again.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1222.02,1223.44"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/431","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"[Laughs] I don’t think\nyou have to worry about it.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1223.44,1226.92"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/432","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"ALLEN GINSBERG: I think Kirpal\nhad his hand up first.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1226.92,1230.64"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/433","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"KIRPAL GORDON:\nI don’t know your name?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1231.71,1233.96"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/434","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"ALLEN GINSBERG: David Rome.\nKIRPAL GORDON: David--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1233.96,1236.47"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/435","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"ALLEN GINSBERG:\nKirpal Singh Gordon.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1236.47,1237.78"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/436","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"KIRPAL GORDON: I couldn’t--\nI followed what you were saying.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1237.78,1239.54"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/437","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I couldn’t follow your\ndescription of the process well;","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1239.54,1243.08"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/438","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"but if you were fleshing out\nwhat Trungpa said,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1243.08,1248.83"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/439","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"well then I got it.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1248.83,1250.14"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/440","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And as you described\nthat process --","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1250.14,1254.2"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/441","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I don’t know if this\nis going on or not --","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1254.2,1255.81"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/442","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"but if--\nas you described the process,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1255.81,1258.17"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/443","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that sounds like what most of\nthe good poets do that I know.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1258.17,1263.98"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/444","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And most of the good poets\nI know don’t have anything to do","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1263.98,1266.98"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/445","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"with meditation\nin any formal sense.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1266.98,1270.58"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/446","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So, could you address\nwhat you said in terms","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1270.58,1272.99"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/447","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"of how it might relate\nto a practice?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1272.99,1275.5"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/448","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"DAVID ROME: [INAUDIBLE]\n[UNCLEAR: is this supposed to\nbe?] ?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1275.5,1279.888"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/449","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"KIRPAL GORDON: It's supposed to\nhave a connection between those.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1280.182,1283.91"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/450","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So how does meditation--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1283.91,1285.3"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/451","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"what does meditation\ndo in terms of that?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1285.3,1287.54"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/452","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I mean, if that’s already\na natural process for an artist?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1287.54,1291.39"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/453","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"DAVID ROME:\nWell meditation is...\nbasically-- [laughter]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1291.39,1297.41"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/454","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"It's basically\nto clean up your mind,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1298.317,1301.032"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/455","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"which is the same thing that\nwe’ve all been talking about,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1301.032,1303.95"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/456","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that-- in terms\nof that other question.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1303.95,1307.92"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/457","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"If just letting the mind\ndo what it wants to do","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1307.92,1312.04"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/458","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"was in itself a perfect\n[INAUDIBLE] ,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1312.04,1316.58"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/459","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"then everyone would be\na perfectly great poet --","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1316.58,1321.54"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/460","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"which I suppose,\nsome people would say that,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1321.54,1323.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/461","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"but that's not really the point.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1323.0,1325.33"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/462","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"In fact, there's very few--\nit's kind of like the Buddha,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1325.33,1329.5"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/463","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I suppose, he was the only one\nwho got enlightened","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1329.5,1332.3"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/464","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"without having a teacher.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1332.3,1335.1"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/465","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"KIRPAL GORDON:\nSo then the artistic discipline","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1335.76,1337.29"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/466","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"is the same\nas the spiritual discipline?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1337.29,1342.55"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/467","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"DAVID ROME:\nThat’s just basic human-ness.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1342.55,1344.25"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/468","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"It's basic discipline.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1344.25,1346.64"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/469","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Then out of that,\nyou can be an artist,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1346.64,1349.04"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/470","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"you can be a businessman,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1349.04,1350.75"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/471","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"you could be whatever\nyou might be.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1350.75,1354.89"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/472","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"The purpose of meditation\nis not to produce good poets.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1358.53,1363.852"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/473","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"ALLEN GINSBERG:\nThe corollaryis to produce","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1363.852,1368.09"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/474","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"lucidity or clarity.\nDAVID ROME: Sure.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1368.09,1370.82"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/475","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"ALLEN GINSBERG: Which could be\napplied to business or poetry --","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1370.82,1374.57"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/476","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"or any gesture.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1374.57,1377.22"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/477","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Though I’d say since poetry\ndeals with mind-stuff,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1380.94,1385.11"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/478","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"language-- language mind-stuff,\nthat the constant observation,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1385.11,1391.02"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/479","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and constant mindfulness\nof mind-stuff","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1391.02,1395.04"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/480","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"would be directly--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1395.04,1397.23"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/481","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"in meditation would directly\nrelate very fast to poetry --","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1397.23,1401.04"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/482","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"maybe to business but I haven’t\nhad that much experience,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1401.04,1403.31"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/483","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"but it would relate\nto business intuition probably.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1403.31,1406.95"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/484","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"KIRPAL GORDON: Yeah, but as\nI understand that process,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1406.95,1410.5"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/485","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that is ongoing.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1410.5,1411.86"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/486","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Whatever is-- whatever\nwe're calling meditation","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1411.86,1414.79"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/487","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"is part of the process\nof doing art.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1414.79,1419.89"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/488","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"If you enter into\nan artistic discipline,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1419.89,1421.61"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/489","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"then you’re already involved\nin a meditation of sorts.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1421.61,1425.07"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/490","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"ALLEN GINSBERG: To the extent\nthat it involves awareness","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1425.07,1427.72"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/491","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"of what’s going on\nin your mind,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1427.72,1430.01"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/492","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and looking at it\nfrom the outside","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1430.01,1431.76"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/493","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"rather than being caught in it\nall the time.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1431.76,1435.41"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/494","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"But some art\ndoesn’t do that.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1435.41,1436.74"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/495","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Some art, it takes--\ndoes not draw back and see.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1436.74,1443.27"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/496","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"That’s why they had\nthe Objectivist school","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1443.27,1445.88"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/497","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"in the twentieth century\nthat had to point out","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1445.88,1447.6"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/498","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that what was going on\nin the mind was furniture,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1447.6,1449.89"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/499","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"was a thing or things,\njust like external objects.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1449.89,1454.29"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/500","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Before that,\npeople thought that--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1454.29,1457.77"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/501","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"were more attached\nto their thoughts,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1457.77,1459.59"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/502","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and wrote poems\n*just* out of thoughts,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1459.59,1461.92"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/503","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"without realizing\nthat thoughts were","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1461.92,1463.61"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/504","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"just things\nlike tables and chairs,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1463.61,1467.71"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/505","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"as per the exposition--\nor explanation of Objectivism","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1469.24,1472.33"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/506","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"in American poetry\nin the twenties","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1472.33,1474.37"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/507","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that I was talking about\na couple of weeks ago.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1474.37,1478.27"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/508","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"There was a school\nof American poets","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1480.06,1481.88"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/509","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"in the twenties\ncalled Objectivists --","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1481.88,1485.3"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/510","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"followers of\n[William Carlos] Williams,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1485.3,1488.024"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/511","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"friends of Williams\nwho was well-grounded --","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1488.024,1491.03"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/512","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"who pointed out that\ntheir thoughts were objects,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1491.03,1495.28"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/513","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and if treated as objects,\ncould be included in the poems.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1495.28,1499.86"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/514","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"As distinct from Williams\nand [Ezra] Pound","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1499.86,1502.431"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/515","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"who originally tried\nto banish internal thoughts","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1502.431,1504.66"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/516","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"as just being\nsubjective rambling.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1504.66,1508.46"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/517","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"That make sense?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1508.46,1511.08"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/518","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER3: If not meditation,\nwhat was the process","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1513.972,1519.44"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/519","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that Williams used to get\nwhere he got,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1519.44,1521.55"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/520","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"or to get the kind of\nhaiku-ishness that he got?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1521.55,1525.3"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/521","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I mean, he didn’t do sitting\nmeditation,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1525.3,1526.935"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/522","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I don’t think.\nALLEN GINSBERG: I think he did--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1528.642,1530.504"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/523","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER3: Well, I've never read\nthat he did it literally anyway,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1530.504,1532.18"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/524","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"or any particular method.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1532.18,1534.01"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/525","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"ALLEN GINSBERG: He set\nhimself to","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1534.01,1537.926"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/526","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"paying very close,\ncareful attention","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1537.926,1540.53"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/527","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"to what was around him.\nThat was his whole point --","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1540.53,1545.06"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/528","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"to start listening to the\nlanguage he heard around him,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1545.06,1548.31"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/529","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and observing things\nthat his eye saw","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1548.31,1551.99"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/530","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and looking very carefully,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1551.99,1553.3"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/531","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and sort as if he,\nby a sort of an...","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1553.3,1558.95"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/532","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"attentiveness or mindfulness\nto the actual world around.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1558.95,1564.63"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/533","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"That’s why he arrived\nat a point of saying,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1564.63,1566.98"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/534","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\"I have had my dreams --\nlike other men\" --","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1566.98,1569.17"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/535","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"probably suffering brought it.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1569.17,1570.5"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/536","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\"I have had my dreams --\nlike other men -- /","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1570.5,1572.74"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/537","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"But it has come to nothing,\nso that /","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1572.74,1574.892"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/538","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I-- now I stand here with\nmy feet on the ground, /\nLooking up at the sky -- /","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1574.892,1578.39"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/539","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Feeling the weight of my body\nand my shoes, /","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1578.39,1581.355"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/540","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Clothes hanging on my--\ncoat hanging on my shoulder, /","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1581.355,1584.06"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/541","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Brim of the hat\nbefore me,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1584.06,1586.29"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/542","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"breath passing in and out /","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1586.29,1587.36"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/543","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"At my nose--\nor, air passing in and out /\nOf my nose --","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1587.36,1590.905"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/544","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and resolve to dream no more.\"\n[\"Thursday\" by William Carlos\nWilliams]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1590.905,1594.4"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/545","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Sort of a small case\nof a self-born Buddha,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1594.4,1599.35"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/546","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"in a sense of that\nkind of waking up.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1599.35,1603.08"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/547","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"But his discipline\nwas close attentiveness --","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1603.08,1606.08"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/548","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"so a kind of meditation\nin action.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1606.08,1607.87"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/549","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Does that make sense?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1607.87,1610.998"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/550","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"You know that poem?\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: No.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1610.998,1613.35"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/551","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"ALLEN GINSBERG:\n[INAUDIBLE]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1613.35,1614.63"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/552","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Did you hear it?\nYeah, I thought-- I use that--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1614.63,1617.41"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/553","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I’ve been using that as sort of\nthe intersection point","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1617.41,1620.23"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/554","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"between American poetry\nand meditative practice --","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1620.23,1623.63"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/555","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"1923.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1623.63,1626.68"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/556","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Get the--\n[UNCLEAR: Kensay?] , can you\nbring the microphone over?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1632.63,1637.608"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/557","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"[GAP IN AUDIO]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1637.608,1639.859"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/558","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER4: In PATERSON, he says,\n\"Why talk about the 'I',","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1639.859,1643.54"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/559","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"which interests me /\nnot at all?\"","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1643.54,1645.39"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/560","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And he goes on\nto describe other things.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1645.39,1647.8"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/561","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"He wasn't interested\nin describing himself","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1647.8,1650.44"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/562","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"as in a personal history.\nSo in that sense, he wasn't--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1650.44,1654.3"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/563","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"there wasn't that sort of\nobsession locked inside;","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1654.3,1656.62"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/564","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"he was always pushing it out.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1656.62,1658.1"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/565","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"ALLEN GINSBERG:\nThe flower turning","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1658.1,1660.235"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/566","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"to the outside to look.\nSPEAKER4: Yeah.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1660.235,1663.633"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/567","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"ALLEN GINSBERG:\nYou had a-- Richard Roth.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1664.96,1669.1"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/568","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"RICHARD ROTH: I’d like to ask\nRinpoche a question.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1675.724,1677.74"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/569","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Allen’s been dividing\npoetics up","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1677.74,1679.945"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/570","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"into hinayana, mahayana,\nand vajrayana.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1679.945,1682.31"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/571","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"The first two\nare a little easier","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1682.31,1683.72"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/572","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"to understand\nthan the last one.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1683.72,1685.01"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/573","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I was wondering\nif you could say something","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1685.01,1686.44"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/574","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"about what vajrayana poetics\nwould be, or is?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1686.44,1691.79"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/575","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Well, we have\na lot of examples of that,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1691.79,1695.26"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/576","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"such as like THE HUNDRED\nTHOUSAND SONGS OF MILAREPA.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1695.26,1700.937"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/577","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Have you read them? That’s it.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1700.937,1704.53"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/578","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And THE ROYAL SONG\nOF SARAHA.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1705.17,1707.97"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/579","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And as far as\nmahayana poetics concerned,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1707.97,1711.49"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/580","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"such as like\nthe BODHICHARYAVATARA;","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1711.49,1716.4"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/581","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"the translation\nis called","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1716.4,1719.8"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/582","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"ENTERING\nTHE PATH OF ENLIGHTENMENT.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1719.8,1723.25"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/583","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I think the general qualities\nof vajrayana poetics,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1723.25,1725.59"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/584","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"you have two types\nof situations.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1725.59,1727.73"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/585","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"One is proclamation\nof personal experiences;","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1727.73,1733.38"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/586","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and the second one\nis inspiration","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1733.38,1736.68"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/587","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and devotional level.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1736.68,1738.72"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/588","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So we could say\nthat the first phase","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1738.72,1741.98"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/589","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"is the devotional level\nof like Milarepa’s songs","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1741.98,1745.04"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/590","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"yearning for his teacher,\nand towards the end of his life.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1745.04,1748.49"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/591","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And also some of the writings\nof Padmasambhava,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1748.49,1751.07"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/592","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"you find they are\njust proclamation.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1751.07,1753.64"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/593","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And in fact,\nthe idea of vajrayana poetics","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1753.64,1756.76"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/594","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"is once you heard,\nonce you read,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1756.76,1759.21"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/595","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"it’s supposed to have a direct\neffect on your state of mind","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1759.21,1761.92"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/596","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"so that your conceptual patterns\nof mind could be cut through.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1761.92,1766.49"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/597","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"It’s sort of like mantra\nin some sense.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1766.49,1770.45"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/598","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"ALLEN GINSBERG: Can you give\nan example of a line like that,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1770.45,1774.23"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/599","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"of that quality,\nthat cuts through instantly?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1774.23,1777.09"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/600","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Well, I don’t\nremember any translations.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1777.09,1780.05"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/601","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"ALLEN GINSBERG:\nWell, what’s the one","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1780.05,1781.32"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/602","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that most ever struck you?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1781.32,1783.88"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/603","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\nI think all of them, actually.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1783.88,1786.52"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/604","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"ALLEN GINSBERG:\nWhat was the first?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1786.52,1788.2"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/605","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\nWell, [laughter; laughs]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1788.2,1792.1"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/606","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I think all of them.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1792.1,1793.45"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/607","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"[UNCLEAR: Who was the? Most?]\nfirst?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1793.45,1795.77"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/608","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"ALLEN GINSBERG: Temporally.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1795.77,1796.98"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/609","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\nUmm...","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1796.98,1799.1"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/610","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"It’s like...\nhow does it go?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1800.79,1806.34"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/611","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\"Mikyo Dorje fills\nthe whole of space.\"","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1806.34,1808.1"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/612","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Do you remember that,\nin English translation?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1808.1,1809.68"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/613","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"DAVID ROME:\n\"AH! Mikyo Dorje fills\nthe whole of space.\"","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1809.68,1812.64"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/614","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\nCan you say it?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1812.64,1813.86"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/615","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"DAVID ROME:\nWell, I don't remember it.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1813.86,1815.09"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/616","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\nYou remember it?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1815.09,1816.31"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/617","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"DAVID ROME:\n\"AH!--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1816.31,1817.53"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/618","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"ALLEN GINSBERG: \"Mikyo Dorje\nfills the whole of space.\"","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1817.53,1818.85"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/619","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"DAVID ROME: \"Mikyo Dorje fills\nthe whole of space.\"","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1818.85,1821.72"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/620","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER5: Is that from\nthe Sadhana [of Mahamudra]?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1821.72,1823.27"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/621","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"ALLEN GINSBERG:\n\"Mik-yo Dor-je fills","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1823.27,1825.62"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/622","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"the whole of space.\"","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1825.62,1828.69"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/623","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: And...","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1828.69,1830.93"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/624","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"ALLEN GINSBERG: Some equivalent\nline of Blake would be","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1832.7,1834.23"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/625","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\"One thought fills immensity.\"\n[\"Marriage of Heaven and Hell\"]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1834.23,1836.73"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/626","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\nMhmm.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1836.73,1839.981"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/627","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I suppose we could say\nthat any kind of sadhana reading","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1845.179,1849.83"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/628","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"would be connected\nto that situation, too.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1849.83,1851.59"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/629","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"ALLEN GINSBERG: Mhmm.\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Yeah.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1851.59,1854.85"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/630","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"ALLEN GINSBERG:\nThe sadhana?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1855.78,1856.98"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/631","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Can you explain that, David,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1856.98,1858.25"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/632","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"for those who are not\nexperienced practitioners?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1858.25,1861.87"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/633","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"DAVID ROME:\nSadhana is a vajrayana liturgy,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1861.87,1866.28"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/634","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"which is actually a...","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1869.1,1870.31"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/635","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"the liturgy itself\nis literature,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1870.31,1874.69"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/636","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"is a guideline for going through\ndifferent stages of perception","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1874.69,1879.99"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/637","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and identification with energies\nand aspects of reality.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1879.99,1886.52"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/638","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Which is, I suppose,\nwhat the vajrayana poem","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1886.52,1889.88"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/639","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"would be as well\nin any case.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1889.88,1893.01"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/640","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"ALLEN GINSBERG:\nI’ve been talking a lot","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1896.2,1898.15"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/641","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"about the space between thoughts\nin haiku or in poetry.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1898.15,1904.55"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/642","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"What role does that kind of\na jump between thoughts,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1905.82,1910.13"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/643","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"or gap between thoughts,\nplay in meditation,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1910.13,1913.65"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/644","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and what does it play\nin poetry?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1913.65,1916.18"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/645","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"As you know-- see, we don’t know\nMilarepa in En-- in original.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1916.18,1921.66"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/646","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And in English it’s flat.\nThe swiftness of mind is--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1921.66,1926.48"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/647","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"it isn’t as--\nthe language isn’t swift.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1926.48,1929.7"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/648","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So I was just wondering what --","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1929.7,1931.04"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/649","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"do you remember\nany lines of Milarepa","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1931.04,1935.85"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/650","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that have that kind of jump\nthat a haiku has?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1935.85,1938.1"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/651","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Well, I think\nMilarepa’s songs very folksy.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1938.1,1943.91"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/652","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"It’s not supposed to be\na work of scholar,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1943.91,1947.12"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/653","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"particularly, scholar-poet.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1947.12,1949.92"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/654","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So therefore it is, in fact,\nalmost a conversation in verse,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1949.92,1955.8"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/655","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and a lot of little humors\nand directness.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1956.42,1965.24"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/656","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Like when he was talking\nto the logicians, he said,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1965.24,1968.62"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/657","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\"I never had\na stew of logic.\"","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1968.62,1976.28"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/658","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"In Tibetan,\nit’s a play on the word.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1976.28,1981.03"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/659","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\"Tsema\" is \"logic\",\n\"tsoma\" is \"stew.\"","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1981.03,1984.67"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/660","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So, \"I never had\ntsoma of tsema.\"","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1984.67,1986.59"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/661","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So things like that, I think\nmissed in English translation,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1986.59,1990.67"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/662","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"but there is--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1990.67,1991.98"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/663","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"ALLEN GINSBERG: Do you have\na lot of that in Tibetan?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1991.98,1993.28"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/664","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"The pun?\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\nQuite a lot.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1993.28,1995.75"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/665","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"ALLEN GINSBERG: Or near puns?\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Think so.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=1995.75,2000.38"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/666","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"ALLEN GINSBERG:\nA couple of hands there.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2003.37,2006.86"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/667","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER6: Well recently,\nresearching something,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2012.29,2016.11"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/668","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I found out that\nthe Tibetan word for \"writer\"","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2016.11,2018.45"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/669","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"is,\nI think, \"shinggi sibu\".","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2018.45,2020.71"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/670","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: What?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2020.71,2022.06"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/671","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER6:\nThe Tibetan word for \"writer\",","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2022.06,2023.43"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/672","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I found in a dictionary,\nwas \"shinggi sibu\"..","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2023.43,2027.74"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/673","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And it said that\nthe same word also meant","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2027.74,2030.41"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/674","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\"wood-eating moth or worm\".","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2030.41,2034.31"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/675","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Could either of you\nelaborate on that?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2034.31,2036.71"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/676","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"[Laughter]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2036.71,2038.48"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/677","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\nWell, what dictionary is that?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2038.48,2041.59"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/678","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER6: In the Naropa library.\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Oh yeah?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2041.59,2044.03"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/679","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Do you remember the author\nof the dictionary?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2044.03,2048.01"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/680","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER6: No.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2048.01,2050.28"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/681","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: I’m sorry,\nI can’t understand your Tibetan.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2050.28,2052.6"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/682","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"[Laughter; laughs]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2052.6,2055.78"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/683","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"A \"rider\" is\n[UNCLEAR TIBETAN: chibs pa?]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2055.78,2058.98"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/684","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"or sometimes \"ta-pa,\"","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2058.98,2061.05"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/685","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"which means a \"horseman\",\n\"rider\".","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2061.05,2064.91"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/686","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER6:\nNo, writer as in poet, or--\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Writer.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2064.91,2068.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/687","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER6:\nMhmm. The \"shinggi sibu\".","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2068.0,2071.92"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/688","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\nOh. [Laughter; laughs] Well...\n[Laughter]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2071.92,2079.5"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/689","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"ALLEN GINSBERG: Blank.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2079.5,2081.66"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/690","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"ALLEN GINSBERG:\nGregory, you got any questions?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2082.53,2084.5"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/691","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"GREGORY CORSO:\nNope, no questions.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2084.5,2085.89"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/692","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Oh yeah, one, one.\nLast night--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2085.89,2088.38"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/693","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\nI wasn't there last night.\n[Laughs]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2088.38,2090.96"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/694","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"GREGORY CORSO:\nLast night he","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2090.96,2092.22"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/695","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"[the Vajra Regent Osel Tendzin]\nwas vajrayana.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2092.22,2093.6"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/696","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Oh yeah?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2093.6,2094.8"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/697","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"GREGORY CORSO:\nOh, it was a big crowd there,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2094.8,2096.31"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/698","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and I don't think\nmuch of the crowd","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2096.31,2097.99"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/699","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"thought he was in vajrayana.\nWas this crazy wisdom, right?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2097.99,2103.38"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/700","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Was he crazy wisdom, Allen?\nDon't look at him, look at me--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2103.38,2105.79"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/701","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"ALLEN GINSBERG:\nYeah, I would say so.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2105.79,2106.99"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/702","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"GREGORY CORSO:\nHe was crazy wisdom, right.\n[Laughter]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2106.99,2110.05"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/703","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So, he was a little\nsmashed and a little drunk.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2110.05,2111.75"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/704","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And ones who could\nnot understand it","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2111.75,2115.47"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/705","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"when he told somebody to shut\nthe fuck up and all that;","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2115.47,2117.79"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/706","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"you might have thought,\n\"Wow, how crude\" or something.\n[Laughter]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2117.79,2124.785"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/707","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"It was a real funny,\nawkward evening last night.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2124.785,2127.96"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/708","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"He held on to one guy\nwho he told to get out,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2127.96,2131.03"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/709","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"[INAUDIBLE]\nhimself, all that, to get out,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2131.03,2134.85"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/710","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"but then took him back again.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2134.85,2137.31"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/711","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"This guy didn't know\nwhat was going on.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2137.31,2140.69"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/712","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"But he had already told it--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2141.49,2143.12"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/713","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Osel already told it\nin his lecture.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2143.12,2145.6"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/714","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"This only happened\nin the question period,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2145.6,2147.51"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/715","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"where he let himself go.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2147.51,2149.8"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/716","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"The whole lecture,\nvery straight,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2149.8,2151.85"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/717","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"but the question period,\na big tumbling act.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2151.85,2154.74"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/718","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Did you know about that?\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Now I know.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2154.74,2157.31"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/719","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"GREGORY CORSO:\nHow do you think he handled it","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2157.31,2158.54"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/720","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"even though you weren't there?\nDid you hear about it?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2158.54,2159.95"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/721","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: I don't know.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2159.95,2161.16"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/722","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"GREGORY CORSO: Is that his first\nshot at vajrayana teaching?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2161.16,2162.69"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/723","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"[Laughter]\nALLEN GINSBERG: No, [INAUDIBLE].","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2162.69,2163.9"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/724","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"GREGORY CORSO:\nIt was the first time\nI saw him like that.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2163.9,2168.34"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/725","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"ALLEN GINSBERG: No, he's taught\nvajrayana before.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2168.34,2171.19"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/726","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"He's experienced.\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: [Laughs]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2171.19,2175.01"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/727","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"GREGORY CORSO:\nThat's [UNCLEAR: my smart ass?].","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2175.01,2178.14"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/728","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"ALLEN GINSBERG: Anne, you got\nanything on your mind?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2178.97,2180.65"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/729","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"ANNE WALDMAN: I thought maybe\nRinpoche would say","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2180.65,2181.89"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/730","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"something about the eleven--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2181.89,2183.81"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/731","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I think it's eleven syllable\nlines in Tibetan poetics.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2183.81,2186.76"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/732","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\nEighteen, yeah.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2186.76,2188.77"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/733","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"ANNE WALDMAN:\nJust something about the forms,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2188.77,2190.16"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/734","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"some of the forms\nof Tibetan poetics,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2190.16,2192.82"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/735","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"just for general interest.\nOr maybe you could read.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2192.82,2197.43"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/736","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Maybe you could recite\nsome lines","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2197.43,2199.56"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/737","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"so we could hear\nhow it sounds in Tibetan,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2199.56,2203.81"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/738","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"some formal lines that have this\nstructure, syllabic structure.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2203.81,2208.51"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/739","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\nWell, actually,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2208.51,2211.99"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/740","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"each single line of that type\nhas the precisely same thing","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2211.99,2217.83"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/741","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"we've been discussing\nabout the threefold logic.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2217.83,2222.15"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/742","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"ALLEN GINSBERG:\nEach line is supposed to have?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2222.15,2223.53"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/743","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\nYeah, each line has...","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2223.53,2226.36"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/744","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"ANNE WALDMAN:\nSo it has three things\nhappening in each line?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2230.67,2233.71"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/745","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Yes.\nUsually three, three situations.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2233.71,2238.09"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/746","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"ANNE WALDMAN: It's almost like\na braiding technique.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2238.09,2240.479"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/747","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"You know, making a braid\n[INAUDIBLE] .","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2240.479,2241.45"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/748","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\nYes, well--\nALLEN GINSBERG: Braiding.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2241.45,2243.89"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/749","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\n--if you have the whole poetry,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2243.89,2246.11"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/750","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"you might have twenty of them,\ntwenty eighteen-syllable lines.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2246.11,2252.13"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/751","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And the first one is three--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2252.13,2254.76"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/752","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"the very first one\nis three, obviously,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2254.76,2257.87"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/753","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and which is preparing\nthe ground for the rest of it.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2257.87,2261.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/754","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And so in the middle\nit's sort of middle","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2261.0,2263.43"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/755","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"but still having\nthreefold logics.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2263.43,2265.92"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/756","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And then at the end also\nstill continuing same imagery --","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2265.92,2270.21"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/757","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"there are lot of images.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2270.21,2272.23"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/758","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And finish, the final conclusion\nis also threefold logic style","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2272.23,2279.03"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/759","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"which concludes the line.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2279.03,2283.27"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/760","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"ANNE WALDMAN:\nIs twenty lines take the form--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2283.27,2285.89"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/761","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Yes.\nANNE WALDMAN:\n--as the first line?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2285.89,2288.43"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/762","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\nSometimes, yes. Or thirty.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2288.43,2291.05"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/763","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"On each line begins\nwith a letter of the alphabet.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2291.05,2294.56"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/764","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"ANNE WALDMAN: Oh.\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\nCould be, yeah.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2294.56,2297.44"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/765","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"ALLEN GINSBERG:\nYou've written like that?\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Hmm?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2297.44,2298.94"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/766","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"ALLEN GINSBERG:\nHave you written like that?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2298.94,2300.15"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/767","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\nMany of them.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2300.15,2301.42"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/768","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"ALLEN GINSBERG: Yeah.\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: [Laughs] Yeah.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2301.42,2302.86"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/769","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"ALLEN GINSBERG: What's the--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2302.86,2304.09"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/770","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\nSorry, we don't have","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2304.09,2305.46"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/771","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"any translation of it.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2305.46,2306.97"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/772","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"ALLEN GINSBERG: Yeah.\nBut there's the long, long line.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2306.97,2309.59"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/773","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"What is it?\nTwenty-eight syllables?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2309.59,2310.93"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/774","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Is that the longest?\nI've forgotten now.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2310.93,2312.51"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/775","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\nThat's very long.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2312.51,2313.76"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/776","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"That's usually\nactually translation","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2313.76,2315.32"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/777","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"from the Sanskrit\npoetries same time.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2315.32,2318.58"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/778","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"ALLEN GINSBERG:\nWhat's the longest line","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2318.58,2319.97"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/779","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"natural in Tibetan?\nFor instance--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2319.97,2321.64"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/780","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\nNaturally seven or eight--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2321.64,2322.96"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/781","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"ALLEN GINSBERG:\nSeven is the standard.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2322.96,2324.18"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/782","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\n--nine. Yeah.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2324.18,2325.38"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/783","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Da da, da da,\nda da, da da, da.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2325.38,2326.63"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/784","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"ALLEN GINSBERG: Da da, da da,\nda da, da da, da?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2326.63,2330.52"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/785","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Yeah.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2330.52,2331.77"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/786","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"ALLEN GINSBERG:\nSo you got that one extra\nfor an emphasis at the end?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2331.77,2334.98"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/787","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\nYeah. Obviously, yeah.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2334.98,2336.6"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/788","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"ALLEN GINSBERG:\nIs there a rise in voice --\nare there tones? Tones--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2336.6,2339.21"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/789","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\nYou make a refer-- you make\nemphasis on the last.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2339.21,2342.39"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/790","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"ALLEN GINSBERG: Yeah.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2342.39,2344.23"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/791","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\nOr sometimes seven.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2344.23,2346.09"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/792","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"ALLEN GINSBERG: Mhmm.\nSo there would be an upbeat.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2346.09,2348.51"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/793","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\nda, da da, da da, *da*. Yeah.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2348.51,2349.87"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/794","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"ALLEN GINSBERG: Yeah.\nAre there also different pitches","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2349.87,2352.5"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/795","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"as in Chinese and Greek?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2352.5,2354.64"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/796","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\nSort of. It's very hard--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2354.64,2356.94"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/797","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"ALLEN GINSBERG:\nIt's not schematic?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2356.94,2358.18"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/798","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\nYeah, not as much\nas Chinese, no.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2358.18,2361.85"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/799","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"ALLEN GINSBERG: Yeah.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2361.85,2364.854"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/800","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"ANNE WALDMAN: Also, I was going\nto ask about the puns.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2364.88,2366.61"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/801","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Are they sort of\nordinary folk speech words,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2366.61,2371.66"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/802","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and then also dharma words?\nIs that the...","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2371.66,2374.49"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/803","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\nSometimes we have","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2374.49,2375.75"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/804","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"what's known as synonyms,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2375.75,2377.0"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/805","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"which is comes\nfrom the Mahabharat text,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2377.0,2380.55"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/806","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and the Indian poetry that...\nLike sun, for instance,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2380.55,2385.85"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/807","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"had something like\ntwenty synonyms for sun.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2385.85,2390.52"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/808","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So poets use those synonyms","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2390.52,2392.41"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/809","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"instead of saying\nthe real thing.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2392.41,2394.28"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/810","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Then you could develop\npuns out of those too,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2394.28,2396.8"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/811","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"by using two synonyms\ntogether.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2396.8,2399.2"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/812","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"One word for maybe for sun\n[INAUDIBLE] , another for moon.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2399.2,2403.08"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/813","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And using those as synonyms\nand also develops puns.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2403.08,2409.44"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/814","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And there is a particular\ntype of poetry","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2409.44,2414.13"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/815","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"which is based on kind of...","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2414.13,2418.78"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/816","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"sort of --\nwhat's the word for it?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2421.46,2426.39"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/817","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Sarcastic...\nALLEN GINSBERG: Satire.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2426.39,2429.76"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/818","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Satire, yeah.\nWhich actually use more puns,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2429.76,2433.89"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/819","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"because puns are more\neffective that way.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2433.89,2437.29"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/820","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And sometimes\nalso encouragement,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2437.29,2439.49"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/821","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"like encouragement\nof renunciation, devotion.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2439.49,2443.27"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/822","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"You have another set\nof different kind of puns","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2443.27,2445.44"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/823","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"which are gentle\nand which makes you smile","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2445.44,2448.67"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/824","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and so that it inspires\nyou further.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2448.67,2453.83"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/825","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"That the message\ndoesn't become too heavy.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2453.83,2457.9"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/826","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"ALLEN GINSBERG:\nTom Veitch is teaching.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2459.3,2460.94"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/827","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"You got anything on your mind?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2460.94,2463.88"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/828","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Or Bobbie Louise\n[Hawkins] ?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2463.88,2467.32"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/829","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER7:\nI was wondering, in Tibet","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2467.32,2468.84"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/830","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"if most of the poetry is--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2468.84,2470.82"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/831","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"ALLEN GINSBERG: Somebody take\nthe microphone over, please.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2470.82,2472.4"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/832","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"AUDIENCE: It's over there.\nALLEN GINSBERG: Oh.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2472.4,2475.91"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/833","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER7:\nIf in Tibet most of the poetry","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2481.14,2483.17"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/834","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"is accessible to everybody,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2483.17,2485.23"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/835","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"or if it's written\nby upper class people","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2485.23,2489.38"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/836","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"for upper class people,\nor if it's all of the above.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2489.38,2492.92"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/837","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Is it written\nfor the common man?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2492.92,2494.98"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/838","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Can everybody understand\nthe poetry there?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2494.98,2497.6"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/839","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\nWell, anybody who can read.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2497.6,2502.24"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/840","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER7: Who can read.\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\nWho can read, yes.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2502.24,2505.09"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/841","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Well we have problems\nwith the peasant people","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2505.09,2507.6"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/842","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"who had never taught reading\nor writing at all.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2507.6,2510.55"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/843","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So sometimes they have proverbs\nthat be handed down,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2510.55,2514.72"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/844","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"which they use in their speech.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2514.72,2517.02"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/845","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Like if a peasant person\ncomes to court case,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2517.02,2521.04"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/846","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and you have to learn\na special language","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2521.04,2522.84"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/847","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"which is successive quotations,\nmaybe every other sentence,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2522.84,2527.32"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/848","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"you have images put together\nwhich is an art in itself.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2527.32,2532.04"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/849","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"But at the written poetry,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2532.04,2534.55"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/850","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"well it's just written\nfor anybody who can read.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2534.55,2536.42"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/851","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"There's no class\nof literature particularly.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2536.42,2538.75"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/852","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Once you have\nliterature developed,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2538.75,2540.15"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/853","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"it is just for anybody\nwho can read.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2540.15,2543.81"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/854","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER8:\nHello.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2553.28,2555.17"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/855","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Do you complete\nyour poetry in your mind","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2555.17,2557.9"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/856","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"before you write it\nor paint it,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2557.9,2560.24"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/857","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"or do you...\npaint spontaneously?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2560.24,2565.4"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/858","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\nWell usually what happens is --","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2565.4,2567.17"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/859","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"this also traditional\none as well --","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2567.17,2570.08"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/860","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"is that you have the very vivid\nsound ringing in your ear","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2570.08,2574.57"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/861","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"almost, in your mind\nof the first line is very vivid.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2574.57,2577.96"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/862","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"That's the opener.\nAnd once you write down","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2577.96,2580.15"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/863","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that then everything becomes\nunfolding from that.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2580.15,2583.41"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/864","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And I usually work that way.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2583.41,2585.37"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/865","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"ALLEN GINSBERG:\nThat's pretty common,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2585.37,2586.62"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/866","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"in American poetry too.\nThe one line arrives--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2586.62,2588.5"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/867","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Yeah.\nOne first line is very vivid,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2588.5,2590.94"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/868","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"so that carries\nthe whole thing.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2590.94,2592.47"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/869","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Although the topic might\nchange in halfway through,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2592.47,2594.54"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/870","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"but still some kind of energy\nis carried out.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2594.54,2599.01"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/871","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"ALLEN GINSBERG: Behind you.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2601.56,2603.98"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/872","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER9: It occurred to me\nthat the sadhana that you wrote","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2608.28,2611.39"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/873","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and is recited at Karma Dzong\n[the Sadhana of Mahamudra]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2611.39,2613.845"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/874","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"is a very good example","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2613.845,2614.77"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/875","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"of what we've been\ndiscussing of the form.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2614.77,2618.61"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/876","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And I wondered\nif that was accurate?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2618.61,2621.62"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/877","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: I think so.\nWell, we don't call it poetry","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2621.62,2623.77"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/878","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"because this is different class\nof literature altogether.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2623.77,2626.63"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/879","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"But it could be regarded\nas that style.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2626.63,2629.81"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/880","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And when I wrote,\nit took about two days","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2629.81,2631.85"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/881","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"to finish the whole thing.\nAnd I wrote extremely fast","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2631.85,2635.01"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/882","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and didn't get chance to think\nabout it very much.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2635.01,2639.04"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/883","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And it's very spontaneous.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2639.04,2640.91"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/884","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER9: And on the spot.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2640.91,2642.16"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/885","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"This-- you wrote it\nin the Himalayas? Is that--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2642.16,2644.51"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/886","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\nIn Bhutan, yes.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2644.51,2647.29"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/887","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER9: Wasn't in English.\n[Laughs]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2647.84,2649.74"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/888","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Tibetan.\n[Laughs]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2649.74,2655.095"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/889","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER10:\nI'm still kind of unclear","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2666.28,2668.81"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/890","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"as the distinction","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2668.81,2670.03"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/891","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"you're making between\nvajrayana and mahayana poetry.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2670.03,2673.82"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/892","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Could you elaborate\na little further please?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2673.82,2677.85"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/893","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\nWell, mahayana poetry","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2680.21,2683.2"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/894","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"is generally more connected\nwith performance","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2683.2,2695.84"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/895","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"of one's deed according to\nthe various bodhisattva paths","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2695.84,2701.72"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/896","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and vow and commitment\nof that kind inspired by notion","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2701.72,2706.24"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/897","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"of compassion and development\nof loving kindness to oneself,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2706.24,2713.15"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/898","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and that kind of approach.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2713.15,2715.74"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/899","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"In the vajrayana,\nit is much more immediate.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2715.74,2719.78"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/900","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"A lot of the poetry\nin vajrayana poetry","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2719.78,2721.89"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/901","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"is written dedicated\nto their vajra master,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2721.89,2726.51"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/902","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and longing\nfor the vajra master,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2726.51,2728.15"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/903","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and devotion\nto the vajra master.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2728.15,2730.51"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/904","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And also beyond that,\npersonal experience","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2730.51,2733.29"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/905","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"of how that particular person\nhad actually able to see","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2733.29,2736.97"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/906","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"the glimpse of enlightenment\nclearly, vividly.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2736.97,2741.36"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/907","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So poetry is that style.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2741.36,2746.65"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/908","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"ALLEN GINSBERG: And--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2746.65,2747.88"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/909","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\nWhich is much more expressing","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2747.88,2750.18"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/910","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"the sense of magic exist in it,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2750.18,2753.26"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/911","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"rather than just\ngeneral conduct level","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2753.26,2755.72"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/912","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"which is mahayana approach.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2755.72,2757.96"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/913","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER10:\nMahayana is more for conduct\nthan magic?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2757.96,2761.57"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/914","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\nYes, it's almost similar to","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2761.57,2764.95"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/915","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Christian hymns\nin some sense,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2764.95,2766.51"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/916","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"you know,\nthat kind of approach.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2766.51,2769.87"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/917","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"ALLEN GINSBERG:\nAnd the proclamation part is a--\nis that--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2770.5,2774.615"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/918","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: A realization,\nyeah. Realization.\nALLEN GINSBERG: A realization.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2774.615,2775.68"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/919","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And the example is a\nrealization.\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Yes, mhmm.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2775.68,2779.86"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/920","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"ALLEN GINSBERG: There's a hand\nthere and a hand there.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2783.36,2786.15"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/921","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So will somebody pick up\nthe microphone, please?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2786.15,2789.11"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/922","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Pass it on.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2789.11,2791.56"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/923","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER11:\nIn this class,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2802.79,2804.12"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/924","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Allen has been trying\nto make a connection","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2804.12,2806.85"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/925","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"with different styles\nof American and Western poetry","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2806.85,2812.69"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/926","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"in different stages\non the Buddhist path,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2812.69,2816.49"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/927","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"hinayana, mahayana,\nvajrayana, in different --","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2816.49,2818.95"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/928","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"we've been dealing with\ndifferent poets,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2818.95,2823.47"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/929","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"American poets, from one\nof those points of view.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2823.47,2826.99"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/930","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I'd like to ask you\nif you think","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2826.99,2830.16"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/931","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that there is a vajrayana\nAmerican poetry;","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2830.16,2834.63"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/932","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and if so,\nwho might be doing it?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2834.63,2838.48"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/933","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\nWell it's very hard to say.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2840.05,2843.31"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/934","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Maybe Allen himself [laughs]\nis the closest one I suppose.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2843.31,2849.9"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/935","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"ALLEN GINSBERG:\nYeah, to the extent that I've","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2849.9,2851.76"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/936","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"occasionally tried to express\nsome experience of change","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2851.76,2856.26"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/937","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"or opening of mind in a poem,\nand trying to find a form","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2856.26,2858.83"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/938","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"which is clear enough\nfor other people to understand.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2858.83,2861.85"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/939","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"It would fit into\nthe description given,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2861.85,2863.44"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/940","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"[UNCLEAR: who were?]\naware of it.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2863.44,2864.75"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/941","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER11: Okay, what about\nthe people that you're using,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2864.75,2867.29"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/942","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"you're teaching, you're using\nas examples of vajrayana poetry?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2867.29,2870.22"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/943","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"How do they fit into that?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2870.22,2871.78"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/944","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"ALLEN GINSBERG: Well at the\nseminary where I taught,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2871.78,2873.55"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/945","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"where there were a lot\nof experienced sitters,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2873.55,2875.49"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/946","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"as examples of vajrayana,\nthere was some Blake,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2875.49,2878.99"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/947","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I used some\nof Rinpoche's poetry.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2878.99,2881.79"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/948","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And I also used\nGregory Corso's \"Bomb\"","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2881.79,2884.37"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/949","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"from the point of view\nthat in vajrayana there,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2884.37,2886.94"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/950","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"as I understood it,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2886.94,2888.27"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/951","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"there was a sort of\nalchemical transformation,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2888.27,2890.79"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/952","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"or a transformation of poison\nto nectar of anxiety","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2890.79,2897.18"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/953","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and fear\nto liberation and humor.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2897.18,2900.872"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/954","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER11:\nDo you know that poem, Rinpoche?\nExcuse me.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2900.872,2902.06"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/955","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"ALLEN GINSBERG: And so I feel --\nif you'll let me finish.\nI used the--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2902.06,2903.885"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/956","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER11: Do you know the poem?\nALLEN GINSBERG:\nWait a minute!","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2903.885,2905.74"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/957","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So I used the poem \"Bomb\"\nin -- do you know that?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2905.74,2909.14"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/958","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"By Gregory [Corso]?\nThere's a poem \"Bomb\"\nwhich says,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2909.14,2913.52"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/959","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\"Let me in Bomb","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2913.52,2916.66"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/960","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"rise from the pregnant-rat\ncorner / of the world /","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2916.66,2922.49"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/961","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"O Bomb I love you / I want\nto kiss your clank","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2922.49,2926.54"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/962","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"eat your boom / You are\nan acme of scream /","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2926.54,2931.54"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/963","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"a lyric hat of Mister Thunder\"","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2931.54,2935.12"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/964","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And I thought those lines were,\nat least, vajrayana style.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2935.12,2938.34"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/965","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Does that make sense?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2938.34,2940.04"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/966","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Style.\n[Laughter; laughs]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2940.04,2944.9"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/967","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"ALLEN GINSBERG:\nActually to the extent","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2944.9,2946.13"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/968","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that it took\nthe impacted anxiety","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2946.13,2949.64"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/969","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and moralistic psychology\nprevalent of the time","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2949.64,2955.37"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/970","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and switched it around\nand opened it up.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2955.37,2957.63"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/971","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I thought actually--\nif that's what vajrayana is,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2957.63,2960.05"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/972","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"it did that job.\nAnd penetrated right through.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2960.05,2963.43"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/973","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"See, Gregory and I\nwent to Oxford,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2963.43,2965.21"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/974","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and he read the poem.\nAnd Bertrand Russell's group","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2965.21,2968.76"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/975","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"were very moralistic\nabout the Bomb.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2968.76,2970.24"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/976","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Threw a shoe at him,\nthinking that he was a prick,\nthinking that--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2970.24,2973.23"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/977","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"GREGORY CORSO: [INAUDIBLE WORDS]\nthe shoe!\n[Laughter]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2973.23,2977.305"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/978","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: [Laughs]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2977.305,2980.96"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/979","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"GREGORY CORSO:\nWhat comes after vajrayana?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2980.96,2983.3"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/980","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: What?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2983.3,2984.59"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/981","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"ALLEN GINSBERG:\nWhat comes after vajrayana?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2984.59,2986.42"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/982","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: [Laughs]\nNothing.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2986.42,2987.89"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/983","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"GREGORY CORSO: Nothing.\n[Laughter]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2987.89,2991.97"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/984","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"ALLEN GINSBERG:\nCould we pass the mic?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=2991.97,3001.232"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/985","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: [Whispering]\nWhat time should we stop it?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=3001.232,3003.41"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/986","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"ALLEN GINSBERG: [Whispering]\nOh, my class was","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=3003.41,3004.81"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/987","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"over half an hour ago.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=3004.81,3007.32"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/988","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Mhmm.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=3007.32,3008.8"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/989","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"ALLEN GINSBERG:\nThe time, formal time.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=3008.8,3011.28"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/990","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Okay.\nSure, last question then.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=3011.28,3013.84"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/991","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER12: Rinpoche, could you\nexplain the connection","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=3013.84,3016.58"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/992","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"between poetry\nand right speech?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=3016.58,3019.21"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/993","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Since right speech\nis one of the paths","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=3019.21,3023.1"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/994","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"on the noble eightfold path?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=3023.1,3026.32"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/995","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Well, I'm sure\nthere are lot of connections.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=3027.08,3030.27"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/996","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"In fact, as we hear\nthe stories of Buddha,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=3030.27,3040.41"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/997","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"when he gave a sermon\nto people,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=3041.23,3046.34"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/998","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"he was presented in such way\nthat even though","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=3048.53,3052.51"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/999","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"people had\ntheir psychological blockages,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=3052.51,3057.6"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/1000","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"but they cannot help\nnot listening to him.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=3057.6,3061.19"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/1001","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And once they begin\nto listen to him,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=3061.19,3062.81"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/1002","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"begin to make sense\nto him--to them.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=3062.81,3065.04"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/1003","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And when it made sense to them,\nnot helping liberating them.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=3065.04,3069.96"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/1004","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So I think this is our goal,\nin some sense, of poetics","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=3069.96,3074.34"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/1005","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"is to develop that kind of\nlarger version of there","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=3074.34,3078.57"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/1006","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"has to have some\nkind of motivation","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=3078.57,3080.13"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/1007","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"as to how we going to at least\nto create order in the universe","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=3080.13,3088.41"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/1008","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"by means of speech, poetry.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=3088.41,3090.66"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/1009","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"That seem to be our objectives,\nactually, altogether.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=3090.66,3094.59"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/1010","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"ALLEN GINSBERG:\nThe American interpretation\nof that","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=3094.59,3096.86"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/1011","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"was precision in speech.\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Mhmm.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=3096.86,3099.06"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/1012","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"ALLEN GINSBERG:\nBeing-- accuracy and precision.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=3099.06,3100.44"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/1013","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"That if you are accurate to\ndirect treatment of the object","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=3100.44,3103.69"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/1014","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and accurate to your own\nfrank mind, natural mind,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=3103.69,3107.52"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/1015","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"then that would lead\nto some opening of awareness.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=3107.52,3111.88"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/1016","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So \"precision\" and \"accuracy\"\nare words you use","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=3113.62,3116.305"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/1017","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"in relation to perception.\nTRUNGPA RINPOCHE: Mhmm, mhmm.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=3116.305,3118.82"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/1018","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"ALLEN GINSBERG:\nWell, thank you for coming.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=3118.82,3120.08"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/1019","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\nWell, thank you very much.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=3120.08,3121.28"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/1020","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"ALLEN GINSBERG:\nIt was nice and calm.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=3121.28,3122.57"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/1021","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TRUNGPA RINPOCHE:\nWell, I hope you can work,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=3122.57,3125.03"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/1022","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"write.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=3125.03,3126.65"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/1023","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Better write good ones.\n[Laughter] Thank you.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=3126.65,3131.15"},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615/annotation/1024","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"ALLEN GINSBERG:\nThank you.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932#t=3131.15,3137.09"}]},{"id":"https://cti.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1943/collection_resources/76177/file/168932/transcript/40615","type":"AnnotationPage","label":{"en":["English 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